Plea to Devs from a longtime user

jameslacy8 · 02-24-2021, 07:02 PM

I have been playing OOTP games for over 10 years. I love GM games. I love the depth that OOTP has added year to year to both Out of the Park and Franchise Hockey Manager since its inception, and I love that the developers have always given great support to their games. Hockey being my favorite sport I was thrilled to see FHM come to fruition and grow. As you can see I am not a very vocal member in these forums. In 8 years or so I have made 30 posts, but I know I was playing OOTP before 2010.

I have grown an addiction to GM games over the years. My biggest addiction now is to online leagues. Currently, I am in 4 online leagues in FHM and 2 in OOTP. I have since branched out and begun doing online leagues in football (American) and considering other sports as well with games that will remain unnamed here. And I am not comparing OOTP to them.

But it seems that OOTP does not make its online league components a priority. It is definitely not completely ignored, and the fact that is even exists, you have my undying gratitude. The devs have been kind enough at times to fix files for one of my leagues, so I know it is not completely ignored and they were very kind to do so.

I do not pretend to know the complexities behind the developers work to make their games better with patching and fixes, and I know a large portion of their users may not even participate in online leagues. And I do not pretend to know what OOTP should place their focus on as developers.

I know being in online leagues in these games I am definitely and version to version buy no question. I love the communities I am involved in as I have gotten to know other players and developed friendships with many people. There are many bugs that pop up that hamper play in these leagues at times, sometimes making them unplayable, but I will never stop playing them. My addiction is just too real. Perhaps the number of bugs is just too overwhelming for developers to get to everything and it is impossible to address. I do not know.

My plea is if it is not a priority to fix online league issues that this please be reconsidered. We are a loyal base of fans and community that would be very grateful. I hope this post comes across with the spirit with which I made it. I mean no disrespect to anyone and am grateful for all the work the developers have done on their games.

And if you are reading this and have not tried online leagues you are really missing out.

RchW · 02-24-2021, 07:14 PM

Well done and well said.

Adam B · 02-24-2021, 07:20 PM

We have a fairly large update coming that will address some issues and add some new gameplay features as well. We do our best to address everything we can, but as I've said before and I will always say, we can only fix what we know about. We do rely on our testers and our community to inform us if they run into issues. Just myself alone, my steam version has now ran over a thousand hours of gameplay. I can't even fathom what Jeff, Sebastian or Malte are at.that being said, that doesn't mean that I see everything or that they do as well. Sometimes it's very tough to replicate things or it's simply doesn't happen in your game.

So if you see something, please report it into the bug section. We may need to see a save, we may need to talk to the commissioner, etc.

jameslacy8 · 02-24-2021, 09:21 PM

Thank you Adam for your prompt response. I know my commissioners have submitted files from time to time. It seems the stability of FHM 7 of late has been in question more than it had been in FHM 6, problems cropping up with things like draft orders, or draft picks straight up disappearing in tests. Perhaps that adds frustration since they are new. Hopefully the next update will address many of those issues already reported.

The other overall problem and complaint I hear in leagues aside from those bugs is functionality of online leagues in FHM 7 compared to OOTP. Things such as how files have to be put out and downloaded, unable to do many things in game placing more work on the commish as opposed to OOTP and such. I would assume that may have to do with the fact that OOTP has been in development 3 times as long as FHM and you probably cannot just bring FHM up to that level as easily and many would assume. That said I can't wait for FHM 22 in 15 years!

Thank you for taking the time to respond to my post

DrunkenTeddy · 02-25-2021, 12:54 PM

I think one thing to consider is that a lot of the problems people have with online leagues aren't really bugs, or if they are they've been ignored since fhm 5, I'll list a few here just for clarity sake:
- The game is unable to upload or download league files, as mentioned by james above.
- The lineups feature that came out in FHM 6 was meant to improve a major issue in online leagues (the commissioner having to manually fix lineups for injuries), but since players have to hand their tactics control over to the cpu in order to use it, it just doesn't get used. This isn't a bug, more like a design decision that negatively impacts online leagues.
- Similar to that individual GMs can't offer jobs to staff in game, they have to get the commissioner to do it.

There have been a lot of improvements to online leagues since FHM5, but it can seem sometimes like the biggest issues aren't really being addressed and I think that's where this post is coming from.

berthelj · 02-25-2021, 02:46 PM

I have a few suggestions myself!! Love this game and thanks Jeff for your incredible work and passion to this. I love this type of game and its been a pleasure watching it grow!

Now as for a few upgrade suggestions;

1. Finding a way to keep every season in viewing history with the Accurate team / logos / jerseys. This is for when going back into league history and clicking a specific year in the past within the game save.

Example, I relocated (changed the team name, location, etc) a team and now when I go back to look in history it shows the right team name but keeps the jersey and logo of its current state. Finding a way to archive that team for that year would be fantastic and add a layer of depth!

2. Adjustable ticket prices, concessions, building new arenas, adjusting both Player and Staff budget

Not much to say here other than giving players a sense of owner ship of their team and how it performs financially is an amazing tool! Currently you can adjust player budget but staff budget is not adjustable.

This makes for weird games, creating a custom with historical finances on, in a start say 1940, Player salaries are roughly 150000 salary averages with team budgets of 425 000. The staff meanwhile have budgets of 700-900 K. With GM's making 2,000 and assistant cauches 100K.

3. Adjustable draft selections (posted in bugs so i wont elaborate)

4. Easier adjustments for setting teams up like choosing colours. its highly annoying having to click ok all the time when changing colours. Should be easier and quick and convenient!

5. Ability to add leagues & Tournaments within a save as well as add teams within the leagues (currently cannot add any junior teams in a custom set up)

6. Keep up the great work this game is turning into a beauty!

jameslacy8 · 02-26-2021, 12:43 PM

One issue I would add in one of my leagues is that the AHL is sending all my good prospects down to ECHL level and signing players worse than them to play. Even if you release people and put them back they still do it. Right now I have an NHL ready Defenseman with no room for him at NHL level and is down in ECHL because they keep moving him

02-24-2021, 07:02 PM	#1
jameslacy8 Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 52	Plea to Devs from a longtime user I have been playing OOTP games for over 10 years. I love GM games. I love the depth that OOTP has added year to year to both Out of the Park and Franchise Hockey Manager since its inception, and I love that the developers have always given great support to their games. Hockey being my favorite sport I was thrilled to see FHM come to fruition and grow. As you can see I am not a very vocal member in these forums. In 8 years or so I have made 30 posts, but I know I was playing OOTP before 2010. I have grown an addiction to GM games over the years. My biggest addiction now is to online leagues. Currently, I am in 4 online leagues in FHM and 2 in OOTP. I have since branched out and begun doing online leagues in football (American) and considering other sports as well with games that will remain unnamed here. And I am not comparing OOTP to them. But it seems that OOTP does not make its online league components a priority. It is definitely not completely ignored, and the fact that is even exists, you have my undying gratitude. The devs have been kind enough at times to fix files for one of my leagues, so I know it is not completely ignored and they were very kind to do so. I do not pretend to know the complexities behind the developers work to make their games better with patching and fixes, and I know a large portion of their users may not even participate in online leagues. And I do not pretend to know what OOTP should place their focus on as developers. I know being in online leagues in these games I am definitely and version to version buy no question. I love the communities I am involved in as I have gotten to know other players and developed friendships with many people. There are many bugs that pop up that hamper play in these leagues at times, sometimes making them unplayable, but I will never stop playing them. My addiction is just too real. Perhaps the number of bugs is just too overwhelming for developers to get to everything and it is impossible to address. I do not know. My plea is if it is not a priority to fix online league issues that this please be reconsidered. We are a loyal base of fans and community that would be very grateful. I hope this post comes across with the spirit with which I made it. I mean no disrespect to anyone and am grateful for all the work the developers have done on their games. And if you are reading this and have not tried online leagues you are really missing out.

02-24-2021, 07:14 PM	#2
RchW Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto ON by way of Glasgow UK Posts: 15,629	Well done and well said. __________________ Cheers RichW If you’re looking for a good cause to donate money to please consider a Donation to Parkinson’s Canada. It may help me have a better future and if not me, someone else. Thanks. “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit

02-24-2021, 07:20 PM	#3
Adam B Hockey Community Manager Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: A Hockey Rink Posts: 2,616	We have a fairly large update coming that will address some issues and add some new gameplay features as well. We do our best to address everything we can, but as I've said before and I will always say, we can only fix what we know about. We do rely on our testers and our community to inform us if they run into issues. Just myself alone, my steam version has now ran over a thousand hours of gameplay. I can't even fathom what Jeff, Sebastian or Malte are at.that being said, that doesn't mean that I see everything or that they do as well. Sometimes it's very tough to replicate things or it's simply doesn't happen in your game. So if you see something, please report it into the bug section. We may need to see a save, we may need to talk to the commissioner, etc. Last edited by Adam B; 02-24-2021 at 07:21 PM.

02-24-2021, 09:21 PM	#4
jameslacy8 Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 52	Thank you Adam for your prompt response. I know my commissioners have submitted files from time to time. It seems the stability of FHM 7 of late has been in question more than it had been in FHM 6, problems cropping up with things like draft orders, or draft picks straight up disappearing in tests. Perhaps that adds frustration since they are new. Hopefully the next update will address many of those issues already reported. The other overall problem and complaint I hear in leagues aside from those bugs is functionality of online leagues in FHM 7 compared to OOTP. Things such as how files have to be put out and downloaded, unable to do many things in game placing more work on the commish as opposed to OOTP and such. I would assume that may have to do with the fact that OOTP has been in development 3 times as long as FHM and you probably cannot just bring FHM up to that level as easily and many would assume. That said I can't wait for FHM 22 in 15 years! Thank you for taking the time to respond to my post

02-25-2021, 12:54 PM	#5
DrunkenTeddy Major Leagues Join Date: Oct 2018 Location: Langley, BC Posts: 378	I think one thing to consider is that a lot of the problems people have with online leagues aren't really bugs, or if they are they've been ignored since fhm 5, I'll list a few here just for clarity sake: - The game is unable to upload or download league files, as mentioned by james above. - The lineups feature that came out in FHM 6 was meant to improve a major issue in online leagues (the commissioner having to manually fix lineups for injuries), but since players have to hand their tactics control over to the cpu in order to use it, it just doesn't get used. This isn't a bug, more like a design decision that negatively impacts online leagues. - Similar to that individual GMs can't offer jobs to staff in game, they have to get the commissioner to do it. There have been a lot of improvements to online leagues since FHM5, but it can seem sometimes like the biggest issues aren't really being addressed and I think that's where this post is coming from.

02-25-2021, 02:46 PM	#6
berthelj Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Feb 2021 Posts: 22	I have a few suggestions myself!! Love this game and thanks Jeff for your incredible work and passion to this. I love this type of game and its been a pleasure watching it grow! Now as for a few upgrade suggestions; 1. Finding a way to keep every season in viewing history with the Accurate team / logos / jerseys. This is for when going back into league history and clicking a specific year in the past within the game save. Example, I relocated (changed the team name, location, etc) a team and now when I go back to look in history it shows the right team name but keeps the jersey and logo of its current state. Finding a way to archive that team for that year would be fantastic and add a layer of depth! 2. Adjustable ticket prices, concessions, building new arenas, adjusting both Player and Staff budget Not much to say here other than giving players a sense of owner ship of their team and how it performs financially is an amazing tool! Currently you can adjust player budget but staff budget is not adjustable. This makes for weird games, creating a custom with historical finances on, in a start say 1940, Player salaries are roughly 150000 salary averages with team budgets of 425 000. The staff meanwhile have budgets of 700-900 K. With GM's making 2,000 and assistant cauches 100K. 3. Adjustable draft selections (posted in bugs so i wont elaborate) 4. Easier adjustments for setting teams up like choosing colours. its highly annoying having to click ok all the time when changing colours. Should be easier and quick and convenient! 5. Ability to add leagues & Tournaments within a save as well as add teams within the leagues (currently cannot add any junior teams in a custom set up) 6. Keep up the great work this game is turning into a beauty!

02-26-2021, 12:43 PM	#7
jameslacy8 Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 52	One issue I would add in one of my leagues is that the AHL is sending all my good prospects down to ECHL level and signing players worse than them to play. Even if you release people and put them back they still do it. Right now I have an NHL ready Defenseman with no room for him at NHL level and is down in ECHL because they keep moving him