Power Hitters

dasperp · 02-27-2002, 12:31 PM

Will power hitters have better doubles ratings in ootp4. It's kinda unrealistic to have a guy hit 50 homers and 10 doubles.

Scott Vibert · 02-27-2002, 12:42 PM

That was all random in OOTP3 I believe... how the ratings are generated, but I agree it was unrealistic; (as was the occaisonal E speed guy with the 8 for triples).

I'm not sure how its been changed for OOTP4; I have generally used the reduced rating sets (much better, and much harder) for my ingame play testing... I'll try and get a look at this sometime soon to check.

Hammer755 · 02-27-2002, 12:44 PM

[quote]Originally posted by dasperp:
Will power hitters have better doubles ratings in ootp4. It's kinda unrealistic to have a guy hit 50 homers and 10 doubles.<hr></blockquote>

Mark McGwire averaged 50 HR and 22 doubles per year (on a 162 game/year projection) and had several low double seasons. 1989 - 33 HR/17 2B, 1990 - 39 HR/16 2B, 1995 - 39 HR/13 2B, 1996 - 52 HR/21 2B, 2000/01 (injury-plagued) - 61 HR/12 2B.

Harmon Killebrew also averaged 38 HR and 19 doubles per 162 games. In 1962, the Killer smashed 49 HR, and managed only 11 doubles.

Roger Maris, in the season that he broke the Babe's HR record, hit 61 HR with only 16 doubles.

Dave Kingman (OK, not the best example

) hit 37 HR in 1982, only had 9 doubles that season.

Obviously, a few isolated cases do not support an argument, and a 50/10 split is extreme, but not completely out of the realm of possibility.

Interesting aside - I used <a href="http://www.baseballreference.com/" target="_blank">Baseball Reference</a> as my reference, and they have recently added salary information (Thanks for the heads-up, Aussie Mark), and something caught my attention. In 1987, McGwire's Rookie of the Year season, his salary was $72,500. Talk about bang for your buck.

[ February 27, 2002: Message edited by: Hammer755 ]

MizzouRah · 02-27-2002, 12:51 PM

Mr. McGwire came to mind for me as well.

Todd

mtw · 02-27-2002, 03:57 PM

For career leagues at least, I would like to see a rating of 0 equal a rating of 1, as no player should be able to go an entire career (with a reasonable # of at-bats) without a chance hitting a 2B, 3B or even an HR.

There are many players who have a zero rating in 3B or HR, which means they will never hit an HR or 3B during their career. Even McGwire would hit a triple every three or four years.

JML · 02-27-2002, 04:16 PM

[quote]Originally posted by mtw:


There are many players who have a zero rating in 3B or HR, which means they will never hit an HR or 3B during their career. .<hr></blockquote>

Are you sure about this? Do pitchers usually have a one HR rating?

hellfrozeover · 02-27-2002, 04:23 PM

I've had players rated 0 in triples hit a triple once every few years or so. Maybe I just don't remember correctly, but keep in mind that the ratings aren't completely accurate.

Edit - JML, you are absolutely correct a lot of pitchers may have 0 for hits or doubles, triples, HR's, etc. but still have hit them.

[ February 27, 2002: Message edited by: hellfrozeover ]

Arbiter · 02-27-2002, 04:25 PM

[quote]Originally posted by mtw:
For career leagues at least, I would like to see a rating of 0 equal a rating of 1, as no player should be able to go an entire career (with a reasonable # of at-bats) without a chance hitting a 2B, 3B or even an HR.

There are many players who have a zero rating in 3B or HR, which means they will never hit an HR or 3B during their career. Even McGwire would hit a triple every three or four years.<hr></blockquote>

I do not believe this is true. If I understand correctly, ratings are actually stored internally with decimal places, and rounded for display -- so the guys with zeroes are actually 0.1 or 0.3 or something.

In any event, there's at least one player in my current league with a zero HR rating but who has hit a dinger already this year.

mtw · 02-27-2002, 10:21 PM

[quote]Originally posted by JML:


Are you sure about this? Do pitchers usually have a one HR rating?<hr></blockquote>

Thanks to you (and to hellfrozeover) for questioning my observations. I actually doubted myself and went back to check my league. Until I edited O triple ratings to 1 in the 16th season, 15 years into my fictional historical "deadball" league, I had seven players who had hit no triples and had at least 1000 career hits, 2 players who are on 12 and 14 season streaks respectively without hitting a triple after hitting one their first season, and a few more players who clearly by this established pattern who would also not hit a triple if I had not altered their stats. As I said, this is a deadball league and I get reasonably good league triple numbers each season (1150-1300), so its not a stats problem.

As for HR's, I may be too hasty, but again I have players who have as many as 1100 hits without an HR. I would have to play a 90's league to get a better assesment of this one.

02-27-2002, 12:31 PM	#1
dasperp Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 61	Power Hitters Will power hitters have better doubles ratings in ootp4. It's kinda unrealistic to have a guy hit 50 homers and 10 doubles.

02-27-2002, 12:44 PM	#3
Hammer755 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 2,348	[quote]Originally posted by dasperp: <strong>Will power hitters have better doubles ratings in ootp4. It's kinda unrealistic to have a guy hit 50 homers and 10 doubles.</strong><hr></blockquote> Mark McGwire averaged 50 HR and 22 doubles per year (on a 162 game/year projection) and had several low double seasons. 1989 - 33 HR/17 2B, 1990 - 39 HR/16 2B, 1995 - 39 HR/13 2B, 1996 - 52 HR/21 2B, 2000/01 (injury-plagued) - 61 HR/12 2B. Harmon Killebrew also averaged 38 HR and 19 doubles per 162 games. In 1962, the Killer smashed 49 HR, and managed only 11 doubles. Roger Maris, in the season that he broke the Babe's HR record, hit 61 HR with only 16 doubles. Dave Kingman (OK, not the best example ) hit 37 HR in 1982, only had 9 doubles that season. Obviously, a few isolated cases do not support an argument, and a 50/10 split is extreme, but not completely out of the realm of possibility. Interesting aside - I used <a href="http://www.baseballreference.com/" target="_blank">Baseball Reference</a> as my reference, and they have recently added salary information (Thanks for the heads-up, Aussie Mark), and something caught my attention. In 1987, McGwire's Rookie of the Year season, his salary was $72,500. Talk about bang for your buck. [ February 27, 2002: Message edited by: Hammer755 ]</p>

02-27-2002, 03:57 PM	#5
mtw All Star Reserve Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 653	For career leagues at least, I would like to see a rating of 0 equal a rating of 1, as no player should be able to go an entire career (with a reasonable # of at-bats) without a chance hitting a 2B, 3B or even an HR. There are many players who have a zero rating in 3B or HR, which means they will never hit an HR or 3B during their career. Even McGwire would hit a triple every three or four years. __________________ Over-Zealous Apologist

02-27-2002, 04:16 PM	#6
JML Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: The act or process of locating. Posts: 2,154	[quote]Originally posted by mtw: <strong> There are many players who have a zero rating in 3B or HR, which means they will never hit an HR or 3B during their career. .</strong><hr></blockquote> Are you sure about this? Do pitchers usually have a one HR rating?

02-27-2002, 04:23 PM	#7
hellfrozeover All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago Posts: 1,130	I've had players rated 0 in triples hit a triple once every few years or so. Maybe I just don't remember correctly, but keep in mind that the ratings aren't completely accurate. Edit - JML, you are absolutely correct a lot of pitchers may have 0 for hits or doubles, triples, HR's, etc. but still have hit them. [ February 27, 2002: Message edited by: hellfrozeover ]</p> __________________ FBA Chicago Syndicate Former Owner: WBL Minnesota Twins 2004 - 2007 AL Central Division Champs OOL Chicago Whales 2006, 2009 UL East Champs; 2006, 2009 United League Champs IBA Lehigh Valley Diamonds 2006 Governor's Cup Champions VSLB New York Yankees 2001, 2002 AL East Division Champs ILBL Commissioner/Chicago Cubs 2002 NL Central Division Champs; 2002 National League Champs ASBL New York Yankees 2006 AL East Division Champs

02-27-2002, 12:42 PM	#2
Scott Vibert Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: My Computer Posts: 8,209	That was all random in OOTP3 I believe... how the ratings are generated, but I agree it was unrealistic; (as was the occaisonal E speed guy with the 8 for triples). I'm not sure how its been changed for OOTP4; I have generally used the reduced rating sets (much better, and much harder) for my ingame play testing... I'll try and get a look at this sometime soon to check.

02-27-2002, 12:51 PM	#4
MizzouRah Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Troy, Mo Posts: 6,252	Mr. McGwire came to mind for me as well. Todd

02-27-2002, 04:25 PM	#8
Arbiter Minors (Double A) Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: College Station TX Posts: 127	[quote]Originally posted by mtw: <strong>For career leagues at least, I would like to see a rating of 0 equal a rating of 1, as no player should be able to go an entire career (with a reasonable # of at-bats) without a chance hitting a 2B, 3B or even an HR. There are many players who have a zero rating in 3B or HR, which means they will never hit an HR or 3B during their career. Even McGwire would hit a triple every three or four years.</strong><hr></blockquote> I do not believe this is true. If I understand correctly, ratings are actually stored internally with decimal places, and rounded for display -- so the guys with zeroes are actually 0.1 or 0.3 or something. In any event, there's at least one player in my current league with a zero HR rating but who has hit a dinger already this year.

02-27-2002, 10:21 PM	#9
mtw All Star Reserve Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 653	[quote]Originally posted by JML: <strong> Are you sure about this? Do pitchers usually have a one HR rating?</strong><hr></blockquote> Thanks to you (and to hellfrozeover) for questioning my observations. I actually doubted myself and went back to check my league. Until I edited O triple ratings to 1 in the 16th season, 15 years into my fictional historical "deadball" league, I had seven players who had hit no triples and had at least 1000 career hits, 2 players who are on 12 and 14 season streaks respectively without hitting a triple after hitting one their first season, and a few more players who clearly by this established pattern who would also not hit a triple if I had not altered their stats. As I said, this is a deadball league and I get reasonably good league triple numbers each season (1150-1300), so its not a stats problem. As for HR's, I may be too hasty, but again I have players who have as many as 1100 hits without an HR. I would have to play a 90's league to get a better assesment of this one. __________________ Over-Zealous Apologist