Notwithstanding the post stickied about bad league experiences...

[Shoeless' Socks]

But I have to share this one.

I was in the ABL, and the commissioner is @USF on these forums.

I've made EVERY export since joining this league DESPITE being in the midst of being in preparation for a massive licensing examination for my JOB.

We only JUST finished the all star break in the league and today I got a message from the coward of a commissioner that they were "going in a different direction" and literally just gave my team to someone else.

For literally NO reason. I've made every export. I've managed my team, made moves, etc.

This is why online leagues frankly get no support or love from Markus. It's because they're run by a bunch of socially inept losers with ZERO concept of how to actually be human beings. They put their entire lives and self worth into whether or not their team wins a fake baseball league. The online experience is generally bad. And it frankly gets the support from Markus that its users based on their often displayed actions deserve.

I'm specifically putting @USF on blast. What you did was absolutely crappy and utterly ridiculous.

You should be ashamed of yourself and although the league is well ran, there are too many super teams and too many terrible ones.

I'm sure many will read this and just guffaw and slap their knees but you know this is true. Most of you need new perspectives and need to learn how to interact with other people.

[eMLBCommish]

Originally Posted by Shoeless' Socks

But I have to share this one.

I was in the ABL, and the commissioner is @USF on these forums.

I've made EVERY export since joining this league DESPITE being in the midst of being in preparation for a massive licensing examination for my JOB.

We only JUST finished the all star break in the league and today I got a message from the coward of a commissioner that they were "going in a different direction" and literally just gave my team to someone else.

For literally NO reason. I've made every export. I've managed my team, made moves, etc.

This is why online leagues frankly get no support or love from Markus. It's because they're run by a bunch of socially inept losers with ZERO concept of how to actually be human beings. They put their entire lives and self worth into whether or not their team wins a fake baseball league. The online experience is generally bad. And it frankly gets the support from Markus that its users based on their often displayed actions deserve.

I'm specifically putting @USF on blast. What you did was absolutely crappy and utterly ridiculous.

You should be ashamed of yourself and although the league is well ran, there are too many super teams and too many terrible ones.

I'm sure many will read this and just guffaw and slap their knees but you know this is true. Most of you need new perspectives and need to learn how to interact with other people.

The same could be said for you. I’ve learned from doing this for two decades that your story, combined with their story, results in the truth being in the middle somewhere. The biggest takeaway I got reading your message is no accountability for where you could be wrong, or how you could have communicated differently. “Woe is me, I’m the victim!” Is always a terrible take.

This “socially inept loser” doesn’t need to win, and isn’t even running a team in the new generation of leagues my brand now runs. My league is only as strong as those who make it that. And when you go speaking for the Developers, know this: Anytime I’ve had a question or issue, I have appreciated that Markus or Andreas and the rest of their team have gone ABOVE and BEYOND to help me get things right. No love for traditional online leagues, you say? I will disagree, but can’t respectfully since you showed me, nor any other Commissioner of a league any respect with your words.

Please don’t air your dirty laundry, or force your passive-aggressive rants on the rest of us who are here to have fun. The only thing you’ve done for this reader and perhaps a majority reading it, is put the focus of you being the issue vs the alternative you needed attention for.

[Shoeless' Socks]

Originally Posted by eMLBCommish

The same could be said for you. I’ve learned from doing this for two decades that your story, combined with their story, results in the truth being in the middle somewhere. The biggest takeaway I got reading your message is no accountability for where you could be wrong, or how you could have communicated differently. “Woe is me, I’m the victim!” Is always a terrible take.

This “socially inept loser” doesn’t need to win, and isn’t even running a team in the new generation of leagues my brand now runs. My league is only as strong as those who make it that. And when you go speaking for the Developers, know this: Anytime I’ve had a question or issue, I have appreciated that Markus or Andreas and the rest of their team have gone ABOVE and BEYOND to help me get things right. No love for traditional online leagues, you say? I will disagree, but can’t respectfully since you showed me, nor any other Commissioner of a league any respect with your words.

Please don’t air your dirty laundry, or force your passive-aggressive rants on the rest of us who are here to have fun. The only thing you’ve done for this reader and perhaps a majority reading it, is put the focus of you being the issue vs the alternative you needed attention for.

Literally exactly proved my point. And I'm not being passive aggressive, I'm being aggressive. God forbid that commissioners of online leagues actually you know, don't do dumb stuff.

Your post is worse than my OP. Because you didn't even read it. I WAS the victim. Just like I'm (and everyone else is) the victim every time I'm in a league when people who derive their entire sense of self from an online baseball team... makes a terrible trade with a hapless owner and the commissioner does nothing.

Or when people are abusive in Slack or make crude or misogynistic jokes and the commissioners say nothing. Yeah, we're all the "victims" of that stuff.

I also think that thou doth protest too much. What made you respond to my post in the first place?

Most of you stink. Most of you have zero spine, and most of you have zero integrity or people skills. I said it. And its true.

In the instance I mentioned in my OP, there IS NO OTHER SIDE OF THE STORY. I literally got an email that said my team was given to someone else. No other reason. At all.

So pardon me if I don't just take that lying down. Your post was being more of an as* than mine was.

And the DEVS couldn't care less about online leagues. Sorry, but its true.

[eMLBCommish]

My simple take aways:

Pathetic. Entitled. Think you’re owed something.

I don’t think one Commish is paid to do this. No one Commish is the entire lot, and you are disrespectful lumping everyone in. So yeah, I do take offensive to your senseless and childish drivel portraying me, or any of my peers, in your troll attempts to discredit us as a whole. Bet you’ve never Commished before, and based on your attitude and tone of your words, would be very bad at it. Like socially inept with zero ability to be a rational human being!

No one’s holding you here at gunpoint. You wanted attention like my youngest child and got it. But you’re not worth any further energy. If we’re so toxic, there’s the door. Take a hike and let us who volunteer our time, energy and patience away from our families to entertain doing something we are passionate about without needing to be insulted with your rule breaking forum nonsense, and disrespect of a product and company I have spent two decades supporting.

[Shoeless' Socks]

Originally Posted by eMLBCommish

My simple take aways:

Pathetic. Entitled. Think you’re owed something.

I don’t think one Commish is paid to do this. No one Commish is the entire lot, and you are disrespectful lumping everyone in. So yeah, I do take offensive to your senseless and childish drivel portraying me, or any of my peers, in your troll attempts to discredit us as a whole. Bet you’ve never Commished before, and based on your attitude and tone of your words, would be very bad at it. Like socially inept with zero ability to be a rational human being!

No one’s holding you here at gunpoint. You wanted attention like my youngest child and got it. But you’re not worth any further energy. If we’re so toxic, there’s the door. Take a hike and let us who volunteer our time, energy and patience away from our families to entertain doing something we are passionate about without needing to be insulted with your rule breaking forum nonsense, and disrespect of a product and company I have spent two decades supporting.

You made this post thinking that everyone would RUN to your defense and throw down their pearls they were clutching. And that didn't happen. It's because everyone in this forum has undoubtedly ran across morons just as I described in my OP.

But the truth offended you. Because the truth often hurts.

Be gone. Go polish your commissioner shrine.

[GTAltman]

Originally Posted by eMLBCommish

My simple take aways:

Pathetic. Entitled. Think you’re owed something.

Actually...IF all of the statements made are true, then yeah, you ARE entitled and owed something.
Just because a Commissioner runs a league at maybe his own time, he's still 1 of X amount of owners who make up a league.

I'm not saying the Commish was wrong, and I'm not saying he's right.
But if you're doing everything expected of you as a GM in a league, then you shouldn't be sent an email, "sorry we're going in another direction."

Unless of course you think that's a proper way of cutting ties, @eMLBCommish

[hardongear]

As a new guy who's only been around OOTP for 4 weeks now but has played Hockey Sims and in online Hockey leagues for years lumping everyone that Commishes or plays in online leagues into the same boat is a kinda silly and really shoots yourself in the foot a bit. Not everyone is and in fact the majority I bet are probably good people just looking fun and a good time. At least that's been my experience when it comes too hockey.

I don't think the OP comes a crossed as that entitled at all. Could have worded his post differently sure. And there's 2 sides to every story let's assume the OP has been truthful with his side. While maybe not entitled to anything Shoeless sounds like a solid, good and competent GM who did everything on time and took care of his team well. Such GM while not entitled to anything shouldn't expect to get his ass canned for no reason whatsoever.

Wth does "going in a different direction" even mean? Specially in the OP's case. When he is seemingly a good solid GM who did the things he should have and seemingly on time. To me in this case "going in a different direction" seemingly means we don't want a competent, good GM who does things on time in this league. My opinion someone is seemingly letting their personal opinions get in the way of what's best for the league overall. Every league wants a good, competent GM who does things on time.

One final thought as a new guy with no dog in this fight, who's paid attention close attention for 4 weeks, and who has avoided this thread for 4 weeks. Gotta say any league that is constantly looking for and has 4-5 openings every week tells me something is seemingly a miss with such a league. Whether it's a baseball or hockey league makes no difference.

In my 4 weeks here said league has a higher turnover rate by far and away of any league posted over that period and also has the longest recruitment thread of any league over that period.

Just some unbiased thoughts and opinions from the sidelines of a guy who one day maybe looking for a good baseball league or good group of guys play with.

Cheers!!!

[Shoeless' Socks]

If you notice... the commissioner that I called out hasn't appeared once, didn't respond to ONE of my emails, etc.

This is not the behavior of 'innocent' parties. Innocent people would say, here's why we gave your team away, here's why we didn't want you in the league.

Silence is telling.

"We're going in another direction" was code for 'a buddy who I know from another league wanted in this league and we know him better so we're going to give your team to him'. Yeah, you didn't do anything wrong... but we just know him and we don't know you. I know it's just the all-star break in your first season in the league, but we just think he'd be a better fit. I mean, its true that you had a 100% export rate, and you participated in SLACK, but we KNOW him...'

[FlashTastic One]

Good morning all!,

I do not hop onto the forums often (if ever), but wanted to chime in after being made aware of this post. I should also note for full transparency that I am apart of this league.

Given that USF has not replied (and likely will not reply), I would like to ask you to give it a rest. This league has been around for 10 real life years. Everything is laid out in our constitution.

This is the one and only time I will post in this thread.

People were very kind to you, walked you through how to setup a/our league. They kindly directed you to our league Constitution that has absolutely everything you could possibly have needed laid out.

You chose at that point to not read our Constitution, and yet, people still helped you get set up with the league publicly on Slack and helped you get your export up.

You asked after joining:

" Is this a stats only league? Oops, LOL " (Constitution)

" I have exported but where do I find the sim schedule? " (Constitution).

And my favorite:

" I probably should read the Constitution now since I've exported. Hmmm.. :slightly_smiling_face: " (Yes).

No hard feelings, but you wasted a lot of peoples time along the way. The only thing that was asked at this time was that you read through our constitution. All the info you were asking for was there.

I personally cannot speak to your export percentages, or the email you received. I hope this provides a little clarity in this he said/he said.

Have a blessed day,

[Shoeless' Socks]

Oh so THAT's the reason why someone's (my) team was given away?

Wasted people's time? Are the incessant inside dumb jokes wasting people's time? The incessant need to make small talk with people you're in other leagues with about those leagues? Are those wasting people's time (that aren't in those leagues).

Are you serious right now?

GTFOOH with that. You think THAT makes him look better? Get real.

This post 100% validates my OP. I feel even more valid in my beliefs after you made this post, that he wasn't man enough to make.

[mnolanpd]

Hello,

Generally I do not post here, I just follow along. Like the poster above, I am in the ABL, and felt the need to respond to provide an alternate perspective, that may well help the OP understand some of the things he seems to seek understanding of. Like another post, the whole story is truly somewhere in the middle.

I want to start by addressing the particular items in the initial post...

We really appreciate a high export rate in our league and, despite your licensing exam that we wished you well on, as fellow GMs, our knowing that you're in the midst of a major life event means that we would have leniency in the high standards we have for managing your team--you were offered alternatives/help with regards to those standards, should you need, while you were going through that event. Thus, I really feel that we provided you support, wished you well with your life event, and left the decision to you on the level of intervention needed to help. There are probably other things we could have done, and we would be excited to discuss other ways to handle it, provided you approach that discussion with class.

Yes, you were removed around the All-star break and you had "managed your team", "made moves", etc, as you stated. BUT, you WERE removed for a reason. and a good reason, in my opinion.

Lastly, in your initial post, you state:
"This is why online leagues frankly get no support or love from Markus. It's because they're run by a bunch of socially inept losers with ZERO concept of how to actually be human beings. They put their entire lives and self worth into whether or not their team wins a fake baseball league. The online experience is generally bad. And it frankly gets the support from Markus that its users based on their often displayed actions deserve.

I'm specifically putting @USF on blast. What you did was absolutely crappy and utterly ridiculous.

You should be ashamed of yourself and although the league is well ran, there are too many super teams and too many terrible ones.

I'm sure many will read this and just guffaw and slap their knees but you know this is true. Most of you need new perspectives and need to learn how to interact with other people."

In the first paragraph, your anger for being removed from a league spills into criticizing developers and ALL online league commissioners. The 3 sentences thereafter you redirect your target to the commissioner of the ABL that is charged with recruiting, adding and removing GMs, etc. You admit that the league is well-ran (thanks, commish!), but that there is no parity. (Laughable, to me. There is some real and great parity in this league in terms of current talent levels and up and coming prospect talent levels.) In the final 2 sentences, you lament that surely you'll not be understood by the masses and you say that's not your fault, rather the masses fault--most of them "need new perspectives and need to learn how to interact with other people".

Now for my perspective on how this all went down...

You joined the ABL, and as I previously stated, you did manage your team in good faith. There was not a management issue with you--you did well in that area, you were active in social settings in working trades, staying on top of deadlines, and everything else that comes with being a GM in the ABL. I say great work for that! What isn't referenced, but is always stated in recruiting messages, is the type of person that 1 is. The "fit" in the group. In your first 14 days in the league, you stated multiple times publicly how we could be better. How we could change things to be better, and how you were disappointed in particular things. At each turn, we read your feedback, responded through discussion, and decided on a way forward. However, in each interaction with you, your tone was similar to this post. Your tone was that you knew better, that we weren't listening, although we responded kindly to your inquiries, and when other members chimed in on their opinion, you told them on multiple occasions that THEY were making a bigger deal out of something that wasn't. We genuinely weren't sure, at the end of the discussion, whether you heard us, understood us, or just said, "fine, I'm not getting anywhere, let's just move on". This happened on 2 separate occasions, 2 separate un-connected issues, and the communication pattern on both sides was the same during both. (You gave feedback, we responded, and you told us that we were making a big deal over something that wasn't a big deal) Over the course of 35 seasons, we have adjusted rules, processes, and so on just about every season. We're not resistant to change or new ideas. All of that is normal. Your feedback and opinions are normal and we are excited to hear it all. Seriously. But, the bottom line is...

We are a tightly-knit group. We like each other, we can be open, honest, and tough with each other about our feelings. But, not a single 1 of our GMs thinks they are better than the next. All of our GMs are understanding of other opinions and willing to discuss their opinions in a tough way, without lobbing insults either way.

Sometimes, it's just not a great fit socially, and that's all that happened here.

The last I would like to address is the termination message sent to you... You've said numerous times that it simply said, "we've decided to go in a different direction". Well, I have no doubt it was that succinct or close to that. Please consider for a moment if you went into work and after 1 week on the job, you demean your supervisor in front of the group... The supervisor HAS to respond in those cases, and in keeping with the analogy, he did. If you then walk into your job the next day, you do the same thing, and your supervisor say, "look, this just isn't going to work out." I think that if you're being objective about your situation and how you've found yourself in it, then that analogy should hit the mark pretty well.

Best of luck with your licensing exam and all future endeavors.

[hardongear]

Thanks FlashTastic for the further insight and some of the other side of the story somewhere in the middle the full story is as I'm sure there's more. Also thanks for being calm, rational and decent 2020 could use more of this not really what I expected to wake up too .

Can fully understand why the Commish or anyone wouldn't wanna come on here and wouldn't come here to address anything even though to most that wouldn't/doesn't look good. There's also really nothing in it for anyone doing so and often times it just makes things worse and gives people an even worst opinion on things after it's all said and done.

EDIT: Hmmm seems to be just my day(right after I comment mnolanpd adds to the info/knowledge available). You guys are all just way to calm and rational over here on the baseball side(compared to hockey sims and leagues I've played in) lol. Again thanks for the further insight mnolanpd. Getting more of the full picture now.

Cheers!!!

[Yankee Clipper]

Originally Posted by eMLBCommish

and you are disrespectful lumping everyone in. So yeah, I do take offensive to your senseless and childish drivel portraying me, or any of my peers, in your troll attempts to discredit us as a whole.

This! This is amazingly funny!
Drama!

[USF]

We do wish you well in your personal life and all of the challenges that lie ahead of you.

You were removed because we decided to move in a different direction.

I already exhausted my feedback to you in terms of hanging in there and taking the time to embrace the league, the rules and the setup versus making everything a doom or gloom scenario to the point it really seemed you didn't enjoy the league at all.

I keep track of all the exporting and while that is not a reason in itself to be removed from our league you were not at 100% as you indicate in your post.

Lastly, the league is called ABL - Adult Baseball League for a reason. We have a very mature, stable group of GMs with limited open opportunities each year. We have been running this league since Dec 2011 and yes, we are in the final weeks of our 35th season. This doesn't mean for one moment this league is better than any other league or I'm the best commish and I never make mistakes or even a reason why anyone and everyone would be a perfect fit for the ABL. We are just a group of guys that like to relax and have fun with this hobby.

I do wish you the best and hope you find personal and OOTP happiness. I'm sure there is a better league out there for you. I hope it all works out for you. I understand you are simply venting.

Take care

[Shoeless' Socks]

I said that ONCE and after I saw the revenue sharing that you provided me I said nothing else and continued to make my exports and run my team.

This was nothing more than you wanted to give the team to someone that you knew and nothing I've seen in this thread warranted giving a team away.

Your email was garbage and when you say that commissioners made mistakes, yeah you made one.

There wasn't ANY reason to remove me from the league and there have been literally 1-2 sentences that I said posted when someone is in a league for half a season. There wasn't ANY doom and gloom except for literally ONE day. You're vastly overblowing the doom and gloom to make it look better to the other idiots in here that think its OK to just give a team away for almost no reason. You didn't exhaust anything and we interacted for a total of probably 10 minutes over half of the season. You're just using minute things to make your side look better. The truth is that you should haven't given my team away and you could have handled it much better.

Plus, you avoided me when I did nothing but ask as an 'adult' why I was removed. As far as being an adult, what this REALLY boiled down to was you got bent because anyone would dare criticize your league. After I saw that my revenue sharing criticism was unwarranted I immediately stopped my concern. Like any ADULT would.

[Shoeless' Socks]

Originally Posted by hardongear

Thanks FlashTastic for the further insight and some of the other side of the story somewhere in the middle the full story is as I'm sure there's more. Also thanks for being calm, rational and decent 2020 could use more of this not really what I expected to wake up too .

Can fully understand why the Commish or anyone wouldn't wanna come on here and wouldn't come here to address anything even though to most that wouldn't/doesn't look good. There's also really nothing in it for anyone doing so and often times it just makes things worse and gives people an even worst opinion on things after it's all said and done.

EDIT: Hmmm seems to be just my day(right after I comment mnolanpd adds to the info/knowledge available). You guys are all just way to calm and rational over here on the baseball side(compared to hockey sims and leagues I've played in) lol. Again thanks for the further insight mnolanpd. Getting more of the full picture now.

Cheers!!!

If he hadn't completely ignored me, had sent me a cogent email to explain, instead of a garbage email and just disabling Slack, I would have NEVER made this OP.

He refuses to admit that he made a mistake in the way he handled this and that is the point of the original post.

[kcroyalgm]

Whew, would I be glad NOT to have you in any league that I'm in. Please get on with your life.