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Old 08-14-2019, 06:53 AM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn View Post
The whole thing is a HUGELY complex system. Tweaking one area (i.e. drop rates, or price of packs, or achievement payouts etc) can have lots of unintendes consequences elsewhere, it is impossible to predict. The balance we have right now is almost perfect, somehow we managed to hit the sweetspot right out of the game. Hence we only do very very minor tweaks in the future to the important parts I just mentioned.

It's easy for those of us on the outside to vastly underestimate the fine balancing act it must be (and was) to both get and then keep the system working well. So kudos to all of you for doing such a terrific job at balancing all the different parts that make up PT.

But with that said, even though it's really hard to tell what consequences different changes will have, it's still fun to make suggestions even if many of them aren't so great.
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Old 08-14-2019, 09:10 AM   #42
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Not gonna comment on balance and whatnot. Just want to say...I like collections. I think too many people rushed into them without really knowing whether it would be worth it or not, and got burned. It seems better to wait until the reward cards are on the AH, make sure they are good, and do the PP math before you start collecting any cards. With a little patience and targeting the right cards to fit your team, collections can definitely add value to a small budget team. Check out my Lenny Dykstra production...it cost me just 20k to complete that collection. Career .344 OBP in perfect with elite CF defense? Good luck finding that for 20k.
I agree - I love the collections. One of the problems with them that added to the auction house madness was that the historical collections for each team didn't come out at once. I dont think slow rolling those is the right move.
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Old 08-14-2019, 11:49 AM   #43
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So now competitive balance only applies to P2P? Interesting.

With the addition of the ASG and POTM cards, they've moved away from their original points about representing season stats which I agree with your concern there. I understand the marketing/business aspect of it though. Also, what do you mean "be in the lineup for one month?" Are you meaning only available in packs for 1 month, or only usable for 1 month, or what? Sorry, I'm missing your point on that.
I was actually replying to a prior post.

My point with the POTM and ASG, it's just more high end fabricated ratings. These cards don't seem to represent a true full season. Sure they are good for a month or up to the all star game, but 162 games is a long time. It's like taking a basketball shooter that makes close to 70% of his shots because he might play 2 minutes a game and only shoots high percentage shots. He can't keep those stats up for 40 minutes in a game. These POTM's had a great month, but not sure how there season will end up?
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Old 08-14-2019, 12:00 PM   #44
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Originally Posted by daves View Post
I was actually replying to a prior post.

My point with the POTM and ASG, it's just more high end fabricated ratings. These cards don't seem to represent a true full season. Sure they are good for a month or up to the all star game, but 162 games is a long time. It's like taking a basketball shooter that makes close to 70% of his shots because he might play 2 minutes a game and only shoots high percentage shots. He can't keep those stats up for 40 minutes in a game. These POTM's had a great month, but not sure how there season will end up?
The issue really comes down to "is this a realistic simulation" ? I don't have any doubt that we all agree that was the purpose of OOTP Classic - to be as realistic as possible, but in all fairness that was never the purpose of Perfect Team. Even though I like the game, I have to admit that's the part that rubs me the wrong way; it isn't real enough for my tastes. It's a no-holds-barred "competitive challenge" based on a baseball format.

I guess those of us looking for realism should probably rely on OOTP Classic, and play PT as a sidebar.

PS: If there's one thing I would like to see more than anything else, it would be for the Devs to take another look at getting PT cards into the classic game. That would be awesome.
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Old 08-14-2019, 12:02 PM   #45
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My least favorite thing first: The PEAK cards that are akin to the player on steroids offensively almost from my modest point of view.

.
I agree and like the reference to steroids. Though the steroid era was entertaining it was still considered cheating.

I have a real good team, but when I go to the playoffs there is always a team or two with a rotation of high end perfects such as Maddux, Cy Young, Schilling, Walter Johnson and there are some other steroid pitchers.

I don't mind high end performers, but these drugged up players do hurt the semi-realism OOTP was supposed to represent.
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Old 08-14-2019, 12:26 PM   #46
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I'm going to offer my take as a player who has a couple of OL teams as well as a few newer non-OL teams at lower levels:

Auction House -- The showing of splits is SO useful, and the overall handling of the auction house with time reductions and everything is great. I think we all agree there.

Collections -- I don't understand how anybody hates these. There's stuff in it for whales. There's stuff in it for theme teams. There's stuff in it that's just fun to collect. And, most importantly, there's a TON of stuff in it for F2P players. Card rewards (Hello Dykstra!), lots of different kinds of packs, and a bunch of bench players who can provide playoff depth and also tournament options. Just a great feature overall, I'm convinced that anybody who dislikes this is just impatient or is not doing enough research.

Peak players/Special Edition/POTM -- I'll offer a different take than a couple players here: I do not care whatsoever what the theme of a card is, or how many cards of a player that came out, or anything. I just want variety. I don't know how anybody could dislike that. Again, whales get to sift through lots of options and pick the best one. So do theme teams. And for FTP players it's a godsend, we get to have a ton of variety and pick the player which matches our specific angle. And the notion that they ruin competitive balance is just laughable to me. There will always be good players, who cares what the specific theme of their construction is?

Competitive Balance -- From a FTP standpoint, this is really excellent. There are lots of options at the top end which provide different FTP team construction approaches. However, I think there needs to be just a bit more care taken for next year's version on FTP pitching balance. The fact that the good lefties are few and far between once you try to get someone better than, say, Brett Anderson, means that the lefty team strategy becomes a little too dominant. I would likely to see a more even balance between competitively viable lefty pitchers and righty pitchers that are accessible to FTP players (~20k PP or less). The only other thing I would really change is adding back in some of the diamonds in the rough like Dierker, etc. Those cards made that lower level FTP push a lot more exciting, and finding a diamond in the rough is a really compelling experience for my type of player.

Most important exclusion in PT19 and PT20: I think the core game as it stands really executes on what it tries to do. There are other features like tournaments and OOTPGO that are obvious extensions to this model, but the core game is solid. Once your core game is good at attracting an audience, you need to think about how to extend its longevity. Most MMOs try to devise some sort of "endgame content" to satisfy this, and I think that's what PT lacks the most right now. There are lots of forms this could take as well. It could be a league filled solely with last week's Perfect League WS winners. It could be offering a beta invitation for next year's edition if they win a Perfect League title (or if they win 2, or 3, or some arbitrary cutoff line to keep in manageable). It could be an obvious global leaderboard of Perfect league titles. You could give teams the ability to reset with a special medal once they've won a Perfect title (a "prestige" system). There are so many devtime-light extensions that can be added to the game that really should be considered here. Whether a player spends $1000 or $0, you don't want a player to feel like they've "beaten" the game and move on, there should always be another objective that they can focus on. In particular, you *really* don't want whales to win a Perfect title and decide they've had enough, because that cuts into the bottom line more aggressively than any other complaint featured here. I just think that's something worth really thinking about which hasn't had enough discussion around it on these forums.
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Old 08-14-2019, 12:51 PM   #47
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There seems to be many F2P speaking up for the game. I think next version I may stick to this theme.

Kudos for setting up a successful Perfect friend league.
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Old 08-14-2019, 03:35 PM   #48
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There seems to be many F2P speaking up for the game. I think next version I may stick to this theme.

Kudos for setting up a successful Perfect friend league.
It is far easier to obtain a successful F2P team in this version because there are a lot more ways to earn points. A larger card base means a lot more opportunities to speculate on the market. And the significantly increased amount of achievements means a lot more points even for passive players. Since the number of players needed on a team hasn't changed, this means it is much easier to build a team to any player's satisfaction.

From my perspective, this change did the most to affect the game's competitive balance, and I am surprised that nobody else is discussing this.
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Old 08-14-2019, 05:20 PM   #49
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It is far easier to obtain a successful F2P team in this version because there are a lot more ways to earn points. A larger card base means a lot more opportunities to speculate on the market. And the significantly increased amount of achievements means a lot more points even for passive players. Since the number of players needed on a team hasn't changed, this means it is much easier to build a team to any player's satisfaction.

From my perspective, this change did the most to affect the game's competitive balance, and I am surprised that nobody else is discussing this.
I was not fully aware of this. Thank you.
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Old 08-14-2019, 05:37 PM   #50
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I agree and like the reference to steroids. Though the steroid era was entertaining it was still considered cheating.

I have a real good team, but when I go to the playoffs there is always a team or two with a rotation of high end perfects such as Maddux, Cy Young, Schilling, Walter Johnson and there are some other steroid pitchers.

I don't mind high end performers, but these drugged up players do hurt the semi-realism OOTP was supposed to represent.
Kind of interesting. In one sense it would be interesting to have McGwire & Sosa from there 65+ HR seasons in the game with off the charts power rating, you know, perform just as they did. And for the most part because of the way the leagues are formatted there are few performances that are WAY outside what you usually see...And then again most of the PEAK cards are vast improvements over the same players' other cards. It would kind of be interesting to have the old deadball hitters just as they were too, maybe hitting .370 but less than 10 HR.

I guess I'm commenting on the difference between importing raw stats and letting those dictate the ratings & adjusting ratings for eras, etc.

Canseco was looking to perform at another level & the PEAK cards are a lot like that.

Bud Selig immediately wanted to clean the game up & was reminded that the game was more popular than ever...

Decisions, decisions
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Old 08-14-2019, 06:15 PM   #51
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lol these "peak" cards are just a different set of back-engine numbers assigned to a meaningless name

there is no realism in mashing 130 years worth of baseball stats together and none should be expected. take the game for what it is, an exercise in evaluating what the numbers presented mean and how to manipulate them

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Old 08-14-2019, 06:23 PM   #52
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From reading these threads it seems the amount of money you put into this is the inverse of the fun you get out of it.

I spend nothing outside of the base cost of the game and I have a lot of fun with it.
I like the POTM cards, All-Star cards and peak cards.
The future legend cards are a bit wacky but I do not mind them.

We have it pretty good. Many other FTP card games are complete cluster ****s. Multiple currencies, leveling up cards, support cards, having to juggle contracts etc


OOTPD has stayed away from the most egregious of these and left us with a rather fun game mode.

From what I have seen is that most of the ones who have issues are due to the lack of an ‘end game’ that is endemic to most MMO’s


They spend money or get a bit of luck and get to the Perfect Leagues and then what?
Once you have won a championship what is past that? You can fiddle with your roster and hope for more high end cards in content releases but that is it.

Tournaments may help some. And I am sure over the years that we will see other game modes that will give us all some things to do.


If I had one suggestion it would be for a ‘reset team’ option.
The 25 cards on your active roster get sold for quick sell value. They play out the rest of the week and on Sunday night you are given six starter packs and put back into the entry league on Monday morning.
You keep your reserve roster and your PP earned to that point. You then get to start all over.

To make sure no one can claim they did not mean to reset their team, you would have to find and click it, then confirm, then confirm again by entering your user name and password.
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Old 08-14-2019, 06:25 PM   #53
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From reading these threads it seems the amount of money you put into this is the inverse of the fun you get out of it.
This could not be farther from the truth.
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Old 08-14-2019, 07:09 PM   #54
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If I had one suggestion it would be for a ‘reset team’ option.
Technically there is one. Sell your current players and try something different. I had a Big bat team full of power that led the league (or was 2nd) in homers every season. Recently I hit the reset button by selling off the power for defense,
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Old 08-14-2019, 07:14 PM   #55
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PT20 is my first year playing PT. Overall I've had a great time but I think most of it is due to falling in with a good group of F2P players. So I think having like-minded communities makes the game much more enjoyable. Anything you can add to the game to make forming/finding/belonging to communities would be a plus.

I like Collections (one of my teams is trying to complete as many as possible; my other teams have completed a couple but not many). I don't particularly like the All-Star or POTM cards, but it doesn't bother me much that they exist. Most of my teams use historical cards but it's too difficult to get those types of cards from packs. And I wish there were more decent to good historical relievers!

Edit to say: I forgot to say I don't particularly like the peak cards. It's obvious the fielding on those cards is fudged to be worse than it should be, otherwise people would only use the peak card for a player! Maybe the peak cards should be changed to use a 3-year average performance from the peak of a player's career or some such.
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Old 08-14-2019, 07:23 PM   #56
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lol these "peak" cards are just a different set of back-engine numbers assigned to a meaningless name

there is no realism in mashing 130 years worth of baseball stats together and none should be expected. take the game for what it is, an exercise in evaluating what the numbers presented mean and how to manipulate them
I really enjoy the romantic side of PT's baseball cards and players from all eras, you're all about those cold hard numbers huh? heh

(my players are real to me, I swear )
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Old 08-14-2019, 07:25 PM   #57
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They spend money or get a bit of luck and get to the Perfect Leagues and then what?
Once you have won a championship what is past that?
Win more championships. It never gets old.
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Old 08-14-2019, 08:10 PM   #58
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My least favorite thing first: The PEAK cards that are akin to the player on steroids offensively almost from my modest point of view.
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I agree and like the reference to steroids. Though the steroid era was entertaining it was still considered cheating.

I have a real good team, but when I go to the playoffs there is always a team or two with a rotation of high end perfects such as Maddux, Cy Young, Schilling, Walter Johnson and there are some other steroid pitchers.

I don't mind high end performers, but these drugged up players do hurt the semi-realism OOTP was supposed to represent.
I will take offense for equating PEAK cards with steroids and thus cheating. They are card with stats like any other, and using them is fair and legit. Perhaps the two gentlemen could find a way to deal with them or get these cards themselves instead of beating the same thoroughly dead horse again and again in this thread.
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Old 08-14-2019, 08:30 PM   #59
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I thought he made a good point and I agreed with him. I think peek cards should be called steroid cards from now on.


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Old 08-14-2019, 08:35 PM   #60
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They spend money or get a bit of luck and get to the Perfect Leagues and then what?

Once you have won a championship what is past that? You can fiddle with your roster and hope for more high end cards in content releases but that is it.

I am currently battling the team that is #4 in wins in the entire PT universe. They have 13 championships and I have three. They have more perfect cards on their reserve roster than I have in total. I am only 1.5 games back. Don't try to tell me that I am bored and not having fun. There's always someone bigger than you to take down.
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