Pitching and Defense

[Kushiel]

I am an old, old school guy that learned baseball during the time when pitching and defense reigned supreme; so, I build my teams with those factors as my priority. My Horned Frogs starting pitching ERA is at 2.97, relievers ERA is 2.55 and my average defense rating across my 8 defensive positions is 85.875.

Does anybody else push this priority this hard or are most of your teams offensive minded first? I know everybody wants good pitching, but do you concentrate on pitching and defense when you add a player from the AH or do you go for the big knockers first?

[Déjà Bru]

Pitching first, always, because the old adage is true.

[Kem]

I'd like to say I value pitching and defense, but...



But I guess I actually value contact and obp over anything else.

[Zorro]

Originally Posted by Kushiel

I am an old, old school guy that learned baseball during the time when pitching and defense reigned supreme; so, I build my teams with those factors as my priority. My Horned Frogs starting pitching ERA is at 2.97, relievers ERA is 2.55 and my average defense rating across my 8 defensive positions is 85.875.

Does anybody else push this priority this hard or are most of your teams offensive minded first? I know everybody wants good pitching, but do you concentrate on pitching and defense when you add a player from the AH or do you go for the big knockers first?

I always lead league in pitching. I find I am always in games that way and I have made the playoffs every season.

[Dogberry99]

It is difficult for me to value pitching and defense when the achievements do not.

My compromise is to spend most of my points on position players who have both offensive and defensive traits I value while mostly ignoring my horrible pitching.


[LATE EDIT] I should probably also mention that I have shortstops playing all 4 infield positions

[noragar]

I'm (Alexandra SafeZone) in the same league as your Horned Frogs. My defense was on par with yours until I got sick of Kyle Seager hitting below 0.200 and switched to a platoon of Grebeck and Holt at 3b.

But I value defense heavily and it's the only thing keeping me around 0.500 with a roster of 2 Gold, 2 Silver, and the rest Bronze.

[Kushiel]

Originally Posted by Dogberry99

It is difficult for me to value pitching and defense when the achievements do not.

My compromise is to spend most of my points on position players who have both offensive and defensive traits I value while mostly ignoring my horrible pitching.


[LATE EDIT] I should probably also mention that I have shortstops playing all 4 infield positions

I get Corner Painter almost every time through the rotation. I also get multiple no hitters every season through beta and live now. There are pitching achievements like Perfect Innings that I get here and there too

[Kushiel]

Originally Posted by noragar

I'm (Alexandra SafeZone) in the same league as your Horned Frogs. My defense was on par with yours until I got sick of Kyle Seager hitting below 0.200 and switched to a platoon of Grebeck and Holt at 3b.

But I value defense heavily and it's the only thing keeping me around 0.500 with a roster of 2 Gold, 2 Silver, and the rest Bronze.

It is also the thing keeping my FTP team which needless to say is much weaker than my first team in the hunt

[vyshka]

That was kind of what I'm shooting for, and my bullpen is doing okay, we have pretty decent d.eff, but the starters could probably be performing better. Like it was mentioned above I figure if the pitching and defense keep it close then we always have a chance. We have a positive run differential, but we seem to be giving up a bit more this year than we did in the beta.

[Dogberry99]

Originally Posted by Kushiel

I get Corner Painter almost every time through the rotation. I also get multiple no hitters every season through beta and live now. There are pitching achievements like Perfect Innings that I get here and there too

That's all well and good, but nothing mentioned here can truly be considered a defensive achievement. It just so happens that I have opted to value offense over pitching. Is it the right move [edit: for points, specifically]? I don't know. However, I get a steady enough dose of Hit Machine, Double Dinger, and other offensive achievements to placate me. I will be upgrading my pitching soon enough, but thus far, offensive upgrades have been significantly cheaper.

[Kushiel]

Originally Posted by vyshka

That was kind of what I'm shooting for, and my bullpen is doing okay, we have pretty decent d.eff, but the starters could probably be performing better. Like it was mentioned above I figure if the pitching and defense keep it close then we always have a chance.

You are on a good run right now My August is treating me like July did your Tumbleweeds. I am 8-14 so far. My runs are staying high overall because when I win I have been scoring double digits. But I have been having too many like the last game losing 3-2 in 12 innings. We will get back on track for September and the playoffs though

[Kushiel]

Originally Posted by Dogberry99

That's all well and good, but nothing mentioned here can truly be considered a defensive achievement. It just so happens that I have opted to value offense over pitching. Is it the right move [edit: for points, specifically]? I don't know. However, I get a steady enough dose of Hit Machine, Double Dinger, and other offensive achievements to placate me. I will be upgrading my pitching soon enough, but thus far, offensive upgrades have been significantly cheaper.

But my defense helps my pitching earn those achievements

[Dogberry99]

Originally Posted by Kushiel

But my defense helps my pitching earn those achievements

And you've had a lot more points to play with than I have. When I reach your level of points spent, I hope to have a more balanced team as well. Until then, I am relying on offense to get me there

[Kushiel]

Offense is a good way I am not knocking it. I am just curious as to how people are building their teams. I used the pitching and defense to get me there.I have made over 100k PP the past 2 days from 2 cards that I drew from packs. I put my Gehrig up today for 200k but yanked it down since I went into this August slump Now I am just waiting my days out to put him back in. I made a very poor decision LOL!

[Dogberry99]

Originally Posted by Kushiel

Offense is a good way I am not knocking it. I am just curious as to how people are building their teams. I used the pitching and defense to get me there.I have made over 100k PP the past 2 days from 2 cards that I drew from packs. I put my Gehrig up today for 200k but yanked it down since I went into this August slump Now I am just waiting my days out to put him back in. I made a very poor decision LOL!

That poor decision is especially punishing considering that the 14 day wait period is specific to the card's activity and didn't progress while he was on the market. That is a lesson I too learned the hard way, but that's another thread entirely

[joehart]

I found that my All Bronze Whalers team can keep up with most teams (71-59 record) by focusing on three areas.


1. Defense (3rd in the league):

Outfield with Ichiro and Mickey Rivers.
Infield with Aparicio/Cozart/Camargo/Holt/Seitzer/Backman.
With Silver and Gold cards, you can really make a big difference.


2. Platoon hitting (AVG 2nd in the league)

Catching: Jody Davis (Rated 67) and Wynegar (Rated 64).
In almost all the seasons, they have performed quite well (2-3 WAR each) for me.

Infield and Outfield is not always easy to find the perfect platoon combination. But a few trials through the season can get you a few .300 platoon hitting combinations. Add the ability to steal bases from a few players and you can score enough (6th in league for Runs scored) to keep up.

1B: I usually try to also platoon 1B (Zimmerman/Spiezio) when possible to squeeze some extra hits out of the team.



3. Willing to try a few players to find the seasonal gem.

For LF, I can usually get a great season from either Winker or Dahl.

For Infield, it takes a bit more effort to find a player that has a good run.
This year Seitzer, Backman, and Aparicio performed well enough.


Rest of the team:

SP: Berrios/Haddix/Niese/Petry/Porcello
BP: Bracho, Gallegos, Hirano, LeBlanc, Maglie, Gohara.


If you can get enough wins from teams that have a few Gold and Silver cards, you can accept the losses against the much better teams:

Beasts: 1 Perfect, 3 Diamond, 20 Gold, 1 Silver: 5-7 record against them.
Wolves: 1 Diamond, 15 Gold, 9 Silver: 2-5 record against them.
Ls: 1 Perfect, 1 Diamond, 10 Gold, 12 Silver: 4-3 record against them.

[Thalion]

I’m a pitching and defense kind of guy too. Park factors that replicate a big spacious ballpark, I like rangy outfielders and high defensive infielders

During beta, I think as playing 3 good (80+) shortstops at the 3 infielder positions and will probably transition that way again.

[One Post Wonder]

Originally Posted by Kushiel

I am an old, old school guy that learned baseball during the time when pitching and defense reigned supreme; so, I build my teams with those factors as my priority. My Horned Frogs starting pitching ERA is at 2.97, relievers ERA is 2.55 and my average defense rating across my 8 defensive positions is 85.875.

Does anybody else push this priority this hard or are most of your teams offensive minded first? I know everybody wants good pitching, but do you concentrate on pitching and defense when you add a player from the AH or do you go for the big knockers first?

The way you build a team is exactly like me. My first experience as a baseball fan was following the Dodgers in the mid-late 1980's, and those teams had great home-grown starting pitching, a mediocre offense, the worst bullpen in the major leagues and the worst defense in the major leagues. I saw a lot of heroic pitching efforts lost by crappy bullpen work and errors. Sure, the lack of offense didn't help, but it wasn't as blatantly obvious as the other problems.

So like those Dodger teams, I get the same great starting pitchers. But unlike those teams, I give those guys every opportunity to look as good as possible. Those heroic pitching performances will not be ruined under my management. And so in 15 years of playing OOTP I don't think I've ever tried running a team of lumberjacks even once. I always use the defense first formula.

BUT - while I played my usual way in the beta, I'm running a strikeout pitcher/high average offense right now. I feel that in PT that pitching/defense teams don't earn anywhere near as much pp as offensive teams, and I want my guys to not just win, but to earn some pp for me so that I don't have to pound the auction house. I felt I needed to adapt to the 'league' I was playing in.

My current team isn't as successful as my beta squad, but it's not bad. And it earns almost twice as much pp because I get a constant stream of bronze offensive achievements.

[One Post Wonder]

Originally Posted by Kushiel

I get Corner Painter almost every time through the rotation. I also get multiple no hitters every season through beta and live now. There are pitching achievements like Perfect Innings that I get here and there too

I get corner painter a lot more often with my offensive team than I did with my defensive one, since now I'm looking for guys who strike people out vs. pitch to contact.

I'd get several 'Throw a Maddux' achievements a year which I don't get anymore. But that is more than compensated for by the steady flow of bronze offensive achievements that I earn.

I suppose I'd get even more pp if I tried for home runs, too. But I like my dead ball era offense. It's more effective than I expected, and I'll stick with it until I decide to go back to my defensive roots.

[Kushiel]

Originally Posted by One Post Wonder

The way you build a team is exactly like me. My first experience as a baseball fan was following the Dodgers in the mid-late 1980's, and those teams had great home-grown starting pitching, a mediocre offense, the worst bullpen in the major leagues and the worst defense in the major leagues. I saw a lot of heroic pitching efforts lost by crappy bullpen work and errors. Sure, the lack of offense didn't help, but it wasn't as blatantly obvious as the other problems.

So like those Dodger teams, I get the same great starting pitchers. But unlike those teams, I give those guys every opportunity to look as good as possible. Those heroic pitching performances will not be ruined under my management. And so in 15 years of playing OOTP I don't think I've ever tried running a team of lumberjacks even once. I always use the defense first formula.

BUT - while I played my usual way in the beta, I'm running a strikeout pitcher/high average offense right now. I feel that in PT that pitching/defense teams don't earn anywhere near as much pp as offensive teams, and I want my guys to not just win, but to earn some pp for me so that I don't have to pound the auction house. I felt I needed to adapt to the 'league' I was playing in.

My current team isn't as successful as my beta squad, but it's not bad. And it earns almost twice as much pp because I get a constant stream of bronze offensive achievements.

My team has developed an offense as we have played. I was still number one in pitching with good defense this season. Having the 3rd runs scored by the end of the season was a blessing too But, I believe in building P&D first and then the rest will take care of itself. I loved the Dodgers of my youth with Koufax, Drysdale, and Osteen too. Give those guys 2-3 runs and "Turn out the lights, the party's over."