The O's Woes

RubeBaker · 06-10-2018, 11:28 AM

The Baltimore Orioles currently suck. In all of my OOTP replay simulations, they are just as bad. I'm thinking about doing a replay with Baltimore because I think it would be fun rebuilding the Orioles even with their bad, untradeable contracts.

Before the season, I thought the Detroit Tigers would be the worst team in baseball and the most fun to rebuild, but they're doing better than I thought they would. Baltimore is a mess. A hot mess. As SnaggleJ would say, "Hot garbage."

The Orioles remind me of the Chicago Cubs from about 8 years ago, even more so than I thought the Detroit Tigers did. Baltimore has a lame-duck manager who most likely won't be back next year & will retire as the Cubs did with Lou Piniella. I doubt Buck Showalter will resign mid-season as Piniella did, but you never know. And I think Dan Duquette will be replaced as GM after this season.

Baltimore's farm system is at the bottom or near the bottom as the Cubs was back in 2010. They're going to need to rebuild through the draft to restock the farm system as well as trades. I expect Manny Machado, Zach Britton and Adam Jones to be wearing different uniforms in August.

I have noticed in ALL of my OOTP replays that Orioles owner Peter Angelos dies. Every. Single. Time. His son takes over & he actually seems more sensible than his dad. He usually is in favor of rebuilding the team where the dad still believes that Baltimore can contend.

Baltimore needs to rebuild in OOTP and in real-life. If and when I take over the Orioles in OOTP, I'm going to utilize a lot of Earl Weaver strategy. I have the "Weaver On Strategy" book by Earl Weaver and Terry Pluto and "Earl Weaver Baseball" was the first baseball computer game I ever played. Right now I'm playing the 2018 Cubs and after the season we're going to make a serious run at Bryce Harper, but I'm thinking about alternating replays with the 2018 Orioles. Two teams in very different directions, but I love a challenge.

Has anyone else been successful at rebuilding the Baltimore Orioles in OOTP?

Calvert98 · 06-10-2018, 12:00 PM

Well, I am carrying-over my 2017 MLB Orioles season start to OOTP 19. I’m in 2021.

The Orioles won the division in 2019, but 2018, was a 100 loss season (This happened in OOTP 18 by the way). I didn’t even downloaded and play OOTP 19 till I hit the off-season following 2019. In 2020 (my first full season with OOTP 19), they went 74-88.

I play-out all of my games, so here is the breakdown of my Orioles:

2017, under 500 (OOTP 18)

2018, 100 loss season (OOTP 18)

2019, made it to the playoffs (OOTP 18)

2020, 74-88 (OOTP 19)

Calvert98 · 06-10-2018, 12:44 PM

So, about that 2019 season:

Some things I did last year going into 2019 in OOTP 18 was extend Manny (Yea, that was expensive! and I kept him at 3B), signed SP J.Happ, traded for SP Martin Perez, and brought in an outstanding IFA from Japan for about $14 million a year. I let Britton and Jones walk and traded Trumbo, but had to retain about 50% of his salary (still helped), and I extended Schoop early on a decent contract. Also, I have had great success in turning a couple mid-20's AAA/Utility great glove kind of guys into everyday players, to make up for the loss of power.

I added pitching depth to AAA (both rotation and RPs; lots of guys with options). And I brought in a new pitching coach at both levels. Bundy retired with an injury; I think he could have rode it out however, but I understand his desire to stay healthy.

I brought back Matt Wieters, who's track-record and leadership has made a noticeable difference in the clubhouse. The catchers were he and Joseph in 2019. The Gas-man (Kevin G.), managed to find his grove that year, with 17 wins and an ERA of around 4.05. Wining seems to be putting him in the right frame of mind.

Then in 2020, my pitching collapsed. I didn’t have the depth to even sustain Happ’s constant stints on the DL and Gausman went back to form and the bullpen again, began to go under. It was a bit of a mess, and with the G Man’s new 5 year, $12 million a year contract, I decided to move him and the Nat’s gave me Scherzer, and but I ended getting stuck with $29 million of his salary, so it was sort of a wash. I also made a staff change or two.

pgjocki · 06-10-2018, 04:59 PM

To be clear and upfront - rebuilding in OOTP is far easier than rebuilding in real life.

The O's are a horribly run organization and it starts with the owner and GM both being clueless dolts who shouldn't be allowed near baseball. When they submitted the Chris Davis deal to MLB for approval the league should have disbanded the club for stupidity and announced a 30 day period for any city to pitch a plan for a new team.

With that out of the way I think the best approach is to burn the team down by trading everyone on the big league roster who will get a positive return and set you site on competing in the 2020 to 2021 timeframe. In theory you can sign Manny to a monster deal extension since you are trading everyone else and front load the deal to pay him $35 to $50 million a year for 2 to 3 years then have it drop down to the low $20's once the team should be good again.

Calvert98 · 06-10-2018, 09:41 PM

I agree that rebuilding the team in OOTP is easier due to what appears to be a rather dysfunctional decision making process inside the organization. Folks place blame at DD’s feet often, and I’m not saying there isn’t some, but I really don’t know how much leeway he really has, and that makes it real difficult to do his job.

Ownership simply needs to set an annual budget and then step aside, and hand the keys over to a good GM for 5 years.

Anyway, I’m not actually sure how easy it is to rebuild this team in OOTP, which tells me something about how tough it must be in real life given that decision making process. I was finally able to move Davis for example, but that wasn’t till 2020, and I had to package him with a good rookie pitcher who only had 1 year of service time and a couple B prospects, and then still eat 50% of his contract.

And then 2021 started off rough; I hit a 14 game losing streak (was like 4 and 20 I think) and then actually started over the save from a back-up dated the day after opening day that year, which I now regret. I should have just roughed it out. So now, I plan to just quit and start over, and I’ll start with the 2018 season and see what happens. I will keep that other save “on file”, but I doubt I will return to it.

The Yurpman · 06-10-2018, 09:56 PM

They definitely suck in every single MLB QS I've played. They've ended up the worst team in the AL almost every single simulation I've done of 2018. The only thing I can say is keep Austin Hays. He's won ROTY a handful of times in my sims.

Calvert98 · 06-10-2018, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Yurpman

They definitely suck in every single MLB QS I've played. They've ended up the worst team in the AL almost every single simulation I've done of 2018. The only thing I can say is keep Austin Hays. He's won ROTY a handful of times in my sims.

Yea, Hays has been really good in my save as well.

pgjocki · 06-10-2018, 10:06 PM

An article that demonstrates my current feelings: http://deadsp.in/syRD0ob

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

ThePretender · 06-11-2018, 08:42 AM

Things you could do to help the O's:

Try a hockey style trade with Chris Davis. Take on more short term $$ so you get out of the contract sooner. For instance, Pujols for Davis helps you a bit, because you get out of the deal a year earlier. Think of things like this to get out of bad contracts. Even though Pujols is owed more $$, his contract ends sooner.

Pretty much there's nobody worth keeping, so just trade everybody. Not just the obvious candidates in pending FA, but pretty much everyone in the organization. So anybody on the 25 man roster, most guys on the 40 man rosters, and I'd even consider flipping the prospects as well if you don't like their skillsets.

As bad as they are you should aim to be competitive within 4-5 years. Your goal isn't to tank forever. Maybe 1-2 years. After that you need to start adding young MLBers or prospects.

3RunHomer · 06-11-2018, 09:41 AM

I tried an “alternative history 2018 Orioles” team. Basically I undid the stupid things the team has done. I used commissioner mode to move Davis, Trumbo, Cobb, Cashner, O’Day and their stupid contracts to other teams. In my alternate timeline those bad contracts never happened! And I used commissioner mode to bring back all of the pitchers that the Orioles traded away for nothing: Arrieta, Davies, Hader, ERod, Triggs, Brault and even Bridwell and Miranda. That filled out the rotation and bullpen.

After all that, the 2018 Orioles weren’t great, but they weren’t horrible like the real life team. They finished slightly below .500. And they were so far under budget that I extended Machado and in the offseason I signed Harper!

Dorfmann · 06-12-2018, 03:46 PM

I'm really glad that I didn't start an Orioles save in this year's game. It sounds like they are just as bad in the game as real life.

I carried over my save from last year's game and have had a ton of success. Currently in 2020, on pace for their second 100 win season in a row. I somehow won the won the World Series with them in 2018 due to a ridiculous playoff run.

I ditched some lame ducks like Trumbo and Adam Jones. I wasn't able to ditch Chris Davis' contract, but he's actually turned out to be pretty decent. I extended Machado and he's a perennial MVP candidate. I got Tyler Skaggs as a throw-in in a trade with the Angels and he won the Cy Young in 2019. Oh, I also signed Clayton Kershaw after 2018 and he's been lights out, of course.

06-10-2018, 11:28 AM	#1
RubeBaker All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: USA Posts: 641	The O's Woes The Baltimore Orioles currently suck. In all of my OOTP replay simulations, they are just as bad. I'm thinking about doing a replay with Baltimore because I think it would be fun rebuilding the Orioles even with their bad, untradeable contracts. Before the season, I thought the Detroit Tigers would be the worst team in baseball and the most fun to rebuild, but they're doing better than I thought they would. Baltimore is a mess. A hot mess. As SnaggleJ would say, "Hot garbage." The Orioles remind me of the Chicago Cubs from about 8 years ago, even more so than I thought the Detroit Tigers did. Baltimore has a lame-duck manager who most likely won't be back next year & will retire as the Cubs did with Lou Piniella. I doubt Buck Showalter will resign mid-season as Piniella did, but you never know. And I think Dan Duquette will be replaced as GM after this season. Baltimore's farm system is at the bottom or near the bottom as the Cubs was back in 2010. They're going to need to rebuild through the draft to restock the farm system as well as trades. I expect Manny Machado, Zach Britton and Adam Jones to be wearing different uniforms in August. I have noticed in ALL of my OOTP replays that Orioles owner Peter Angelos dies. Every. Single. Time. His son takes over & he actually seems more sensible than his dad. He usually is in favor of rebuilding the team where the dad still believes that Baltimore can contend. Baltimore needs to rebuild in OOTP and in real-life. If and when I take over the Orioles in OOTP, I'm going to utilize a lot of Earl Weaver strategy. I have the "Weaver On Strategy" book by Earl Weaver and Terry Pluto and "Earl Weaver Baseball" was the first baseball computer game I ever played. Right now I'm playing the 2018 Cubs and after the season we're going to make a serious run at Bryce Harper, but I'm thinking about alternating replays with the 2018 Orioles. Two teams in very different directions, but I love a challenge. Has anyone else been successful at rebuilding the Baltimore Orioles in OOTP? Last edited by RubeBaker; 06-10-2018 at 11:30 AM.

06-10-2018, 04:59 PM	#4
pgjocki All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Maryland - just outside DC Posts: 1,675	To be clear and upfront - rebuilding in OOTP is far easier than rebuilding in real life. The O's are a horribly run organization and it starts with the owner and GM both being clueless dolts who shouldn't be allowed near baseball. When they submitted the Chris Davis deal to MLB for approval the league should have disbanded the club for stupidity and announced a 30 day period for any city to pitch a plan for a new team. With that out of the way I think the best approach is to burn the team down by trading everyone on the big league roster who will get a positive return and set you site on competing in the 2020 to 2021 timeframe. In theory you can sign Manny to a monster deal extension since you are trading everyone else and front load the deal to pay him $35 to $50 million a year for 2 to 3 years then have it drop down to the low $20's once the team should be good again. __________________ - - - World Series championships: 1926, 1931, 1934, 1942, 1944, 1946, 1964, 1967, 1982, 2006, 2011

06-10-2018, 10:06 PM	#8
pgjocki All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Maryland - just outside DC Posts: 1,675	An article that demonstrates my current feelings: http://deadsp.in/syRD0ob Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk __________________ - - - World Series championships: 1926, 1931, 1934, 1942, 1944, 1946, 1964, 1967, 1982, 2006, 2011

06-10-2018, 12:00 PM	#2
Calvert98 All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 579	Well, I am carrying-over my 2017 MLB Orioles season start to OOTP 19. I’m in 2021. The Orioles won the division in 2019, but 2018, was a 100 loss season (This happened in OOTP 18 by the way). I didn’t even downloaded and play OOTP 19 till I hit the off-season following 2019. In 2020 (my first full season with OOTP 19), they went 74-88. I play-out all of my games, so here is the breakdown of my Orioles: 2017, under 500 (OOTP 18) 2018, 100 loss season (OOTP 18) 2019, made it to the playoffs (OOTP 18) 2020, 74-88 (OOTP 19)

06-10-2018, 12:44 PM	#3
Calvert98 All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 579	So, about that 2019 season: Some things I did last year going into 2019 in OOTP 18 was extend Manny (Yea, that was expensive! and I kept him at 3B), signed SP J.Happ, traded for SP Martin Perez, and brought in an outstanding IFA from Japan for about $14 million a year. I let Britton and Jones walk and traded Trumbo, but had to retain about 50% of his salary (still helped), and I extended Schoop early on a decent contract. Also, I have had great success in turning a couple mid-20's AAA/Utility great glove kind of guys into everyday players, to make up for the loss of power. I added pitching depth to AAA (both rotation and RPs; lots of guys with options). And I brought in a new pitching coach at both levels. Bundy retired with an injury; I think he could have rode it out however, but I understand his desire to stay healthy. I brought back Matt Wieters, who's track-record and leadership has made a noticeable difference in the clubhouse. The catchers were he and Joseph in 2019. The Gas-man (Kevin G.), managed to find his grove that year, with 17 wins and an ERA of around 4.05. Wining seems to be putting him in the right frame of mind. Then in 2020, my pitching collapsed. I didn’t have the depth to even sustain Happ’s constant stints on the DL and Gausman went back to form and the bullpen again, began to go under. It was a bit of a mess, and with the G Man’s new 5 year, $12 million a year contract, I decided to move him and the Nat’s gave me Scherzer, and but I ended getting stuck with $29 million of his salary, so it was sort of a wash. I also made a staff change or two.

06-10-2018, 09:41 PM	#5
Calvert98 All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2010 Posts: 579	I agree that rebuilding the team in OOTP is easier due to what appears to be a rather dysfunctional decision making process inside the organization. Folks place blame at DD’s feet often, and I’m not saying there isn’t some, but I really don’t know how much leeway he really has, and that makes it real difficult to do his job. Ownership simply needs to set an annual budget and then step aside, and hand the keys over to a good GM for 5 years. Anyway, I’m not actually sure how easy it is to rebuild this team in OOTP, which tells me something about how tough it must be in real life given that decision making process. I was finally able to move Davis for example, but that wasn’t till 2020, and I had to package him with a good rookie pitcher who only had 1 year of service time and a couple B prospects, and then still eat 50% of his contract. And then 2021 started off rough; I hit a 14 game losing streak (was like 4 and 20 I think) and then actually started over the save from a back-up dated the day after opening day that year, which I now regret. I should have just roughed it out. So now, I plan to just quit and start over, and I’ll start with the 2018 season and see what happens. I will keep that other save “on file”, but I doubt I will return to it.

06-10-2018, 09:56 PM	#6
The Yurpman Major Leagues Join Date: Jul 2012 Posts: 320	They definitely suck in every single MLB QS I've played. They've ended up the worst team in the AL almost every single simulation I've done of 2018. The only thing I can say is keep Austin Hays. He's won ROTY a handful of times in my sims.

06-11-2018, 08:42 AM	#9
ThePretender All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,331	Things you could do to help the O's: Try a hockey style trade with Chris Davis. Take on more short term $$ so you get out of the contract sooner. For instance, Pujols for Davis helps you a bit, because you get out of the deal a year earlier. Think of things like this to get out of bad contracts. Even though Pujols is owed more $$, his contract ends sooner. Pretty much there's nobody worth keeping, so just trade everybody. Not just the obvious candidates in pending FA, but pretty much everyone in the organization. So anybody on the 25 man roster, most guys on the 40 man rosters, and I'd even consider flipping the prospects as well if you don't like their skillsets. As bad as they are you should aim to be competitive within 4-5 years. Your goal isn't to tank forever. Maybe 1-2 years. After that you need to start adding young MLBers or prospects.

06-11-2018, 09:41 AM	#10
3RunHomer Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 23	I tried an “alternative history 2018 Orioles” team. Basically I undid the stupid things the team has done. I used commissioner mode to move Davis, Trumbo, Cobb, Cashner, O’Day and their stupid contracts to other teams. In my alternate timeline those bad contracts never happened! And I used commissioner mode to bring back all of the pitchers that the Orioles traded away for nothing: Arrieta, Davies, Hader, ERod, Triggs, Brault and even Bridwell and Miranda. That filled out the rotation and bullpen. After all that, the 2018 Orioles weren’t great, but they weren’t horrible like the real life team. They finished slightly below .500. And they were so far under budget that I extended Machado and in the offseason I signed Harper!

06-12-2018, 03:46 PM	#11
Dorfmann Minors (Double A) Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: Baltimore, Maryland Posts: 144	I'm really glad that I didn't start an Orioles save in this year's game. It sounds like they are just as bad in the game as real life. I carried over my save from last year's game and have had a ton of success. Currently in 2020, on pace for their second 100 win season in a row. I somehow won the won the World Series with them in 2018 due to a ridiculous playoff run. I ditched some lame ducks like Trumbo and Adam Jones. I wasn't able to ditch Chris Davis' contract, but he's actually turned out to be pretty decent. I extended Machado and he's a perennial MVP candidate. I got Tyler Skaggs as a throw-in in a trade with the Angels and he won the Cy Young in 2019. Oh, I also signed Clayton Kershaw after 2018 and he's been lights out, of course.