Utility 1 Starting over Starters?

batty · 12-30-2017, 04:35 PM

Hi everyone,

I just upgraded to OOTP18 and started a fresh game, but I'm a bit confused over how I've assigned my starters.

I simmed through most of Spring Training, with some time scheduled for my backups to prove themselves. But my Utility 1 players are starting twice as often as the Starter and Utility 2 players, when they're supposed to play every 4th on average. Assigning a Utility 2 to play twice as much also had the opposite effect.

I normally run Spring Training this way and it's worked in previous versions. 7-Day Lineups are off, Team Control is set to use my choices at the MLB level, and my manager is not refusing GM control

Did I miss something, or am I using the interface wrong? The same ratios seem to be in use, just for the wrong players.

Here's my chart:https://imgur.com/a/rtd94

Thanks in advance if anyone can shine some light on this.

Dyzalot · 12-30-2017, 10:50 PM

I have no answers since you only showed us the depth chart/lineup vs LHP.

batty · 12-31-2017, 12:44 AM

Sorry about that - both are identical. I set it for one and copied it to the other. The only real difference is batters 4-8 being shuffled around in the lineup.

Dyzalot · 12-31-2017, 01:16 AM

Hmm... makes no sense to me then. I mean you have Urena set to start every other game & yet he only has three starts.

bwburke94 · 12-31-2017, 02:56 AM

Spring training lineups were altered for OOTP 18, so that the backups get more playing time.

Dyzalot · 12-31-2017, 02:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bwburke94

Spring training lineups were altered for OOTP 18, so that the backups get more playing time.

They weren't altered to override your lineup settings though, were they?

batty · 12-31-2017, 04:10 AM

Interesting - Are there any details of how it works, so it won't conflict with my setup if I'm already accounting for that? I didn't see anything in the manual.

I enjoy using Spring Training as a test for underappreciated players so I always arranged it manually. But I don't want to skew the results this much especially if it means my regulars are going into the season covered in rust.

Dyzalot · 12-31-2017, 04:54 AM

Your regulars aren't going into the season covered with rust. Your regulars could go through the entirety of ST without starting a single game and would still get enough playing time to shake off the rust.

NoOne · 12-31-2017, 02:22 PM

it ignores forced "SP" too. it's a good thing. pretty sure it ignores forced fielding positions too... i haven't paid enough attention.

most* promote at least a few mil players for ST. some of which may have forced roles in minor leagues. i do this for any important prospect as well as for diversifying defense before the majors. it's a pain in the @ to turn all of that to "none" then back again after demoting. as well as other similar contexts.

i'm not sure if it disregards depth chart completely. i've always had the habit of starting the backups 3rd/4th day in ST. it would be nice if i don't have to do this anymore.. simply promote and ignore is a plus from my perspective in regards to ST.

it's worked similarly for longer than just this release. i can't speak to any small changes to the general way it works though. it has subbed or used players differently than reg/playoffs for a while is what i mean. sp get ~4ip per start as one example.

as far as rust, i think jsut being on an active roster helps knock it off, but games played may or may not be required or maybe they speed it up?

you'd have to know a relative % likelihood of starting of the year good/average/bad, then compare with no games played during ST, all other factors the same. that would tell you definitively if playing any games in ST matters.... since they sub so much, at the very least not much is actually required... more about time on calendar, most likely

i often have 6th / 7th rp with very long periods of time between gp. sometimes i have a couple above them take a dump and when they move into a heavy-use role, they are do fine after possibly months of very little use while in the mlb upto that point. but again, that only shows you don't accumulate rust while in season AND on an active roster with no current rust to start. that doesn't account for all contexts.

Dyzalot · 12-31-2017, 03:35 PM

Just being on the roster does not knock off rust from the offseason. You must get playing time.

NoOne · 12-31-2017, 05:36 PM

manual says each AB or IP knocks it off... there's your independent variable straight from a source.

rust doesn't accumulate in-season, unless that changed. so, long periods off during a season aren't a problem once any 'rust' is knoced off.

they should really make this align more logically, lol. they practice and stay in game shape on an active roster and that prevents any rust (excludes offseason), but it does nothing about knocking it off. a bit inconsistent. has a causal relationship in one hand, then in similar contexts it does not. how can it prevent somethign but also not help get rid of it (relative to context of physical training etc -- there are plenty of irrelevant examples that do not adhere to that statement).

dpd376 · 01-06-2018, 01:35 PM

I think the current ST logic just tries to get everybody on the depth chart a similar number of at-bats. With pitching it seems to pitch the top 10 pitchers and give nothing to the rest. At least that's my experience, and it means I don't have to micro-manage ST.

12-30-2017, 04:35 PM	#1
batty Bat Boy Join Date: Dec 2017 Posts: 3	Utility 1 Starting over Starters? Hi everyone, I just upgraded to OOTP18 and started a fresh game, but I'm a bit confused over how I've assigned my starters. I simmed through most of Spring Training, with some time scheduled for my backups to prove themselves. But my Utility 1 players are starting twice as often as the Starter and Utility 2 players, when they're supposed to play every 4th on average. Assigning a Utility 2 to play twice as much also had the opposite effect. I normally run Spring Training this way and it's worked in previous versions. 7-Day Lineups are off, Team Control is set to use my choices at the MLB level, and my manager is not refusing GM control Did I miss something, or am I using the interface wrong? The same ratios seem to be in use, just for the wrong players. Here's my chart:https://imgur.com/a/rtd94 Thanks in advance if anyone can shine some light on this.

12-31-2017, 12:44 AM	#3
batty Bat Boy Join Date: Dec 2017 Posts: 3	Sorry about that - both are identical. I set it for one and copied it to the other. The only real difference is batters 4-8 being shuffled around in the lineup. Last edited by batty; 12-31-2017 at 12:57 AM.

12-31-2017, 04:10 AM	#7
batty Bat Boy Join Date: Dec 2017 Posts: 3	Interesting - Are there any details of how it works, so it won't conflict with my setup if I'm already accounting for that? I didn't see anything in the manual. I enjoy using Spring Training as a test for underappreciated players so I always arranged it manually. But I don't want to skew the results this much especially if it means my regulars are going into the season covered in rust. Last edited by batty; 12-31-2017 at 04:14 AM.

12-31-2017, 02:22 PM	#9
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/1 (3)	it ignores forced "SP" too. it's a good thing. pretty sure it ignores forced fielding positions too... i haven't paid enough attention. most* promote at least a few mil players for ST. some of which may have forced roles in minor leagues. i do this for any important prospect as well as for diversifying defense before the majors. it's a pain in the @ to turn all of that to "none" then back again after demoting. as well as other similar contexts. i'm not sure if it disregards depth chart completely. i've always had the habit of starting the backups 3rd/4th day in ST. it would be nice if i don't have to do this anymore.. simply promote and ignore is a plus from my perspective in regards to ST. it's worked similarly for longer than just this release. i can't speak to any small changes to the general way it works though. it has subbed or used players differently than reg/playoffs for a while is what i mean. sp get ~4ip per start as one example. as far as rust, i think jsut being on an active roster helps knock it off, but games played may or may not be required or maybe they speed it up? you'd have to know a relative % likelihood of starting of the year good/average/bad, then compare with no games played during ST, all other factors the same. that would tell you definitively if playing any games in ST matters.... since they sub so much, at the very least not much is actually required... more about time on calendar, most likely i often have 6th / 7th rp with very long periods of time between gp. sometimes i have a couple above them take a dump and when they move into a heavy-use role, they are do fine after possibly months of very little use while in the mlb upto that point. but again, that only shows you don't accumulate rust while in season AND on an active roster with no current rust to start. that doesn't account for all contexts. Last edited by NoOne; 12-31-2017 at 02:25 PM.

12-31-2017, 05:36 PM	#11
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/1 (3)	manual says each AB or IP knocks it off... there's your independent variable straight from a source. rust doesn't accumulate in-season, unless that changed. so, long periods off during a season aren't a problem once any 'rust' is knoced off. they should really make this align more logically, lol. they practice and stay in game shape on an active roster and that prevents any rust (excludes offseason), but it does nothing about knocking it off. a bit inconsistent. has a causal relationship in one hand, then in similar contexts it does not. how can it prevent somethign but also not help get rid of it (relative to context of physical training etc -- there are plenty of irrelevant examples that do not adhere to that statement). Last edited by NoOne; 12-31-2017 at 05:38 PM.

12-30-2017, 10:50 PM	#2
Dyzalot All Star Starter Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,740	I have no answers since you only showed us the depth chart/lineup vs LHP.

12-31-2017, 01:16 AM	#4
Dyzalot All Star Starter Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,740	Hmm... makes no sense to me then. I mean you have Urena set to start every other game & yet he only has three starts.

12-31-2017, 02:56 AM	#5
bwburke94 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Belchertown, MA, USA Posts: 4,522	Spring training lineups were altered for OOTP 18, so that the backups get more playing time.

12-31-2017, 04:54 AM	#8
Dyzalot All Star Starter Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,740	Your regulars aren't going into the season covered with rust. Your regulars could go through the entirety of ST without starting a single game and would still get enough playing time to shake off the rust.

12-31-2017, 03:35 PM	#10
Dyzalot All Star Starter Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 1,740	Just being on the roster does not knock off rust from the offseason. You must get playing time.

01-06-2018, 01:35 PM	#12
dpd376 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 104	I think the current ST logic just tries to get everybody on the depth chart a similar number of at-bats. With pitching it seems to pitch the top 10 pitchers and give nothing to the rest. At least that's my experience, and it means I don't have to micro-manage ST. __________________ "I hate astroturf, but I love the game astroturf produces." Bill James