Turning RP into SP

Rosco Peabody · 05-25-2017, 09:56 AM

What are your thoughts on turning RP into SP?

Obviously a RP is less valuable than a SP, but sometimes, if there is an elite reliever who has high stamina, I feel like I can use him more effectively as a starter. In fact, one of the best starters on my staff was like that.

What do you guys think about that? Is that cheating?

Curve Ball Dave · 05-25-2017, 10:07 AM

It's not cheating. Adam Wainwright was a closer, for instance.

You put guys in the position you feel will best help your team win.

Rosco Peabody · 05-25-2017, 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curve Ball Dave

It's not cheating. Adam Wainwright was a closer, for instance.

You put guys in the position you feel will best help your team win.

The problem is that the computer never does it. They turn SP into RP, but never turn a dominant RP into a SP. If you're doing an inaugural draft, you can get a real advantage doing this

NoOne · 05-25-2017, 10:54 AM

i did a few tests... once just with 1 player, then edited a full rotation of them on 1 team for 5 or more years... 2 elite pitches, very high stamina etc..

they are a total flip of the coin relative to season-long stats... and can say that per start too... relative to their ratings, they definitely underperform as SP in a roughly modern MLB statistical evnvironment.

they might be better than a 'lesser' 4-5th rotation member on average, but will not be dependable. i'd still go with the 3-pitch guy with slightly lower ratings, if possible and usually is for a 3rd SP in rotation.

depending on how you play, it's feasible you encounter a situation where it's a good idea. you'd have to have a really weak rotation and really strong pen for it to make sense or some whacky statistical environment that favors them or levels the playing field at least.

Bulldawgz24 · 05-25-2017, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoOne

i did a few tests... once just with 1 player, then edited a full rotation of them on 1 team for 5 or more years... 2 elite pitches, very high stamina etc..

they are a total flip of the coin relative to season-long stats... and can say that per start too... relative to their ratings, they definitely underperform as SP in a roughly modern MLB statistical evnvironment.

they might be better than a 'lesser' 4-5th rotation member on average, but will not be dependable. i'd still go with the 3-pitch guy with slightly lower ratings, if possible and usually is for a 3rd SP in rotation.

depending on how you play, it's feasible you encounter a situation where it's a good idea. you'd have to have a really weak rotation and really strong pen for it to make sense or some whacky statistical environment that favors them or levels the playing field at least.

I moved Shane Greene from the pen to the starting rotation, but he has starter type ratings anyhow. He is my #5 in the rotation but so far has the best ERA of the group at 2.40 ERA.

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chriskelly · 05-25-2017, 03:16 PM

Really not cheating, especially if you are taking over a team, or doing an expansion draft, or trading. If you are doing an inaug draft; maybe. it's like you know a secret the AI doesn't. Similar thing is to look for amateur hitters with good pitching potential, or vice-versa

JPL86 · 05-25-2017, 03:30 PM

I'm running a Fictional league where I have a World Baseball Classic every other year. I've seen the AI put a really good RP/CL as a Starting Pitcher in the WBC on a few occasions, but not in the Regular Season.

'94 EXPOS · 05-25-2017, 03:47 PM

In previous versions I have had success with employing this strategy. I have found the best I can get out of them is 2 years as an effective starter then their stats go south as a starter.

I don't think it is 'cheating'...although I understand the argument...but given that I have never seen it work as a long term solution I view it more as a moneyball style gamble on my part...similar to using a good D high contact '1 start' 2nd base that is not valued by the AI...there has to be some flexibility/creativity for the human player IMO

Just my 2 cents!

wallewalls · 05-27-2017, 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rosco Peabody

The problem is that the computer never does it. They turn SP into RP, but never turn a dominant RP into a SP. If you're doing an inaugural draft, you can get a real advantage doing this

I've seen the AI turn dominant closers with 2 pitches into starters, and they did well for the most part

05-25-2017, 09:56 AM	#1
Rosco Peabody All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: South of Boston, Massachusetts Posts: 1,092	Turning RP into SP What are your thoughts on turning RP into SP? Obviously a RP is less valuable than a SP, but sometimes, if there is an elite reliever who has high stamina, I feel like I can use him more effectively as a starter. In fact, one of the best starters on my staff was like that. What do you guys think about that? Is that cheating?

05-25-2017, 10:07 AM	#2
Curve Ball Dave Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 2,395	It's not cheating. Adam Wainwright was a closer, for instance. You put guys in the position you feel will best help your team win. __________________ "Hitting is timing. Pitching is upsetting timing"-Warren Spahn.

05-25-2017, 10:54 AM	#4
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/1 (3)	i did a few tests... once just with 1 player, then edited a full rotation of them on 1 team for 5 or more years... 2 elite pitches, very high stamina etc.. they are a total flip of the coin relative to season-long stats... and can say that per start too... relative to their ratings, they definitely underperform as SP in a roughly modern MLB statistical evnvironment. they might be better than a 'lesser' 4-5th rotation member on average, but will not be dependable. i'd still go with the 3-pitch guy with slightly lower ratings, if possible and usually is for a 3rd SP in rotation. depending on how you play, it's feasible you encounter a situation where it's a good idea. you'd have to have a really weak rotation and really strong pen for it to make sense or some whacky statistical environment that favors them or levels the playing field at least. Last edited by NoOne; 05-25-2017 at 10:58 AM.

05-25-2017, 03:16 PM	#6
chriskelly All Star Reserve Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 753	Really not cheating, especially if you are taking over a team, or doing an expansion draft, or trading. If you are doing an inaug draft; maybe. it's like you know a secret the AI doesn't. Similar thing is to look for amateur hitters with good pitching potential, or vice-versa

05-25-2017, 03:30 PM	#7
JPL86 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 170	I'm running a Fictional league where I have a World Baseball Classic every other year. I've seen the AI put a really good RP/CL as a Starting Pitcher in the WBC on a few occasions, but not in the Regular Season.

05-25-2017, 03:47 PM	#8
'94 EXPOS Major Leagues Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 323	In previous versions I have had success with employing this strategy. I have found the best I can get out of them is 2 years as an effective starter then their stats go south as a starter. I don't think it is 'cheating'...although I understand the argument...but given that I have never seen it work as a long term solution I view it more as a moneyball style gamble on my part...similar to using a good D high contact '1 start' 2nd base that is not valued by the AI...there has to be some flexibility/creativity for the human player IMO Just my 2 cents!