Players signing for way less with other teams

DrSatan · 03-13-2017, 08:22 AM

I tried searching the forums for similar issues with no luck. I am consistently unable to resign outgoing free agents or free agents period because they want waaay too much money. Then I get emails stating the player signed with another team. When I check the contract it is often for less than half what I was offering. Is it a market size thing? I play with player personality on, but morale off. Also, my team is a winner with 6 straight division titles and 2 championships during that span. This is my only fictional league, so I'm wondering if I overlooked a setting someplace. I haven't noticed it in my MLB leagues to this severity.

Market size - Average
Fan Loyalty - Avg
Fan Interest - 90
League - Fictional
Poor - Superstar Salary - $750K-$20M
League Age - 11 yrs

Do the players account for other contracts on the team and ask for similar based on my history? I have one large contract of $34M, but it was recent and I've been seeing this trend since day one.

SFGiantsFan · 03-13-2017, 03:35 PM

Salaries tend to be really high early in free agency. I've learned to wait a couple days/weeks and just watch the demand fall a little before I make my offer. Be careful though because sometimes they can sign while you're still watching them so use your best judgment to what you can afford. Sometimes you get into a bidding war if you wait though and you may end up paying more than you wanted.

Brad K · 03-15-2017, 03:23 PM

The game does a good job of simulating reality. In contract negotiations a player asks for what he hopes to receive. Whether that's rational or not varies. Some players hold out for silly things (like a 30 year old asking for an 8 year contract) and others just roll over and accept a reasonable offer. Sounds real to me.

Free agency is an open market and the buyer determines the price. Part of the issue is what other players are available. So you get a free agency year where there is one 4 star 1B and everyone else is 2 or 1 star, that 4 star player might bring superstar money.

NoOne · 03-15-2017, 06:41 PM

it's a bit about timing with FA.

also, if you did anything different from default with financials, you may want to look into that being a cause - max cash on hand (~10M), market size distribution of league, the more important stuff. (hopefully you didn't mess with baselines). some stuff will be relative or in scale, regardless, but an over abundance of money will cause large FA demands.

if you have a big budget they will ask for a ton of money when approached for an extension. FA will almost always provide a cheaper contract on those particular players (greed most likely, but more?).

if you bid immediately when their asking price is high, you cannot go lower... so, choose wisely. don't underbid a demand too much, but the larger ones can be underbid more than a smaller contract, obviously. at some point it's less about the demand and more about the bids from various teams... but you can't submit it when it's "too low" for the player to consider it (~"Offering" while negotiating in the game)-- This is where the AI has a bit of an advantage, they just plop their bid down and it's your timing that influences the outcome.

****The Meat****
So, bid after the price is dropping toward, but not necessarily reached, a more normal range for your league relative to the quality of that player and demand/supply forces of market....Timing: underbid that demand when your offer will be considered by player and higher than what you expect the other bidders to offer = signing player at a much cheaper price than extension demand or FA demand.... sometimes that player may just get paid too much - it happens in a free market. be willing to lose that bidding war in most situations.

i wouldn't test the waters more than once and expect good outcomes (player refuses offer, gets unhappy(-er))... maybe there's more tolerance to a refused offer, but with great players that i target, i err on the safe side.

if you did it right, there shouldn't be a bidding war... when the inevitable rarity happens, it's just a matter of how high you can afford without damaging the future. when competing like this with AI, inching upward is the Worst way to do it. bully them but stay reasonable (FA bidding wars, international amatuer FA too).
********
how many similar options on the market? overall strength of all other options, even if not of the same quality?

teams involved? how much money do they have? how many roster holes... anything relevant to their money situation and demand for the player.

how high is the initial asking price relative to 'normal' high-end contracts in your league? the financial report lists the top-25 per year contracts - that can help in the decision. but, there is a bit of a learning curve if oyu never looked at it before... some situations will get some players paid a bit more than normal in your league on a rare occasion.

e.g. i see <40M/yr as the highest, religiously, but i fully expect to see a mid 40's or maybe even ~50 at some point. it will just take 2-3 of the larger markets bidding on a HoF or extreme need with few other choices in the AI's mind. that's a player i will never pay for... but each to their own. (avg rev per team ~170-180M in a given year, full budgets available)

the game won't spend more than X% of its budget on one player (or some sort of check like that - doesn't have to be as simple). i'm guessing it's 20-25%ish under most circumstances from my experience but not looking closely.

03-13-2017, 08:22 AM	#1
DrSatan All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Parts Unknown Posts: 623	Players signing for way less with other teams I tried searching the forums for similar issues with no luck. I am consistently unable to resign outgoing free agents or free agents period because they want waaay too much money. Then I get emails stating the player signed with another team. When I check the contract it is often for less than half what I was offering. Is it a market size thing? I play with player personality on, but morale off. Also, my team is a winner with 6 straight division titles and 2 championships during that span. This is my only fictional league, so I'm wondering if I overlooked a setting someplace. I haven't noticed it in my MLB leagues to this severity. Market size - Average Fan Loyalty - Avg Fan Interest - 90 League - Fictional Poor - Superstar Salary - $750K-$20M League Age - 11 yrs Do the players account for other contracts on the team and ask for similar based on my history? I have one large contract of $34M, but it was recent and I've been seeing this trend since day one.

03-15-2017, 06:41 PM	#4
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/1 (3)	it's a bit about timing with FA. also, if you did anything different from default with financials, you may want to look into that being a cause - max cash on hand (~10M), market size distribution of league, the more important stuff. (hopefully you didn't mess with baselines). some stuff will be relative or in scale, regardless, but an over abundance of money will cause large FA demands. if you have a big budget they will ask for a ton of money when approached for an extension. FA will almost always provide a cheaper contract on those particular players (greed most likely, but more?). if you bid immediately when their asking price is high, you cannot go lower... so, choose wisely. don't underbid a demand too much, but the larger ones can be underbid more than a smaller contract, obviously. at some point it's less about the demand and more about the bids from various teams... but you can't submit it when it's "too low" for the player to consider it (~"Offering" while negotiating in the game)-- This is where the AI has a bit of an advantage, they just plop their bid down and it's your timing that influences the outcome. **The Meat So, bid after the price is dropping toward, but not necessarily reached, a more normal range for your league relative to the quality of that player and demand/supply forces of market....Timing: underbid that demand when your offer will be considered by player and higher than what you expect the other bidders to offer = signing player at a much cheaper price than extension demand or FA demand.... sometimes that player may just get paid too much - it happens in a free market. be willing to lose that bidding war in most situations. i wouldn't test the waters more than once and expect good outcomes (player refuses offer, gets unhappy(-er))... maybe there's more tolerance to a refused offer, but with great players that i target, i err on the safe side. if you did it right, there shouldn't be a bidding war... when the inevitable rarity happens, it's just a matter of how high you can afford without damaging the future. when competing like this with AI, inching upward is the Worst way to do it. bully them but stay reasonable (FA bidding wars, international amatuer FA too). ****** how many similar options on the market? overall strength of all other options, even if not of the same quality? teams involved? how much money do they have? how many roster holes... anything relevant to their money situation and demand for the player. how high is the initial asking price relative to 'normal' high-end contracts in your league? the financial report lists the top-25 per year contracts - that can help in the decision. but, there is a bit of a learning curve if oyu never looked at it before... some situations will get some players paid a bit more than normal in your league on a rare occasion. e.g. i see <40M/yr as the highest, religiously, but i fully expect to see a mid 40's or maybe even ~50 at some point. it will just take 2-3 of the larger markets bidding on a HoF or extreme need with few other choices in the AI's mind. that's a player i will never pay for... but each to their own. (avg rev per team ~170-180M in a given year, full budgets available) the game won't spend more than X% of its budget on one player (or some sort of check like that - doesn't have to be as simple). i'm guessing it's 20-25%ish under most circumstances from my experience but not looking closely. Last edited by NoOne; 03-15-2017 at 06:57 PM.

03-13-2017, 03:35 PM	#2
SFGiantsFan Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 40	Salaries tend to be really high early in free agency. I've learned to wait a couple days/weeks and just watch the demand fall a little before I make my offer. Be careful though because sometimes they can sign while you're still watching them so use your best judgment to what you can afford. Sometimes you get into a bidding war if you wait though and you may end up paying more than you wanted.

03-15-2017, 03:23 PM	#3
Brad K Banned Join Date: May 2016 Location: St Petersburg Florida USA Posts: 6,693 Infractions: 0/2 (4)	The game does a good job of simulating reality. In contract negotiations a player asks for what he hopes to receive. Whether that's rational or not varies. Some players hold out for silly things (like a 30 year old asking for an 8 year contract) and others just roll over and accept a reasonable offer. Sounds real to me. Free agency is an open market and the buyer determines the price. Part of the issue is what other players are available. So you get a free agency year where there is one 4 star 1B and everyone else is 2 or 1 star, that 4 star player might bring superstar money.