Suspended Game Roster Rules

[dlw2711]

It's my first time having a suspended game in OOTP, and it was the last game of a series, so the end of the game was postponed for about 2 months (the next time we meet). What are the rules about the rosters? I assume there will be a lot of roster moves (by both teams) by then. Who will be eligible to participate in the game?

[RchW]

Originally Posted by dlw2711

It's my first time having a suspended game in OOTP, and it was the last game of a series, so the end of the game was postponed for about 2 months (the next time we meet). What are the rules about the rosters? I assume there will be a lot of roster moves (by both teams) by then. Who will be eligible to participate in the game?

Those on the roster at the time the game is resumed. Could it be any other way?

[Le Grande Orange]

Here is what it says in the 2016 Official Baseball Rules:

A suspended game shall be resumed at the exact point of suspension of the original game. The completion of a suspended game is a continuation of the original game. The lineup and batting order of both teams shall be exactly the same as the lineup and batting order at the moment of suspension, subject to the rules governing substitution. Any player may be replaced by a player who had not been in the game prior to the suspension. No player removed before the suspension may be returned to the lineup.

A player who was not with the club when the game was suspended may be used as a substitute, even if he has taken the place of a player no longer with the club who would not have been eligible because he had been removed from the lineup before the game was suspended.

If immediately prior to the call of a suspended game, a substitute pitcher has been announced but has not retired the side or pitched until the batter becomes a base runner, such pitcher, when the suspended game is later resumed may, but is not required to start the resumed portion of the game. However, if he does not start he will be considered as having been substituted for and may not be used in that game.

How closely or how well OOTP replicates this I cannot say. (I can say OOTP attributes the statistics of a suspended game incorrectly. By rule statistics from a suspended game are credited to the date the game was started; OOTP attributes the statistics to the date the game was completed.)

[Orioles1966]

If a relief pitcher pitched and finished the top of the ninth and gave up the lead run and then the game got suspended and he get's traded to the team which scored the go ahead run then that means he could appear in relief for his new team and he could give up the tying and winning run which means he could both win and lose the game. That is if it's true that a new player could appear if he wasn't with his current team in the original game.

I think we had a long discussion about this in the past(players playing on both teams,same game).

[bwburke94]

OOTP botches the rule in some aspects. I've called up a guy after the initial game only to have him ineligible for the resumption.

[dlw2711]

Originally Posted by bwburke94

OOTP botches the rule in some aspects. I've called up a guy after the initial game only to have him ineligible for the resumption.

Can you elaborate on what happened here?

[bwburke94]

Don't remember the details. I'll try to find the box score.

[Le Grande Orange]

Personally, I think suspended games should be removed, for the following reasons.

(1) They are rare events at the major league level—there have been only 80 suspended games in the majors over the last 40 years. (They are more frequent in the minors, but that's because the minors allow for a game to be suspended under a greater range of situations.)

(2) As mentioned above, the majors and minors use different rules for suspended games.

(3) The rules regarding when a major league game can be suspended have changed over the years.

(4) Suspended games can result in all sorts of strange statistical oddities, if the rules are implemented accurately.

Combine all the above and you have something that's more trouble than it's worth. I would gladly trade suspended games for OOTP handling postponed and rescheduled games better.

[Westheim]

Meanwhile, in his mad end of the world, Westheim just had a game suspended in which his guy threw a no-hitter through six ... for the second time.

[Westheim]

How good is OOTP 17 with suspended games after all? Since 16, what I'm still running, ain't that great...

The game below was suspended in the top of the seventh two months ago. Since then, the Loggers have placed Dally, Rucker, and Jones on the DL. They were all in the field in the top 7th before being pinch-hit for in the bottom 7th.

Meanwhile, my first baseman, who had since been traded, is missing from the box score (!), while his logical replacement on the roster, the new first baseman, was ineligible to compete in this game, and I had to play with a short bench as a result of that.

I assume that's why the Loggers lost. They were out of pinch-hitters in the bottom 10th with the tying run on third base and one out, and had to bat their reliever. Guy struck out, Loggers lost, not that it makes a difference in their bid for the worst record.

I'm curious whether any of this has improved in the new version.

[OldFatGuy]

Originally Posted by Westheim

Meanwhile, my first baseman, who had since been traded, is missing from the box score (!), while his logical replacement on the roster, the new first baseman, was ineligible to compete in this game, and I had to play with a short bench as a result of that.

Yeah, that is absolutely wrong. Unless that replacement 1B had already been in the suspended game and taken out, he was most certainly eligible, as would be any other new players on the roster.

Otherwise, imagine a suspended game in oh, say late June, which resumes in late Aug between two teams that were very busy in the non-waiver trade deadline. It's possible they wouldn't even be able to field nine players if new players were not eligible.

[rpriske]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

Personally, I think suspended games should be removed, for the following reasons.

I couldn't disagree more. With the 'fight' to get the game to reflect real life more and more, taking a feature OUT is a step backwards.

80 suspended games in 40 years? So 2 a year? So not, in any way, rare?

[OldFatGuy]

Originally Posted by RchW

Those on the roster at the time the game is resumed. Could it be any other way?

Yeah, this, with the caveat... if they were already removed from the game, they wouldn't be eligible to return.

[Westheim]

Originally Posted by rpriske

I couldn't disagree more. With the 'fight' to get the game to reflect real life more and more, taking a feature OUT is a step backwards.

80 suspended games in 40 years? So 2 a year? So not, in any way, rare?

If we take out suspended games (2 a year), do we also take out no-hitters (2 a year)?

[OldFatGuy]

Originally Posted by Orioles1966

If a relief pitcher pitched and finished the top of the ninth and gave up the lead run and then the game got suspended and he get's traded to the team which scored the go ahead run then that means he could appear in relief for his new team and he could give up the tying and winning run which means he could both win and lose the game. That is if it's true that a new player could appear if he wasn't with his current team in the original game.

I think we had a long discussion about this in the past(players playing on both teams,same game).

No, I don't think this is possible. If a player has already appeared in and been removed a game, he is no longer eligible to re-enter the game, even for the other team. I'm not 100% sure that's correct, but I'm pretty sure that's the way it works. Once a player is removed from a game, he can't re-enter it... period.

[Westheim]

Note to the box score above: Jon Merritt did not pinch-run on the original game date. He is the substitute for the departed first baseman.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by rpriske

I couldn't disagree more. With the 'fight' to get the game to reflect real life more and more, taking a feature OUT is a step backwards.

As I've stated, OOTP does NOT handle suspended games correctly according to the real-life rules: statistics from a suspended game are credited to the date the game was started. In OOTP, it's the opposite: statistics are credited to the date the game was finished.

Consider what happens in real life with a suspended game: the result of that game (i.e. which team won and lost) isn't known until the date the game is completed, but the result is credited to the date the game was started. That means once the game is completed, the results have to be retroactively applied to the standings back to the original date of the game.

As for player statistical quirks, read this article, which documents some of the strangeness arising from the rule.

Originally Posted by rpriske

With the 'fight' to get 80 suspended games in 40 years? So 2 a year? So not, in any way, rare?

Two games being suspended as a result of weather or other conditions out of 2430 games scheduled. That's 1 in 1215, or 0.082%, I'd say that's rare. (Moreover, has anyone actually studied the rate at which games in OOTP are suspended? I suspect the frequency is higher than it ought to be, at least for the major leagues. And as noted previously, OOTP incorrectly attributes major league suspended game rules to the minor leagues.)

The time spent coding suspended games could have been spent providing for better and more robust postponed and rescheduled game routines.

We still don't have proper two-for-one doubleheaders, for example (these are a long-time staple of professional baseball; indeed, the 2017 MLB schedule actually includes such a doubleheader as a scheduled event). Nor do teams sometimes not play out their entire schedule due to postponements. (That is also, incidentally, a very common feature of real-life baseball. Want numbers on how often and to what degree clubs don't play out their full schedule? I have them.)

Evidently, such long-time and real-life aspects of pro baseball are less important than incorrectly applied and differentiated suspended game rules...

Originally Posted by Westheim

If we take out suspended games (2 a year), do we also take out no-hitters (2 a year)?

Comparing player performances to league operating rules is a very strange thing to do. You may as well compare solar flares to cucumbers.

[Westheim]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

Two games being suspended as a result of weather or other conditions out of 2430 games scheduled. That's 1 in 1215, or 0.082%, I'd say that's rare. (Moreover, has anyone actually studied the rate at which games in OOTP are suspended? I suspect the frequency is higher than it ought to be, at least for the major leagues. And as noted previously, OOTP incorrectly attributes major league suspended game rules to the minor leagues.)

The time spent coding suspended games could have been spent providing for better and more robust postponed and rescheduled game routines.

Those two go hand-in-hand. Two weeks before the game above, my team played a Tuesday double-header when both teams had Monday off. OOTP plain failed to schedule the game on Monday.

The entire postponement / suspension of games belongs to the game, but it could be done a whole lot better.

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

(That is also, incidentally, a very common feature of real-life baseball. Want numbers on how often and to what degree clubs don't play out their full schedule? I have them.)

I'm with you that teams should not play meaningless games on the Monday following the final day of the season just because there was a rainout on May 22. But by the previous logic in this thread, this applies to at most two games per year in the major leagues these days. [Actually, in the last 10 years there were seven ML games that were not made up, and only two of those in the 2010s]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

Comparing player performances to league operating rules is a very strange thing to do. You may as well compare solar flares to cucumbers.

... which is what I do for a living, thanks.