Green Arrows

james17 · 05-29-2016, 07:37 PM

Am perplexed. When the AI thinks one of your players in the minors, say AAA ball, is ready to be promoted to the major league team, it denotes his name with a big green arrow. I assume that's a cue to promote him to the majors. But what if he's still not near enough in his ratings to replace the player already there in your opinion? Will leaving him in AAA kill his further development progress if he still has quite a ways to go to hit his potential ratings?

RchW · 05-29-2016, 07:42 PM

It's just a suggestion. Still your call to decide if it's worth doing.

james17 · 05-29-2016, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RchW

It's just a suggestion. Still your call to decide if it's worth doing.

So he'll continue to develop if I just leave him there for a while longer (unless a random talent change happens)?

Déjà Bru · 05-29-2016, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by james17

So he'll continue to develop if I just leave him there for a while longer (unless a random talent change happens)?

Yes, think so. How long before he "stagnates" and stops developing is also your call!

RchW · 05-29-2016, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by james17

So he'll continue to develop if I just leave him there for a while longer (unless a random talent change happens)?

Yep and it's also not unusual for a promoted player to do badly.

MrBojangles · 05-29-2016, 10:48 PM

If you have space on your roster, you might think of promoting him for platoon duty. See how he does. The time up may help his development.

james17 · 05-29-2016, 11:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RchW

Yep and it's also not unusual for a promoted player to do badly.

OK. Thanks. I'm glad to hear that because room on my major league roster is tight.

james17 · 05-29-2016, 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrBojangles

If you have space on your roster, you might think of promoting him for platoon duty. See how he does. The time up may help his development.

I thought of that too. One way to create space would be to reduce my relievers to 6 rather than the 7 I've been carrying. But the team is doing real well. It's July and they're in first place by 8 games. At this point I don't know if I should mess with success or just wait for roster expansion in Sept.

Ah, decisions, decisions...

NoOne · 05-30-2016, 12:30 AM

this is only relative to players that are talented enough that you want to keep them around, or at least could develop into that type of player.

if you think they are a .280+ type, they are *probably near stagnation or at stagnation for AAA - Eye is important too. if they are above average current ability hitters, or above-average pitcher equivalent, an mlb bench role is probably better than AAA. sometimes waiting for eye or other lagging ratings to catch up... i've had plenty come up capable of hitting .300 and they didn't seem to lose potential... age is a key too. 28+ no need to worry about development (double check manual fo age).

a reliever as a 6th/7th pen arm is easy to do, or if decent enough a spot in the rotation...but, i'd hesitate using an SP that hasn't fully developed their third pitch as a reliever in the bigs (**theory needs testing, assuming they use 3rd best pitch less often - guessing i am wrong). otherwise, using an SP as a reliever instead of an SP in AAA is a very viable strategy. it's better than stagnating for sure.

power is a bit odd. it can develop late - even after a few years in the MLB. so, don't base much on that as far as promoting to the bigs.

even though you can get away with allowing them to develop into roughly above average MLB players in AAA, i think it's still better to get them in the MLB as soon as they are competent. the development is faster or some tangible benefit, you tend to have better coaches, and even if they aren't starting they make good bench players at cheap prices.

james17 · 05-30-2016, 12:46 AM

Hey NoOne...interesting thoughts.

If promoted to the bench in the majors will he still develop or does he have to play?

NoOne · 05-30-2016, 01:07 AM

i really don't think it matters. if he is younger than 28 (check manual), he should develop fine. i'm basing this on things like how Rust works in the game. if they are on the active roster, they are expected to be working out and practicing - no rust even without playing time. Also, the coaching interaction outside of games would not be affected.

does playing time augment it? i have no idea. i've done both often and usually they develop either way. (simmer vs bench). i prefer mlb development, if possible / at least convenient for bench. i'm nearly 100% certain statistical results will not effect development. so, don't worry about a small sample size result.

if they are really advanced, they are starters. i get rid of an aged, more expensive, and slightly better player in those situations. so, i don't see a well-rated player on the bench vs AAA simmer choice.

MrBojangles · 05-30-2016, 03:18 AM

It seems to me that guys, when first promoted to MLB level, can struggle - for as long as half of a season- before they get their "sea legs" and really begin to gel. So, I am a fan of getting prospects the MLB experience as quickly as their development/my roster allow so we can get through that break-in period and start to get real production out of them.

NoOne · 05-30-2016, 02:01 PM

it's tough to know for certain. i want to say it sounds right, but i also know a decent hitter can underperform for a year or nearly a year under normal circumstances.

i've had enough perform really well that i lean toward it being more random or a slight increase in probability as opposed to anything major.

james17 · 05-30-2016, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoOne

i really don't think it matters. if he is younger than 28 (check manual), he should develop fine. i'm basing this on things like how Rust works in the game. if they are on the active roster, they are expected to be working out and practicing - no rust even without playing time. Also, the coaching interaction outside of games would not be affected.

does playing time augment it? i have no idea. i've done both often and usually they develop either way. (simmer vs bench). i prefer mlb development, if possible / at least convenient for bench. i'm nearly 100% certain statistical results will not effect development. so, don't worry about a small sample size result.

if they are really advanced, they are starters. i get rid of an aged, more expensive, and slightly better player in those situations. so, i don't see a well-rated player on the bench vs AAA simmer choice.

Thanks for your thoughts and what you've noticed. I think I'm going to hold off a little while longer than promote him and trade the older guy who's blocking him.

NoOne · 05-31-2016, 12:17 AM

yeah, play'em if he is part of your plans. i always prefer that, when appropriate - basically anything longer than a 2-3 year commitment.

i guess i shouldn't have saiy "really advanced" above.. i just mean competent relative to his role on the team. i love young teams. with a bunch of kids, you can spend like a drunken sailor in FA for a window of years.

Statsman1 · 05-31-2016, 09:44 AM

So, presumably this means that if you select "Ask AI to set up entire organization", then those guys with the green arrows will be moved up automatically by the AI? And the RED arrow guys will be demoted?

If this is true, I wonder what criteria the AI would use to move a guy to the major league roster if there really wasn't room for a prospect that the AI deems ready for the big time.

RchW · 05-31-2016, 11:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Statsman1

So, presumably this means that if you select "Ask AI to set up entire organization", then those guys with the green arrows will be moved up automatically by the AI? And the RED arrow guys will be demoted?

If this is true, I wonder what criteria the AI would use to move a guy to the major league roster if there really wasn't room for a prospect that the AI deems ready for the big time.

That's one button that I would wholeheartedly tell people never to press. Set up entire minors is fine, you can tweak it after, but you may never undo the damage done by that fatal press.

NoOne · 06-01-2016, 12:11 AM

i'm not sure it's 100% consistent with the arrows, either.

NoOne · 06-01-2016, 12:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by james17

Thanks for your thoughts and what you've noticed. I think I'm going to hold off a little while longer than promote him and trade the older guy who's blocking him.

oops i misread that in the other reply... whatever works best for sure. you can always keep an eye on scouting reports, if you think he's too advanced for AAA.

james17 · 06-01-2016, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoOne

oops i misread that in the other reply... whatever works best for sure. you can always keep an eye on scouting reports, if you think he's too advanced for AAA.

I'm currently at the All-Star break and in first place in my division. The veteran who is blocking the high potential minor leaguer is my best team leader. I'll keep him through the playoffs and then trade him because his salary is out of whack with his on field production.

At least that's the plan.

05-29-2016, 07:37 PM	#1
james17 All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,305	Green Arrows Am perplexed. When the AI thinks one of your players in the minors, say AAA ball, is ready to be promoted to the major league team, it denotes his name with a big green arrow. I assume that's a cue to promote him to the majors. But what if he's still not near enough in his ratings to replace the player already there in your opinion? Will leaving him in AAA kill his further development progress if he still has quite a ways to go to hit his potential ratings?

05-29-2016, 07:42 PM	#2
RchW Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto ON by way of Glasgow UK Posts: 15,629	It's just a suggestion. Still your call to decide if it's worth doing. __________________ Cheers RichW If you’re looking for a good cause to donate money to please consider a Donation to Parkinson’s Canada. It may help me have a better future and if not me, someone else. Thanks. “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit

05-30-2016, 12:30 AM	#9
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/1 (3)	this is only relative to players that are talented enough that you want to keep them around, or at least could develop into that type of player. if you think they are a .280+ type, they are probably near stagnation or at stagnation for AAA - Eye is important too. if they are above average current ability hitters, or above-average pitcher equivalent, an mlb bench role is probably better than AAA. sometimes waiting for eye or other lagging ratings to catch up... i've had plenty come up capable of hitting .300 and they didn't seem to lose potential... age is a key too. 28+ no need to worry about development (double check manual fo age). a reliever as a 6th/7th pen arm is easy to do, or if decent enough a spot in the rotation...but, i'd hesitate using an SP that hasn't fully developed their third pitch as a reliever in the bigs (theory needs testing, assuming they use 3rd best pitch less often - guessing i am wrong). otherwise, using an SP as a reliever instead of an SP in AAA is a very viable strategy. it's better than stagnating for sure. power is a bit odd. it can develop late - even after a few years in the MLB. so, don't base much on that as far as promoting to the bigs. even though you can get away with allowing them to develop into roughly above average MLB players in AAA, i think it's still better to get them in the MLB as soon as they are competent. the development is faster or some tangible benefit, you tend to have better coaches, and even if they aren't starting they make good bench players at cheap prices. Last edited by NoOne; 05-30-2016 at 12:33 AM.*

05-30-2016, 01:07 AM	#11
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/1 (3)	i really don't think it matters. if he is younger than 28 (check manual), he should develop fine. i'm basing this on things like how Rust works in the game. if they are on the active roster, they are expected to be working out and practicing - no rust even without playing time. Also, the coaching interaction outside of games would not be affected. does playing time augment it? i have no idea. i've done both often and usually they develop either way. (simmer vs bench). i prefer mlb development, if possible / at least convenient for bench. i'm nearly 100% certain statistical results will not effect development. so, don't worry about a small sample size result. if they are really advanced, they are starters. i get rid of an aged, more expensive, and slightly better player in those situations. so, i don't see a well-rated player on the bench vs AAA simmer choice. Last edited by NoOne; 05-30-2016 at 01:08 AM.

05-31-2016, 09:44 AM	#16
Statsman1 Major Leagues Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Marmora, Ontario, Canada Posts: 340	So, presumably this means that if you select "Ask AI to set up entire organization", then those guys with the green arrows will be moved up automatically by the AI? And the RED arrow guys will be demoted? If this is true, I wonder what criteria the AI would use to move a guy to the major league roster if there really wasn't room for a prospect that the AI deems ready for the big time. __________________ Statsman1

05-29-2016, 10:48 PM	#6
MrBojangles All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: low and inside Posts: 568	If you have space on your roster, you might think of promoting him for platoon duty. See how he does. The time up may help his development.

05-30-2016, 12:46 AM	#10
james17 All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,305	Hey NoOne...interesting thoughts. If promoted to the bench in the majors will he still develop or does he have to play?

05-30-2016, 03:18 AM	#12
MrBojangles All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: low and inside Posts: 568	It seems to me that guys, when first promoted to MLB level, can struggle - for as long as half of a season- before they get their "sea legs" and really begin to gel. So, I am a fan of getting prospects the MLB experience as quickly as their development/my roster allow so we can get through that break-in period and start to get real production out of them.

05-30-2016, 02:01 PM	#13
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/1 (3)	it's tough to know for certain. i want to say it sounds right, but i also know a decent hitter can underperform for a year or nearly a year under normal circumstances. i've had enough perform really well that i lean toward it being more random or a slight increase in probability as opposed to anything major.

05-31-2016, 12:17 AM	#15
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/1 (3)	yeah, play'em if he is part of your plans. i always prefer that, when appropriate - basically anything longer than a 2-3 year commitment. i guess i shouldn't have saiy "really advanced" above.. i just mean competent relative to his role on the team. i love young teams. with a bunch of kids, you can spend like a drunken sailor in FA for a window of years.

06-01-2016, 12:11 AM	#18
NoOne Banned Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,273 Infractions: 0/1 (3)	i'm not sure it's 100% consistent with the arrows, either.