Replay?

[louisvillec271]

Forgive me if this has already been addressed, but how will 15 handle instant replays if at all?

[clwalcott]

This has been the elephant in the room for me too...I'd be very surprised, considering it hasn't been announced in the initial email and probably fair enough too - something for 16 perhaps?

[Fyrestorm3]

There are two major reasons that OOTP should (and likely will) wait for OOTP16 to include replays and challenges:

1) We still don't know the intricacies of how the challenge system is going to work in real-life baseball. Why put something into OOTP15 as guesswork, when you could wait until next year and have situations to base it off of?

2) OOTP15 will still be a text sim. What would you be basing your challenge off of, if you can't see the play? We're all fairly certain that OOTP16 is going to include a full graphics option, so that seems like a much better system under which to institute replays and challenges.

[yawgmoth]

I never understood the need for challenges in video games like Madden, etc. It is a computer simulation. If the point of replay in real life is to get the call right then why can't we rely on the fact that in the computer simulation the call is always right? Is the desire to introduce incorrect calls in the hopes that a user can identify when the computer "messes up" on purpose? Forgive my ignorance.

[louisvillec271]

Originally Posted by yawgmoth

I never understood the need for challenges in video games like Madden, etc. It is a computer simulation. If the point of replay in real life is to get the call right then why can't we rely on the fact that in the computer simulation the call is always right? Is the desire to introduce incorrect calls in the hopes that a user can identify when the computer "messes up" on purpose? Forgive my ignorance.

It's a simulation game, and the point of simulations is to create believable scenarios in the game. Since replays were a part of the NFL, the Madden series began including them in the series. Should OOTP decide to omit challenges and replays from the game it would be somewhat of a glaring omission from the game. Also, as you are a Madden player you know that there are instances in which the game does get the call incorrect and you need to utilize your challenges to get a call overturned.

[louisvillec271]

Originally Posted by Fyrestorm3

There are two major reasons that OOTP should (and likely will) wait for OOTP16 to include replays and challenges:

1) We still don't know the intricacies of how the challenge system is going to work in real-life baseball. Why put something into OOTP15 as guesswork, when you could wait until next year and have situations to base it off of?

2) OOTP15 will still be a text sim. What would you be basing your challenge off of, if you can't see the play? We're all fairly certain that OOTP16 is going to include a full graphics option, so that seems like a much better system under which to institute replays and challenges.

The lack of graphics doesn't seem like the biggest obstacle the development team faces in implementing replays. To be honest it doesn't seem like an obstacle at all. One is still able to make in game on the fly decisions without seeing what is transpiring on the field, such as sending a runner home from third base on a flyball to the outfield. There are problems that would present themselves in the institution of a replay/challenge system but the lack of graphics is not one of them. You also mention that the replay system MLB will be using in 2014 still isn't entirely known yet, and as such ootp should not create a challenge system that would not accurately mirror what MLB has in place. Well, five years from now the system that MLB uses regarding replays and challenges will most certainly look different than it does today. The point being is this. The construct of the feature could be made flexible enough so that certain aspects could be reviewed/challenged and whatnot. But these aren't even the biggest problems I see facing the institution of replay.

The most logical problems seem to be how to incorporate replays and challenges into the framework of the game in such a way that it has an impact on the game, and at the same time is not buggy. What also poses to be a problem is a complete omission of this aspect of the game. The ability to challenge controversial plays is now going to be part of the MLB game, and that is precisely what the OOTP series seeks to recreate. So a complete absence of this aspect of the game will be noticeable. Not so much as that it ruins the game, but noticeable nonetheless.

Even though I have done some scanning of the boards and previews, I still have not found a statement or position from OOTP about this particular topic. If anyone knows anything concrete it would be nice to know.

[silvam14]

For me, replay is the elephant in the airplane hangar

[yawgmoth]

Instituting it into the game could be as simple as having the play-by-play commentary mention the fact that the play may not have looked correct, or "looks like the manager is contemplating talking to the umpires about that call", etc. That way you can decide based on the situation in the game whether or not it is worth the risk. No in depth graphical interference that way. I envision it currently with regard to how you risk sending runners for extra bases. When they state "the ball was hit shallow and the RF has a great arm", there is a certain level of ambiguity to the exact position of the fielder with respect to the base the runner is trying to advance to. In an ideal world, actual graphical representation of the position of everything occurring would be great but most people seem fine dealing with what is available now until something better comes along. The developers certainly have their priorities and minor issues like these may not be at the top of the list.

[bwburke94]

OOTP umpires don't miss calls. Replay is unnecessary, and adding missed calls might screw with stats somewhere along the line due to the extra hits and extra outs not balancing.

[Sweed]

Well thank goodness if this is ever added, like the DH, it will have to be optional to preserve the historical play of OOTP. This will enable us to simply turn it off.

[Fyrestorm3]

Originally Posted by louisvillec271

The lack of graphics doesn't seem like the biggest obstacle the development team faces in implementing replays. To be honest it doesn't seem like an obstacle at all. One is still able to make in game on the fly decisions without seeing what is transpiring on the field, such as sending a runner home from third base on a flyball to the outfield.

Personally, I turn that option off, and leave the decision up to the AI, for precisely the reason I pointed out. It doesn't make sense to me to be making crucial in-game decisions that are based on what you can see on the field... without being able to see the field. But at the very least, sending a runner from third can be quantified by telling you the approximate depth of the ball and the fielder's arm strength. Not so much with challenges: if a box pops up and says, "Close call! Would you like to challenge?", how do I know if I should or not? What can be quantified about, say, a bang-bang play at first? Or an outfielder trapping the ball? The best the game could do in its current state (which will be similar in OOTP15, despite the 3D ballparks) is give you a pop-up saying "Looks like the player may have trapped the ball! Challenge?" And then you have a 50/50 chance of getting the challenge right if you do. That's not realistic, that's being interactive for the sake of being interactive. If you can explain to me how a text sim can quantify a judgment call without being a coin flip every time you challenge, I'd love to hear it.

Originally Posted by louisvillec271

You also mention that the replay system MLB will be using in 2014 still isn't entirely known yet, and as such ootp should not create a challenge system that would not accurately mirror what MLB has in place. Well, five years from now the system that MLB uses regarding replays and challenges will most certainly look different than it does today.

Well I wasn't saying they COULDN'T do it without waiting to see how it works in real life... but wouldn't it be better if they did? We're not talking about a tweak to the rules of what is/isn't reviewable. We're talking about a brand-new system that no one has yet seen take place within the context of an MLB game. We know how it's supposed to work, sure, and they could certainly recreate the system based off that. But I can almost guarantee that there will be hiccups this year, situations no one expected when it comes to the replay rules. Rather than have those issues transposed into OOTP15, where it could potentially bug out the game, would it not be better to wait until OOTP16 and have a little bit of real-life guidance as to how things work? It would be something they would have to work through, that they wouldn't have to work through if they waited a year.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by silvam14

For me, replay is the elephant in the airplane hangar

So like the ant in the trash can?

[bazeall]

"1) We still don't know the intricacies of how the challenge system is going to work in real-life baseball. Why put something into OOTP15 as guesswork, when you could wait until next year and have situations to base it off of?"

Yes, we know the intricacies. It hasn't been done in games, yet, but MLB issued the rules and explanation of how it will work.

There are umpire missed calls in OOTP. On occasion the play by play is "the umpire missed that one" or "the umpire may have missed that one".

[Fyrestorm3]

Originally Posted by bazeall

Yes, we know the intricacies. It hasn't been done in games, yet, but MLB issued the rules and explanation of how it will work.

Note I didn't say "the rules," but rather "the intricacies." Big difference. You can't possibly believe that every little thing is going to go smoothly this year in regards to instant replay, do you? It's certainly possible, but I would be shocked.

Originally Posted by bazeall

There are umpire missed calls in OOTP. On occasion the play by play is "the umpire missed that one" or "the umpire may have missed that one".

See point #2. How would you know if it's a good idea to challenge from that line of text alone?



Just clarifying here, I'm not against adding replays into OOTP. I just think it would be jumping the gun to do it in OOTP15.

[fhomess]

Hopefully, we can confine Bud Selig to ruining MLB and keep him out of our OOTP leagues.

[drksd4848]

I think the only way to implement it in a text sim is to is to include something in the pbp like this:

"Jones is going to try for two. Here's the throw... He is... OUT! And now Jones is hoping mad! He's shouting at the umpire. He thought he was safe! The manager is coming out to keep him from being ejected" Then a dialog box pops up: Challenge Play? Yes or No.

Or another dialog box pops up for the play: Your bench coach thinks jones was safe and you should challenge the call" yes or no.

That's the only way I see it working. But who knows if it's going to work well in real games, so OOTP should wait to see and either release it as an update, or in the next version. I know action PC football uses percentages for replays. As in, Challenge the ruling? 42% chance to over turn. Yes or No"

I like the way I proposed it better though, because it leaves some ambiguity and a little more risk to challenge the play...