Jeter to retire

[canadian content]

I grew up idolizing Nolan Ryan and the Nolan Ryan-is-the-most-overrated-player-in-baseball conversations got old really fast. Let the Derek Jeter-is-the-most-overrated-player-in-baseball conversations commence.

[The Game]

Originally Posted by David Watts

Just wish he would have done all he's done for my Tigers.

In my league he did most of it for the Tigers. Went in the HOF as a Tiger.
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...ml#post3617635
Just realized he should not have gone in when he did.

Jeter is one of 3 Yankees I like. The rest I despise or dont like. The other 2 I like are Mo & Girardi. Wonder how long til another Yankees icon come along. We seem to get one every 20 years.

[Jason Moyer]

Jeter isn't really all that overrated though. Yeah, his defense was hilariously bad because he had no range, but his fielding percentages were about average and unless I'm forgetting someone he's one of the top 3 offensive shortstops in history, right? 2nd best shortstop of his era, although it wouldn't be remotely close if it weren't for the Yankees' bizarre decision to play the #1 shortstop of his era at third base.

Nolan Ryan was a great pitcher but he had peers who were better and never got credit for it because they didn't miss the strike zone with 100mph fastballs repeatedly.

[CMH]

Jeter was overrated by the media. I think he's been underrated statistically by fans because of the media's infatuation with him.

[Mikex5]

Jeter has been the heart and soul of the Yankees for the better part of two decades. I have heard people gripe about his fielding. (.976 career fielding pct.) Seems pretty good. I think the Yankees missed him last year and when he retires, they will miss him more. It's hard to replace a layer like him.

[Green & Gold Heart]

Originally Posted by Mikex5

I have heard people gripe about his fielding. (.976 career fielding pct.) Seems pretty good.

Fielding percentage is not how you measure fielding ability. But that's for another thread.

[Orioles1966]

What will the Yankees do if Jeter sucks in April and May but refuses to retire early?


I remember Mickey Mantle's last year and except for a gift from Denny Mclain,it was a very forgettable season.


Same goes for Willie Mays except he got to play in the World Series for the Mets.

[David Watts]

Originally Posted by Orioles1966

What will the Yankees do if Jeter sucks in April and May but refuses to retire early?


I remember Mickey Mantle's last year and except for a gift from Denny Mclain,it was a very forgettable season.


Same goes for Willie Mays except he got to play in the World Series for the Mets.

Why in the world would he retire early?

[Orioles1966]

Originally Posted by David Watts

Why in the world would he retire early?

He still hasn't proven that he play. Can't recall the last time someone missed 18 months because of an ankle injury.


The Yankees have a lot of question marks on the infield and they are hoping Jeter can get plenty of games in at SS.

[John Madden]

[Green & Gold Heart]

Originally Posted by John Madden

Aw yeah, Jeter's ass...

[Astros33Resurrected]

Just bought tickets to opening day at Minute Maid, which will be his last opening day. They were expensive, but I'm excited.

[Déjà Bru]

I will grant the "Jeter is overrated" people one thing: His five golden gloves may have been more about his popularity than his actual fielding.

However, he was a decent SS for many years, give him that. Below is a picture of a play that I saw him make many times; yes, maybe he doesn't need the leap if he had more range but I saw him nail many runners that way, regardless.

But listen up, you "overrated" guys. He was the first Yankee in over a hundred years of history to reach the 3,000 hit plateau. The first Yankee!

He is number 10 on the all-time list. With a decent season (120 hits), he may end up passing Cap Anson for sixth place. With a very good season (200 hits), he will go past Tris Speaker for #5.

Overrated?

Now, if you are going to say "Hits are overrated in themselves. What was his adjusted BABIP or era-context WAR?" that's when I tune you out.

Besides, part of this thread is devoted to Jeter the MAN which is a difficult standard to apply to anyone in the limelight these days. Just a moment . . . just a moment . . . OK, there. My Yankees fanhood has been put aside.

Yep, he still measures up. Comments about Jeter being overrated are themselves overrated.

[jbergey22]

Nice post.

Jeter was a gamer who came to the park ready to play every game. He was remarkably consistent and had the ability to make big plays when the Yankees needed them most.

He was an average defender. Not a poor one nor was he a great one.

Most importantly he played his entire career in the bright lights of New York and did it with class and dignity. Hard to dislike Jeter even if you hate the Yankees.

[Déjà Bru]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Nice post.

Jeter was a gamer who came to the park ready to play every game. He was remarkably consistent and had the ability to make big plays when the Yankees needed them most.

He was an average defender. Not a poor one nor was he a great one.

Most importantly he played his entire career in the bright lights of New York and did it with class and dignity. Hard to dislike Jeter even if you hate the Yankees.

Classy comment, coming from a guy whose girlfriend has been paddling my girlfriend's butt for years. ()

[jaxmagicman]

Originally Posted by Jason Moyer

Jeter isn't really all that overrated though. Yeah, his defense was hilariously bad because he had no range, but his fielding percentages were about average and unless I'm forgetting someone he's one of the top 3 offensive shortstops in history, right? 2nd best shortstop of his era, although it wouldn't be remotely close if it weren't for the Yankees' bizarre decision to play the #1 shortstop of his era at third base.

Nolan Ryan was a great pitcher but he had peers who were better and never got credit for it because they didn't miss the strike zone with 100mph fastballs repeatedly.

Is it possible to be overrated and underrated at the same time? Jeter was a great player for a lot of years. He never got in trouble outside the game. He always seemed like he enjoyed the game and played hard. His instincts made up for a lot of his shortcomings (thinking of the play in Oakland myself and not the stupid play where he dove into the stands for no reason).

But saying all that, I think he was just decent defensively. He should have never won any gold gloves. He didn't make mistakes, but he also didn't get to a lot of balls and some of the balls he got to where he had to make a jump throw are just normal plays by other fielders. Here is a great article illustrating that fact. He won his gold gloves in the midst of his defensive decline and there were better players.

Still, he could hit. He hit with the best shortstops in this game. His hitting stats put him up there with the top 5 SS's of the Modern Era. The only hitting shortstops I would put ahead of him are, Ripken, Yount, Arky Vaughan and Alex Rodriquez.

He wasn't the best to ever play or the most clutch (if that is a thing). He was just really really good player who should be in the Hall of Fame and should be in any conversation about the best who have played. But for his hitting and not his defense.

[canadian content]

Originally Posted by CMH

Jeter was overrated by the media. I think he's been underrated statistically by fans because of the media's infatuation with him.

Good point.

[Mecza]

Originally Posted by Green & Gold Heart

Fielding percentage is not how you measure fielding ability. But that's for another thread.

Something that was done recently, though somewhat simplistic, is that fielding percentage has about an r^2=0.22 to UZR. So, while fielding percentage is not an end all be all or the stat you care about the most when talking about defensive metrics, there is some value to it. You can, in fact, somewhat evaluate a fielder using fielding percentage.

[canadian content]

Originally Posted by jbergey22

Nice post.

Jeter was a gamer who came to the park ready to play every game. He was remarkably consistent and had the ability to make big plays when the Yankees needed them most.

He was an average defender. Not a poor one nor was he a great one.

Most importantly he played his entire career in the bright lights of New York and did it with class and dignity. Hard to dislike Jeter even if you hate the Yankees.

I actually think he was a piss poor defender for several years and if he had have been more of a team player he would have even suggested moving over to third base when ARod arrived.

In his prime he was a great player and, of course, he had a great career. He didn't let the pressure get to him and he remained consistent. I would agree, he seemed to make the big plays when they needed them most.

[Mecza]

Originally Posted by canadian content

I actually think he was a piss poor defender for several years and if he had have been more of a team player he would have even suggested moving over to third base when ARod arrived.

In his prime he was a great player and, of course, he had a great career. He didn't let the pressure get to him and he remained consistent. I would agree, he seemed to make the big plays when they needed them most.

I would agree with this. Jeter had his seasons where he was, at best, an average defender. Though, for the most part he was pretty poor. He hit so well though that it really didn't matter.