My Opinion to the Developers - next patch

[GMO123]

My (totally unsolicited) opinion to the Developers is to take as much time as needed to get this game up to a more stable, playable level.

Don't give in to those who want another patch out now.

If you don't deliver a game that's more playable in the next patch or two you'll lose a lot of customers that won't come back.

If in the next update (or perhaps 2 updates) FHM is an enjoyable, playable and stable game then most or all of the complaining will be forgotten.

So it's important that the next patch is accepted by most of your customers as being what they want.

Unfortunately the first view of this game was below expectations but if you can create something that lives up to expectations, people will be playing the game and forget their grumbling.

That's why it's important to take your time, prioritize (you can't deliver all the 'bells and whistles' in the first year so deliver only what you promised), test it thoroughly and only then release the next patch.

This might take many weeks or longer but don't rush it. Take all the time that you need. Do not give another date for when the next patch will be available because that will only cause undue stress to you and a possible release of the next patch before it's actually ready.

Only release it when you know it will be accepted as being a game worthy of its cost.

Give weekly updates (status reports) but make it very general until you're sure you have something solid to announce. Status reports keep people happy even if all you have to report is that you're still working on it.

I've worked in the software industry so I know what it's like.

Under promise and over deliver.

Good luck.

[lonestarhockey32]

I agree 100% with you

[tward13]

Can't say I disagree. Might also be worthwhile to establish one area and perfect that first. Maybe it's the current season, major leagues. Get that playable and enjoyable, then come back to historical, or customizable fiction or whatever.

Do something and so it well. It will satisfy some portion of the market and give the rest and idea of what's coming for them.

[michael92]

Originally Posted by lonestarhockey32

I agree 100% with you

really nice job on the webpage..i take it you do that yourself is it hard to make a webpage i have never tryed would love to for my sim games

[lonestarhockey32]

Originally Posted by michael92

really nice job on the webpage..i take it you do that yourself is it hard to make a webpage i have never tryed would love to for my sim games

Thank you.
Its actually really easy. The hardest part was getting a template I liked and would still have every table fit in properly.

I would definitely suggest using the website I use (partially because it is the only one I know of). It is user friendly, and allows for a lot of customization.

[PromisedPain]

Still no answers from development team, that's one tough fever if it takes a month to recover.

[Sebastian Palkowski]

Originally Posted by PromisedPain

Still no answers from development team, that's one tough fever if it takes a month to recover.

I'm not sure what answer you expect here?

[Särås]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Palkowski

I'm not sure what answer you expect here?

Great to see that You guys are alive!
Thanks!
/Jimmy Särås

[PromisedPain]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Palkowski

I'm not sure what answer you expect here?

Originally Posted by Bruins86

I want to know if the game itself can generate players that can go over 20 in a attribute. So say in 2022 their could be a player that is going to be the next Gretzky or something like that. I have simmed into the late 2020's and early 2030's and i haven't seen a player come out like that. Not that i would expect it to happen often, but maybe once every like 20 or so years.

This, it was asked what.... 17 days ago?

If we could get a comment on that thread, that'd be great. I'm also glad that you're still alive.

[Särås]

Originally Posted by PromisedPain

This, it was asked what.... 17 days ago?

If we could get a comment on that thread, that'd be great. I'm also glad that you're still alive.

Guess it will never be a new Gretzky or Orr, at least in IRL! :-(

[PromisedPain]

Originally Posted by Särås

Guess it will never be a new Gretzky or Orr, at least in IRL! :-(

I don't think so. Hockey is so much different now compared to the high scoring 80's.

For example: Crosby could've hit 130 points couple of years ago, if he didn't get injured. 130 points in this day and age is amazing.

[Ciccarelli]

Originally Posted by PromisedPain

I don't think so. Hockey is so much different now compared to the high scoring 80's.

Exactly. Goaltending is the biggest difference, at least from what I can see. Back in the day, looking at old highlights from Lemieux and Gretzky in the 80's, goalies had smaller equipment and had extremely poor technique (most of them just flopping around hoping they saved a shot when anyone was on a breakaway), compared to the goalies of today.

[dave1927p]

Originally Posted by Ciccarelli

Exactly. Goaltending is the biggest difference, at least from what I can see. Back in the day, looking at old highlights from Lemieux and Gretzky in the 80's, goalies had smaller equipment and had extremely poor technique (most of them just flopping around hoping they saved a shot when anyone was on a breakaway), compared to the goalies of today.

The size of goalies has changed drastically since the 80s which is a factor. Today there are very few who are 5'10", but at that time it was more common than not.

Attributes can be changed manually to over 20 so I don't see why the game won't do it to some players on the rarest of occasions.

[dejaqwho]

No that's a bad idea, to get FHM "playable" will take a long time, think next year. They need to release it earlier, especially since whenever they release a patch 10 other things don't work as a result. This is an Alpha build, when you do alpha/beta builds you release updates relatively quick so you can get feedback to see whats working, whats not.

[bsimons77]

Originally Posted by Ciccarelli

Exactly. Goaltending is the biggest difference, at least from what I can see. Back in the day, looking at old highlights from Lemieux and Gretzky in the 80's, goalies had smaller equipment and had extremely poor technique (most of them just flopping around hoping they saved a shot when anyone was on a breakaway), compared to the goalies of today.

I also think it has alot to do with the defensive "systems" that are in place now as opposed to the high scoring 70's and 80's. Also I believe the difference in talent between the "elite" players and the "average" ones has narrowed significantly as well. Even the worst teams in the league on a good night can compete with the better ones, as opposed to some of the sad sack franchises playing in those days.

[herzkine]

Originally Posted by PromisedPain

This, it was asked what.... 17 days ago?

If we could get a comment on that thread, that'd be great. I'm also glad that you're still alive.

Worst thing tha tcoudl happen is to hijack a "take your time guys and make a working basic product with patience" into another "we want answers now " thread.

At this stage i really think every second the the devs wast eon the forums is really a lsot oen for the game.

I think they realize they were maybe overambitious and know wha tthis game needs now: working basics

So i hope they silently work on them ..its time to do the walk not do the talk. Theres nothing to be gained for the game by lenghty discussions here at the moment.

[Sebastian Palkowski]

Originally Posted by Bruins86

I want to know if the game itself can generate players that can go over 20 in a attribute. So say in 2022 their could be a player that is going to be the next Gretzky or something like that. I have simmed into the late 2020's and early 2030's and i haven't seen a player come out like that. Not that i would expect it to happen often, but maybe once every like 20 or so years.

In theory yes. I think a thread from Jeff is floating around somewhere where he explains the player creation but in short: every Nation has %'s stored for every Quality (1-10, corresponding to the Talent level). Whenever a player is generated it uses the chances to determine the Quality level of the new player. Keep in mind that a Gretzky type of player not only needs to be generated from the Quality 10 category (smallest %), it also needs to be in the top regions of this category (even less likely), so yes, it is possible but very, very small chance (as it should be I guess). In addition to the above, only a few Nations are able to produce Quality 10 players.

[PromisedPain]

Originally Posted by Sebastian Palkowski

In theory yes. I think a thread from Jeff is floating around somewhere where he explains the player creation but in short: every Nation has %'s stored for every Quality (1-10, corresponding to the Talent level). Whenever a player is generated it uses the chances to determine the Quality level of the new player. Keep in mind that a Gretzky type of player not only needs to be generated from the Quality 10 category (smallest %), it also needs to be in the top regions of this category (even less likely), so yes, it is possible but very, very small chance (as it should be I guess). In addition to the above, only a few Nations are able to produce Quality 10 players.

Thanks!

[Bluenoser]

Originally Posted by Ciccarelli

Exactly. Goaltending is the biggest difference, at least from what I can see. Back in the day, looking at old highlights from Lemieux and Gretzky in the 80's, goalies had smaller equipment and had extremely poor technique (most of them just flopping around hoping they saved a shot when anyone was on a breakaway), compared to the goalies of today.

It's true there equipment was smaller, but as for the "poor technique" or "just flopping around" well, I can't agree with that. There were some very good goalies in the 80's. The game was just more offensive based. The coaching styles weren't as much about getting forwards to back-check as they were about getting everyone involved in the rush.

The coaching style changed in the 90's when we were given the dreadful NZT. It's evolved from there to where in this day and age all 5 skaters on the ice are expected to be defensemen, and not just the two "actual" defensemen.

I'm not saying back-checking didn't exist back then, there just wasn't the same emphasis put on it. The game was more about offense and the team focus was more on offense.

[Mordrehl]

Originally Posted by Bluenoser

It's true there equipment was smaller, but as for the "poor technique" or "just flopping around" well, I can't agree with that. There were some very good goalies in the 80's. The game was just more offensive based. The coaching styles weren't as much about getting forwards to back-check as they were about getting everyone involved in the rush.

The coaching style changed in the 90's when we were given the dreadful NZT. It's evolved from there to where in this day and age all 5 skaters on the ice are expected to be defensemen, and not just the two "actual" defensemen.

I'm not saying back-checking didn't exist back then, there just wasn't the same emphasis put on it. The game was more about offense and the team focus was more on offense.

Hockey tends to evolve over time ...

The Montreal Canadiens of the 70's were modeled after the team of the last 50's and as a result were a fast skating, puck possesion team.

The Oilers of the 80's took it even further (with Gretzky to ride on) and put a 5 man unit on the ice the was essentially 4 forwards and a Dman (Paul Coffey acting more like a forward). This ramped the offence up in the 80's and it was the focus of most teams.

Then along came Roger Nielson. Read up on him sometime ... one of the most under rated coaches in the history of the league. Roger's specialty was taking a team that had little talent and finding ways to exploit the rules to let them win. (Example, he used to have his goalie leave their stick in the crease when he pulled them ... until they changed the rule. Another was exploiting the clock at the end of the game by getting a string of penalties to wind the clock down).

The trap had been used as early as the 20s and 30s, but wasn't in much use again until the 90's when Nielson took over the Panthers, assessed their talent and realized the trap meant a team that didn't have a lot of offensive talent could compete against most teams using the system. What really drove the trap home, was the Devils ... with a talented team and legendary goalie using the system under Jacques Lemaire. It proved how efficient the system was when used by a talented team.

Flash forward to today, teams still use the trap ... but it's not quite as effective as players have been exposed to it for the past 2 decades and methods of dealing with it have evolved the same way they did in the 40s after it had been used in the 20's and 30s.

EDIT : Some other Roger stories

Neilson was well known for closely reading the rule book looking to exploit loopholes. During one particular game in his first season coaching the Petes, he was down two men in a five on three situation for the last minute of the game. Realizing that more penalties could not be served under the existing rules, Neilson put too many men on the ice every ten seconds. The referees stopped the play and a faceoff was held relieving pressure on the defence. In addition, Neilson also took advantage of fans throwing objects onto the ice to deliberately cause stoppages of play late in a game. After these displays, the rules were changed so that a call for too many men on the ice in a 5-on-3 situation, or a delay-of-game penalty in a 5-on-3 situation, or any deliberate act to stop play (i.e., objects thrown on the ice, or the net being intentionally disloged), in the last two minutes of regulation or in overtime now results in a penalty shot.

Neilson also discovered that if he put a defenceman in net instead of a goalie during a penalty shot, the defenceman could rush the attacker and cut down the latter's angle of shot, greatly reducing the chances of a goal. Today the rules states that a team must use a goalie in net for a penalty shot and that the goalie cannot leave the crease until the skater has touched the puck.