My scout amatuer draft

[wiggins]

I hate this. It's the Amature Draft where potential is everything, and my scout's (Who is excellent) summary says this about the # 17 pick in the first round (that he suggested I choose.) "Always a minor League filler. Not much repertoire. No aptitude to Learn. This is every league, every scout I've ever had. It's stupid. I've never since V.6, had my scout who suggests my players, who sometime turn out to be great, say something like this, "High potential, excellent fastball, throws 3 pitches effectively, including curve and slider. needs work on command and control. Great work ethic and projects to be a middle of rotation starter. Why is there such a disconnect????

[waltwa]

Does scouting really work or is the best way to judge a player to look carefully at his stats,rating and all other attributes and make your own decision on the player.

[Left-handed Badger]

Originally Posted by waltwa

Does scouting really work or is the best way to judge a player to look carefully at his stats,rating and all other attributes and make your own decision on the player.

Pretty much. And the better the scout the worse his decision making process.

[waltwa]

I guess the remaining question is why do so many online leagues (over 50%) insist on using a feature that simply doesn't work. I'd be curious to hear from some that believe and can explain why scouting adds a positive feature to the game.

I think if u use scouting for international countries i guess it may have a value in that area. But i am wondering about its value in MLB, minors and draft scouting.

[Cinnamon J. Scudworth]

Originally Posted by waltwa

I guess the remaining question is why do so many online leagues (over 50%) insist on using a feature that simply doesn't work. I'd be curious to hear from some that believe and can explain why scouting adds a positive feature to the game.

I think if u use scouting for international countries i guess it may have a value in that area. But i am wondering about its value in MLB, minors and draft scouting.

It adds "fog of war." I've certainly had scouts tell me that draft picks are high potential (not every pick, obviously), so I can't explain the OP's experience. The feature works fine for me.

[waltwa]

Wow! adding fog of war to some of my online leagues is the last thing i need- it's foggy enough out there.

It seems that scouting should clear up the fog but what i am getting is that it makes it foggier.

Is that really the benefit of scouting?

[D-BacksJosh]

I never allow my scout to suggest picks in the amateur draft. My scout hardly ever says these things about my top 3 picks because of it.

[Cinnamon J. Scudworth]

Originally Posted by waltwa

Wow! adding fog of war to some of my online leagues is the last thing i need- it's foggy enough out there.

It seems that scouting should clear up the fog but what i am getting is that it makes it foggier.

Is that really the benefit of scouting?

If you turn scouting off, the player ratings that you see are their actual ratings. Scouting adds another layer of interpretation that, to me, feels realistic. You have to balance the scout's view versus the player's actual performance. You have the option of making league-wide scouting very accurate or very inaccurate, or somewhere in between.

I'm kind of surprised that you've been around since 2002 and don't quite grasp how scouting in OOTP works?

[Left-handed Badger]

I think the ratings of the scouts themselves should considered more their reputation than their actual ability. At least in my experience. Personally, I have found the Average or Above Average one to be the most accurate. Going for an excellent or "legendary" one is really likely a waste of money (with lesser results). Think of it this way 80+ year old Connie Mack was a legend but at that point past his prime and probably not the greatest at judging talent anymore.

Others experiences may vary. I just find for myself the excellent/legendary scouts just arent up to their rep. (and not anywhere near it either)

[jmolony3]

Originally Posted by wiggins

I hate this. It's the Amature Draft where potential is everything, and my scout's (Who is excellent) summary says this about the # 17 pick in the first round (that he suggested I choose.) "Always a minor League filler. Not much repertoire. No aptitude to Learn. This is every league, every scout I've ever had. It's stupid. I've never since V.6, had my scout who suggests my players, who sometime turn out to be great, say something like this, "High potential, excellent fastball, throws 3 pitches effectively, including curve and slider. needs work on command and control. Great work ethic and projects to be a middle of rotation starter. Why is there such a disconnect????

I agree my frustration is the head scout recommends a player with, in his opinion, has no potential and will not suggest drafting players that he believes do have potential. It might help if the dialog came back with 'we are short on middle infielders in the farm system.' Justifying the recommendation but I have seen cases where the have recommended a position where there is a higher candidate available.

[SirMichaelJordan]

Written reports need to be updated. Everything is fine if you are looking at the numbers.

Also to comment on the above post, it depends on what the scout prefer. Do he prefer skills or tools? That may be why he suggested someone else rather than a player who seemed to be rated higher.

[waltwa]

To reply to an earlier post i don't understand scouting because i have never used it.

But now i decided to join a league with a good commissioner and rules that i like but it has scouting and i am trying to find out if scouting really amounts to anything worthwhile.

Shouldn't scouting work like this.

1. install a large budget.

2. hire a scout with the absolute best ratings at any amount of money.

3. rely (almost) completely on that scouts opinion of mlb players, minor league and draftees

Now if scouting doesn't do these things then what benefit does the scout actually provide.

I am hearing from some that it is in the game but u really don't pay attention to the scout and rather rely on yourself looking at the stats (1st) and then the overall ratings of the player.

Now i am not saying how scouting SHOULD work- that is up to OOTP and they are nice enough to give me an option of turning it off. what i am asking is does it do any thing meaningful in the sense that u can sit back as a gm and rely on the scouting reports and that your only job in regards to scouting is to hire the best scout and give him all the $ he requires.

My problem is altho i am very experienced in online play since i have never until now played with a scout i am afraid to trade because i don't know the true value of my player or the true value of the player i am receiving.

Now if the answer is that I should check the ratings and stats of the players involved then i begin to wonder what scouting is all about if the bottom line is it all comes back to me. what am i paying for?

I think as i write this post that what i am getting at is this

Is there an ultimate goal in setting up a scouting system that will help u win pennants or is it just a way of adding meaningless realism to the game.

I want scouting to be meaningful because it opens up all kinds of online leagues that i can join but is it?

[nyy26wc]

It is my understanding that, with scouting on, the ratings that you see aren't the player's real ratings. They are your scout's ratings for the player.

So, when it comes to looking at their ratings, the quality of your scout is extremely important.

[waltwa]

Wait a minute- that is a confusing statement

You r saying - The ratings displayed are the scouts ratings but not the real ratings for the player.

Isn't success being able to know the true ratings of the player. You are saying the scout is not giving u the real ratings then what are u paying him for?

I want to know the true ratings for a player. In a scouting on game how can i get those true ratings?

To carry it further i want to trade for another player. I look at the 2 players and acc to the scouting ratings i am seeing i am getting the better deal but if those are not true ratings how do i know?

I would worry if i offered a 2 star player for a 3 star player (or poorer ratings for better ratings) and the gm i am offering to jumps at the offer.

I want to play with scouts and ultimately have the edge on every other team in the online league. How do i go about acc. that goal? Or is it just a matter of forgetting the scout and looking at stats? if so then why scouts?

[waltwa]

By the way does a players work ethic, intelligence etc also depend on the scout.

Does 1 scout give a player a normal We and another scout give him a low WE?

[damientheomen3]

The proper way to use a scout is to turn ratings off and rely on stats and their reports to make your player evaluations.

Ultimately, there's no way to really 'have that edge on every other team'. This is, obviously, because if there was a way to get an edge, every experienced online league GM would be doing it and it wouldn't really be an edge. At the end of the day, the function of scouts is to dilute the ratings so you don't see what the players' true ratings are. This is just like in real life, where teams have to rely on what their scouts say about the player, and the statistical output of the player. You can turn up the scouting accuracy in the settings, but ultimately the scouts get things wrong because that's part of the function.

[YanksFan]

Originally Posted by Left-handed Badger

I think the ratings of the scouts themselves should considered more their reputation than their actual ability. At least in my experience. Personally, I have found the Average or Above Average one to be the most accurate. Going for an excellent or "legendary" one is really likely a waste of money (with lesser results). Think of it this way 80+ year old Connie Mack was a legend but at that point past his prime and probably not the greatest at judging talent anymore.

Others experiences may vary. I just find for myself the excellent/legendary scouts just arent up to their rep. (and not anywhere near it either)

It's funny that i came across this thread because i contemplated making one myself about scouting but not just pertaining to the draft.

What i was wondering was if scouts abilities/accuracy start to decline with age as i assume it would in real life. The reason i ask is because i am currently having the most frustrating season i've ever had with OOTP because according to my Legendary/Oustanding/Oustanding/Legendary scout i've assembled a very good team yet i sit at 1-6 in my current season. And it's not a tough loss we'll get'em tommorrow kind of 1-6 but a these games don't really feel competitive type of 1-6. Now i understand 7 games is a small sample size but this team has underchieved for about three seasons now. Previously i had teams that were always top 10 in pitching but i would barely miss the playoffs or lose in the first round because of the lack of hitting - mainly OBP and power. So i set out to improve my team offensively but not go full '90's Texas Rangers style nor did i do it via the Steinbrenner style through free agency because my team is in an average market. A few trades, few salary dumps, bring up a few guys from the farm and goal accomplished - so i thought. Now as i said previously pitching has never been a problem for me but fast forward 3 years later and my pitching has turned to complete garbage.

This brings me to my scout. Now i'm not a complete OOTP noob so of course you have to pay attention to stats but for the sake of discussing scouts he has all my starters rated much higher than how they are performing. It's like the whole pitching staff has turned into Rick Ankiel at the same time. Balls are constantly being "ripped" and "lifted high and deep to the gap" as i watch the play-by-play off of pitchers who my scout is telling me " keeps the ball low in the zone", etc. The guys he's telling me have great stuff are not striking guys out and the guys he's telling me have great control have turned into walk machines.

Then there's the trade i made last season. It was basically a bat for a bat in which i gained about 4 million in salary because my guy was going to arbitration and was gonna get about 12 mil. Anyway, they got a great young, power hitting catcher and i got a .300 avg, power-hitting middle infielder. Why would i do that you may ask? Well according to the aformentioned all world scout i had a switch hitting, .330 avg, power-hitting, just as young backup behind him and another good catching prospect in AAA. Plus, the catcher i traded struck out like 160 times a year which killed a lot of scoring rallies and he was subpar against lefties. That middle infielder that i traded for? The one that hit .323, 31hr, and 100 rbi's last year? He's currently 1-25 to start the season. Does he have time to turn it around? Sure. But i get the feeling this is a when it rains it pours kind of situation and he's gonna suck along with my over-scouted pitching staff.

So i said all of that to say this lol My scout is 61. Ancient by no means but not young either. Do scouts start to lose their ability like players? Has he just totally over-scouted this team? Should i scrap him and the team and start over? Someone please weigh-in ....

[nyy26wc]

Originally Posted by waltwa

Wait a minute- that is a confusing statement

You r saying - The ratings displayed are the scouts ratings but not the real ratings for the player.

Correct. Click on "game setup" and look at "global setup"

The first item on the left is to whether complete scouting is used. If that item is checked, there is an option for scoutig accuracy. That setting, combined with the ratings of your scout, determine how accurate your ratings are.

In a solo league, you can set it to "100% accurate" and will then get the players actual ratings. In an online league, you are at the mercy of the league setup.

Isn't success being able to know the true ratings of the player. You are saying the scout is not giving u the real ratings then what are u paying him for?

Success is knowing when to trust the scout, if he says the player is better than his stats or knowing when to trust the stats, when they conflict with the scouting reports.

This is my first season ever in which I turned on scouting and I'm really enjoying it. For example, I have this 21 year old kid, Ramon Flores, who had a really good year in A ball as a 20 year old. I was impressed with his stats, but my scout says he sucks and he'll never be anything more than a minor league filler. But, I just have this hunch that he can help me, so I put him on the 40 man roster to save him from being eligible for the Rule 5 draft. He had a monster 1st half as a 21 year old in A ball. My scout still says he sucks. But, I'm intrigued by him. I just promoted him. I want to see what he can do in AA.

And, what you are paying the scouts for? You hired fallable human beings. You hired human beings to do a job and sometimes the information they give you is wrong. (Yes, I mean that as plural, since teams really don't have a single scout. I never think of it as my scout, I think of it as being my scouting department.) Sometimes, scouts are wrong. I remember the days when the Yankees scouts were sure that Hensley "Bam Bam" Meulens was the next 40 HR a year hitter for the Yankees. He hit 15 in his entire career. And, scouts can be wrong the other way too. Bobby Murcer said that, when he released, the Yankees told him he had to go because they wanted to give the job to this kid Mattingly, who the scouts said he'd never hit major league pitching, but the Yankees really loved his glove.

I want to know the true ratings for a player. In a scouting on game how can i get those true ratings?

If scouting is on, you can only get the true ratings if the accuracy rating is set to 100%. And, if that's the case, there's really no point in having the scouting on.

To carry it further i want to trade for another player. I look at the 2 players and acc to the scouting ratings i am seeing i am getting the better deal but if those are not true ratings how do i know?

I would worry if i offered a 2 star player for a 3 star player (or poorer ratings for better ratings) and the gm i am offering to jumps at the offer.

There are all sort of reasons why a team would prefer a 2 star player over a 3 star player. Maybe the other GM has a prospect that he wants to call up and trading the 3 star player opens up that position. Maybe there are financial considerations that are motivating the trade. Maybe the 2 star player is a good power hitter, not so good at everything else, and the other GM puts a higher weight on power hitting than the AI does in the algorithm that determines the stars. Maybe the 2 star is good hit, no field, so his stars drop because of that, but the other GM needs the offense enough that he can carry a defensive liability. Maybe the 2 star is good field, no hit, so he'd suck as an everyday player, but as a 8th/9th inning defensive replacement, he can help the other team in that role. Maybe the 3 star is 37 years old and the other GM doesn't think he has much left in him for the future.

The star system is just a starting point for talent evaluation. It's not the end all for player value.

I want to play with scouts and ultimately have the edge on every other team in the online league. How do i go about acc. that goal? Or is it just a matter of forgetting the scout and looking at stats? if so then why scouts?

The only real way to have the edge on every other team in the league is really to just be a better GM. Learning when to trust the scouts is part of the GM job.

[waltwa]

Glad i got into this subject i think i have learned more about scouting in 2 days than i have in 10 years.

I agree getting an edge is really just an expression on my part but what i mean is wanting to do everything right in order to win.

The statement "turning the ratings off" and looking at the players stats and scout evaluations - like to clarify that.

in an online league which is the only place i would play with scouts I can't turn off the ratings so i assume u mean don't look at the ratings. don't look at stars, contact ratings etc but look at the stats and the updated evaluations. Is that understood correctly?

Does the word ratings also apply to intelligence, work ethic, greed etc. Is it possible for a scout to think a player has a low work ethic when he actually has a high work ethic?

[olivertheorem]

Don't know about the personality stuff (I leave it on but mostly ignore it).

With scouts and ratings on, you look at both the ratings (individual, anyway; I ignore overall mostly) and stats. Ideally the two mesh, meaning that if the scout say's he's good, then he plays good. Sometimes (often?) they don't mesh, so the scout will say he sucks but he's actually pretty good stat-wise, or vice versa. It's up to you to make the decision on which is right.

Plus, as someone else said, the written reports need some updating to jive better with the scouted ratings.