How to be financially stable...?

[battists]

Hey folks, long time no see!

I come to you today not as former OOTP Dev manual writer and such, but as a fellow gamer.

It has been a few years since I stopped being involved with the development of OOTP, and I've barely touched the game since then. Honestly, even back then, I rarely had time to actually PLAY the darned thing! So, I recently fired up a copy of OOTP 14 and am actually back to enjoying the game I first got involved with back in 2005 or so.

My question for you is this: What tips do you OOTP gurus have for keeping my franchise financially stable?

I started a fictional league with a cap, but my particular love is starting with a very young squad and building from there. So, in my first year I had a payroll of around 30 million, compared to a 150 mil cap. We finished 13th out of 16 teams, which is about what I expected in season one, if not worse. (Season Score: 1. Haha.)

So, I'm now in the offseason, heading into free agency. There's a stud SS from Cuba on the market looking for about 20 mil per, but he looks like a can't-miss prospect. Five stars, contact and power, amazing defensively, plays the whole infield at a "plus" level, great intangibles, only 24. But I don't want to quickly have things get out of hand financially.

I was really never much for the financial side of things. So, what tips can you guys give me for improving my team while still staying fiscally responsible and not ending up in one of those "Oh crap, I screwed the financial pooch" moments?

Incidentally, I have the top-ranked minor league system, with 5 of the top 20 prospects in the league, but none of them are likely to contribute this year at the major league level. The major league roster needs major league help, and the aforementioned SS wouldn't make me a contender, but he would sure be a huge step in the right direction!

Help!

~Steve

[RchW]

Good to hear from you Steve. Too tired to look at it now. Tomorrow though.

[TGH-Adfabre]

1) Thanks for all the work you did when you were involved.

Here are the first questions.
Is the SS a prospect or a developed player?
I have signed players expecting to be in bad shape until the 2nd, 3rd or 4th of the contract.
Is there compensation involved in the signing?
Sounds like he will be 2/3rds of your cap, how is your fan interest and loyalty? How was attendance last season and did you make money?

My initial response would be based on these answers. If there is no compensation involved then I would seriously think about it, especially if I have a decent fan loyalty and decent attendance.
The primary mistake I make when taking over a bad team with a good minor league system is having the patience to develop the existing talent.

Good luck and thanks again,
Tom

[Questdog]

Hey Steve! Very nice to know you are still alive!

The easiest way to manage the payroll is to not have one.....turn all that crap off.....when it's on, then the game is not about the players anymore and all about maximizing your asset values (just like real life)......but if you must, then you need to decide if you want to do it realistically or not.....'cause it is real easy to game the system by signing the young players to low ball deals to avoid their arbitration windfalls....by doing that, you will have tons of cash to spend on free agents and you will easily dominate the computer AI......so, basically I always let all the youngsters go to arbitration and pay them what they are really worth or sometimes more...that way, I really have a limited amount to spend on free agents and have to make tough decisions instead of just signing anybody I want.....and I never (or very rarely) sign a starting player in free agency; I use it to fill the holes on my bench.....

[Mr. Baseball]

If you want to be evil, sign guys to no longer than three-year deals with a vesting option for the third year if they play 100 games. If you don't like their performance, bench them after they've played in 99 games and save the additional money on the third contract year.

It might seem like an obvious strategy, but a lot of people don't take advantage of vesting years like they should. You should at least try and include them in virtually every initial offer. They're extremely helpful IMO.

[battists]

Hi guys,

Thanks for the feedback! I'm not much of a "system-gamer," so I am more likely to let guys reach arbitration too like QD.

The SS is a full-blown talent:




This is my financial situation:

[Nunyer]

I'd make a run at that shortstop, a definite building block... Although I could easily see his number climbing well over $20m per year once the feeding frenzy starts.

As far as signing guys prior to / during arbitration... I don't think that's always an exploit. Guys usually aren't making anywhere near their fair market value when under arbitration anyways... And there are lots of real life examples of players taking lower guaranteed values prior to the open market... Before getting his record breaking extension, the Tigers signed Verlander at 5 years / $80m which covered his last three arb years as well as his first two years when he could have been a free agent. Sometimes players will take the bird in the hand. $80m today might be preferred to risking injury before your potential $150m two years down the road.

Granted, this wouldn't cover something in OOTP designed to explicitly lowball a guy to something closer to the league minimum than his actual open market value... But I think most people know when they are gaming the system or not... So it's a judgement call.

My current stud starter is 27 years old. He is making $2.8m this year and arbitration will give him something in the range of $7m next year. On the open market, assuming his current pace and no injuries, he'll be a $20m player. I've talked extension numbers at around 4 years / $50m... So I dunno if that's an exploit or not... but I'm going to offer it.

[battists]

Hmmm. Here's another interesting note:

I went through the finances of all of the other teams in the league. None of them has more than 10 mil available to sign free agents, while I have close to 74 mil.

I wonder if I can low-ball this guy just because no one else can afford to pay him? Or if the other teams will somehow magically come up with the money...

Hmmm.

[OBSL Commish]

Sign him to a backloaded deal. 7 years, 140 million. Make the first 5 years $10 million or less each year, then the last two years would be options at $45 million each. It's an exploit, for sure, but you are offering him what he wants, essentially.

[Nunyer]

Originally Posted by battists

Hmmm. Here's another interesting note:

I went through the finances of all of the other teams in the league. None of them has more than 10 mil available to sign free agents, while I have close to 74 mil.

I wonder if I can low-ball this guy just because no one else can afford to pay him? Or if the other teams will somehow magically come up with the money...

Hmmm.

I don't think anybody will magically come up with money... but other teams could backload the deal. $9m in the first year could be offset down the road

$9m
$15m
$20m
$24m
$28m
$28m

Something like that and they skate around the $10m they have today but still give him 6 years at $20m per year.

If you really want him, don't mess around. Depending on his greed rating, maybe you could get him at an average of $17-$18m per year... And if you don't think you'll be blowing every dime of your budget wad in the near term, then consider slightly front loading the deal to have some extra cash down the road when this contract is coming to a close but all those promising prospects you have start hitting ML arbitration.

[Orcin]

A couple of general suggestions:

Don't become emotionally attached to your older players. It's hard, but you will need to keep dumping them to replace them with cost-controlled players.

Use the time between the end of the season and free agency to dump salary, before offers are out that tie up the other team's available budget.

Don't spend a lot of money on your bullpen. You don't need a $10M closer to win. Look for young hard-throwers that are cost-controlled, and trade them when they get ready to demand the big bucks.

[Nunyer]

The bullpen is an excellent area to save money... especially after you've built a competitive team and start drafting towards the bottom of the order. Nearly ML ready college relievers are almost always available at the bottom of the 1st and 2nd rounds... Unless they have major injury or personality red flags, I find these guys rarely flame out and are usually ML ready in under two years. This can be a HUGE cost savings. Granted, you are NOT going to be developing other positions in the minors... but if you don't get too attached to your older players... you can sell high and drive other positional prospects into your farm system via that route.

In one of my fictional leagues, I went a good four year stretch when my entire bullpen combined was cheaper than almost every other starting roster spot.... Over that stretch, I probably paid a total of $4m to $8m for the entire seven man pen against a total payroll of $115-$130m. Usually had 3-4 guys at the minimum with the other 3-4 guys somewhere in early arbitration. That gravy train didn't last forever, and some long term higher dollar contracts eventually got handed out... I had one lefty and one righty that were just too good to let walk... But that was some great financial flexibility when it lasted.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Orcin

A couple of general suggestions:

Don't become emotionally attached to your older players. It's hard, but you will need to keep dumping them to replace them with cost-controlled players.

Use the time between the end of the season and free agency to dump salary, before offers are out that tie up the other team's available budget.

Don't spend a lot of money on your bullpen. You don't need a $10M closer to win. Look for young hard-throwers that are cost-controlled, and trade them when they get ready to demand the big bucks.

This is excellent advice. I arrived at these guidelines independently, and I can tell you that they work. I would add to it to never, ever offer an older player a contract for longer than one year.

[Raidergoo]

Don't get attached to any player, they are all expendable. Trade any player before they go to free agency. Trade any player who returns from an injury with a 'fragile' rating or worse. Do not get into bidding wars for Free Agents. Spend money on minor league scouting, and international free agents, and less on amateur scouting. When you develop good, young talent, try to sign them to a deal that buys out one year of free agency. Don't let talented minor league players start the season in the majors, promote them in mid-June, in an attempt to avoid super-2 status.

I like to trade players about the 6 year mark. I like to get minor league prospects with 2 years under their belt. I spend good money on minors scouting vs. amateur scouting, because I can trade for anyone, but, I only get one first round pick. My draft picks tends to be in the 20's, so by that point, the draft is starting to become a crap-shoot.

Lately, my bullpens are filled with Latin American MR's that came up through my international academy. I like to sign a lot of second-tier pitching prospects. They will be very cheap (like $80,000 cheap), and enough of them develop that my bullpens cost about $5-6 million a season, total. I like signing "flawed" pitchers, like 16 year old kids that have just two pitches, or, guys that throw 5 pitches but have no stamina. They are flawed in the sense that they won't be major league level starters. They tend to be good relievers.

Chicks dig the long ball. Thus, home run hitters are overvalued. Same thing with great starting pitching. I avoid big boppers and concentrate on walks and doubles. I like average pitchers, and surround them with great defense. Great defense is much cheaper than great pitching, and produces nearly the same outcome.

Eventually, I can get my team in a position where I win 90-95 games a season, and make money by the bucket. Then I use the surplus budget to violate my rules on a case by case basis.

[battists]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

This is excellent advice. I arrived at these guidelines independently, and I can tell you that they work. I would add to it to never, ever offer an older player a contract for longer than one year.

What is your definition of "an older player"?

[Rizon]

As an accountant, my answer is: I dunno, I just do it. It's kinda like breathing.

[Rizon]

The salary chart is helpful to me. I export it to Excel and lay it out, and see what room I have this year and in future years.



I never overpay for a player. I rank them by "bang for buck" value by taking their salary request divided by whatever arbitrary rating I give them. Obviously, don't pay top dollar for some guy who always under-performs his ratings.



I never pay ginormous chunks of my total salaries/cap/budget on one player.

If I have plenty of cap space I'll take a gamble somewhere.

[battists]

All of this feedback is great, thanks!

Rizon, what is the column labeled CR?

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by battists

What is your definition of "an older player"?

The wrong side of 30. My teams are young, cheap and financially stable.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Rizon

As an accountant...

Trust an accountant to have a spreadsheet for that.