State of FHM: July 13

[grimmo20]

Originally Posted by JeffR

But I'd like to see the AIHL (and the Asia League, the other significant league outside Europe and North America) in the game for the sake of broadening our international audience a bit.

This is a good move as Aussie hockey has boomed in the last few years. I know Melbourne Ice regularly sell out their stadium of over 1000 every game and the Melbourne Mustangs are getting close to 500-700 a game. This may not seem much compared to other leagues but this is huge in Australia.
Coincidently the league now has games broadcast on cable each week which is proving to be quite a hit as well.

[dave1927p]

Before any marketing is done, I would highly suggest a lot of work goes into the UI. Anyone new to the game would find it quite frustrating on the time it takes to navigate. It feels much like a chore at this point in time and seeing as how so much of the game you are navigating between screens, it is vital to the success of this game so a great first impression is a must.

[dejaqwho]

Originally Posted by Alessandro

Good one...

I know my post came off as dismissive of asking for extra stuff in the first version and you feel some anger over that.

It will be in your best interest to keep this game to core mechanics in the first version. Everything else will, and can be added over time. Do you want 100 things that works at 30% or 20 things that work 90%. Don't bite off more than you can chew, and other idioms apply here.

Regarding about you not caring for NHL...you are in a very small minority in that. Don't you think vast majority's concerns should be dealt with first? If there was no NHL no one would be making a hockey sim, so keep that in mind, just like if Football manager didn't cater to EPL, Spanish, Italian, German leagues...FM wouldn't exist. In fact I can tell you the the fist few versions on FM were specifically made catered for EPL.

[tfong]

Advertise the game on steam as a greenlight project.

[Alessandro]

Originally Posted by dejaqwho

It will be in your best interest to keep this game to core mechanics in the first version. Everything else will, and can be added over time. Do you want 100 things that works at 30% or 20 things that work 90%.

Of course I prefer 20 at 90%. But in these 20 there can be NHL and KHL and other great national leagues like Sweden, Finland, Czech Republic. You should know that these countries gifted (and it's not just a random word) a lot of players to the NHL to make it the best league in the world.

Regarding about you not caring for NHL...you are in a very small minority in that. Don't you think vast majority's concerns should be dealt with first? If there was no NHL no one would be making a hockey sim, so keep that in mind, just like if Football manager didn't cater to EPL, Spanish, Italian, German leagues...FM wouldn't exist. In fact I can tell you the the fist few versions on FM were specifically made catered for EPL.

I play Championship Manager since 1998 (unfortunately I stopped playing it around 2006-2007 for lack of time and explosion of EHM) so I do remember those times, very well. And now tell me, do you think FM would be the heck of a game it is now if it just had the English Premier League? Don't make me laugh.

[Alessandro]

Originally Posted by Jabez54

Alessandro ... If I offended you in anyway, I apologize, it was NOT meant to be taken that way ... I do not want your project to be halted, rather I applaud it ... for I was aiming to encourage to just concentrate One League, in the application format, to be sure it is solid, robust and stable enough that it would be the standard and easier to implement to add the rest of the Professional Leagues ... As in OOTP, when it first began back in 99, to where it is currently at ... NO Baseball Games out there, can match what OOTP can do, with all the options and abilities ... aside, I'm more into Fiction with all the Sport Games out there ... for I would certainly be playing KHL vs NHL, with Fictional players ... I do hope I clear that issue up with you ... no hard feelings meant to be here, mate ...

I understand your points.

[dejaqwho]

Originally Posted by Alessandro

I play Championship Manager since 1998 (unfortunately I stopped playing it around 2006-2007 for lack of time and explosion of EHM) so I do remember those times, very well. And now tell me, do you think FM would be the heck of a game it is now if it just had the English Premier League? Don't make me laugh.

I'll answer in reverse. You missed my point, of course FM wouldn't be anywhere near as good if it didn't have many league options. I just wanted to show you how FM(CM) started out, and that you can look forward to FHM starting out the same way and building up.

To your first point...don't do that, my opinion of you drops greatly when you bring silly emotion into this. NHL is the best league, best players from the countries you listed choose NHL over their home leagues for a reason. And no its not the money, otherwise KHL would attract the best players. Just like EPL, Spanish, Italian, German leagues are the best in soccer.

[Lazion]

Originally Posted by dejaqwho

And no its not the money, otherwise KHL would attract the best players. Just like EPL, Spanish, Italian, German leagues are the best in soccer.

It's about the money.. almost everything is about the money. That's reason why EPL, Spanish, Italian, German leagues are the best in soccer.
There is still things over that and those are prejudice and culturical differencies. If KHL expansion ends well things might change - more European star players leaving/staying in their home country rather than going overseas.

[archibalduk]

Originally Posted by dejaqwho

I'll answer in reverse. You missed my point, of course FM wouldn't be anywhere near as good if it didn't have many league options. I just wanted to show you how FM(CM) started out, and that you can look forward to FHM starting out the same way and building up.

To your first point...don't do that, my opinion of you drops greatly when you bring silly emotion into this. NHL is the best league, best players from the countries you listed choose NHL over their home leagues for a reason. And no its not the money, otherwise KHL would attract the best players. Just like EPL, Spanish, Italian, German leagues are the best in soccer.

The debate about playable leagues is entirely moot. There will be other playable leagues in the first version as per the beta. Jeff has said it's no big deal to add additional leagues.

And why hasn't anybody mentioned the British EIHL in the debate about which league is best... The KHL and SHL are surely as good as the NHL - and they have the added bonus of no lock-outs. Not every great player in the world of hockey plays in the NHL.

[Alessandro]

Originally Posted by dejaqwho

NHL is the best league, best players from the countries you listed choose NHL over their home leagues for a reason. And no its not the money, otherwise KHL would attract the best players. Just like EPL, Spanish, Italian, German leagues are the best in soccer.

I never said that the NHL isn't the best league of the world. But as Lazion said, it's because of money. Remember that in the '90s Russian stars emigrated en masse to NHL and other Euro leagues (especially in Switzerland) because in Russia simply there was no money after the collapse of the CCCP, and this spurred the influx of Euro players in North America and it lasts even today (even if it's slowly changing). So wasn't it for money? Of course it's all for money, if it was "for the glory", players would play for free

[Empach]

Originally Posted by JeffR

What I had been hoping to do to help the editing effort was introduce an online version of the database that would be editable by anyone with an approved ID (probably tied to forum ID's.)

Gotta say that is an exciting (and dangerous) idea. I know I could add details on specific players but I don't really have the time or knowledge to help in full leagues. Still it will need to be moderated pretty good.


Sounds like you've got a good handle on things Jeff. If there's anything we can do to help with the marketing campaign let us know.

[dejaqwho]

Originally Posted by Alessandro

I never said that the NHL isn't the best league of the world. But as Lazion said, it's because of money. Remember that in the '90s Russian stars emigrated en masse to NHL and other Euro leagues (especially in Switzerland) because in Russia simply there was no money after the collapse of the CCCP, and this spurred the influx of Euro players in North America and it lasts even today (even if it's slowly changing). So wasn't it for money? Of course it's all for money, if it was "for the glory", players would play for free

If players were motivated by money they would go to KHL in greater numbers then they do now. A player that signs a 10mill AVV deal in NHL after taxes he will have 5-6M left. In the KHL 10 mill is 10mill, no taxes on KHL players. So thats 2x difference in money. I can't accept the argument that its all about the money in Hockey.

[dejaqwho]

Originally Posted by archibalduk

Not every great player in the world of hockey plays in the NHL.

Not every, but most do.

[Rob316]

Hi Jeff, I have a simple question that I hope you wouldn't mind addressing... I've seen far to many players that don't fight and take penalties becoming PIM leaders and fighting major leaders in my games (Yakopov, Semin) and would like to ask if they're is any way you guys will be fixing the physical side of things such as teams dressing tough players and addressing they're lineups with playing a tougher game as well ?

The Enforcers in the game are virtually useless and many teams who do have some tough and tumble players very rarely play them or even bother using them at all. Can we all expect to see the leagues value these players more rather then them becoming UFA's and staying unsigned or demoted to the minor leagues for they're careers ? I only ask this because I love to sport a tough team and usually find the way the players are reacting especially the players who do regulary fight not actually performing into they're roles. I have noticed virtually every team in the NHL demotes anyone with toughness leaving teams with no sense to even dress guys that can fight leaving the feeling of a soft approach to the game ..

[QMJHL_GUY]

I can definitely help out with the QMJHL if need be. Just shoot me a pm.

[Alessandro]

Originally Posted by dejaqwho

If players were motivated by money they would go to KHL in greater numbers then they do now. A player that signs a 10mill AVV deal in NHL after taxes he will have 5-6M left. In the KHL 10 mill is 10mill, no taxes on KHL players. So thats 2x difference in money. I can't accept the argument that its all about the money in Hockey.

NHL salary cap is much greater than KHL salary cap, by at least 25 million dollars. So, who pays more?
And also, it's not that in Russia taxes aren't paid. There is a flat 13% tax on Russian citizens and 30% on foreigner citizens. Just that usually in Europe salaries are meant AFTER taxes, not only in sports, but also in everyday living. Teams do pay these taxes and they have to be considered while negotiating with players. Stars salaries are similar between NHL and KHL, but other salaries are usually bigger in North America.

[Primis]

Where does Fictional Mode stand as of now?

[tcblcommish]

Originally Posted by Primis

Where does Fictional Mode stand as of now?

Unfinished and being worked on

[hockeyfanatic]

Will leagues be fully editable and customizable in the next update? Also, are all these nations leagues going to be playable? I hope so

[sprague]

Originally Posted by Rob316

Hi Jeff, I have a simple question that I hope you wouldn't mind addressing... I've seen far to many players that don't fight and take penalties becoming PIM leaders and fighting major leaders in my games (Yakopov, Semin) and would like to ask if they're is any way you guys will be fixing the physical side of things such as teams dressing tough players and addressing they're lineups with playing a tougher game as well ?

The Enforcers in the game are virtually useless and many teams who do have some tough and tumble players very rarely play them or even bother using them at all. Can we all expect to see the leagues value these players more rather then them becoming UFA's and staying unsigned or demoted to the minor leagues for they're careers ? I only ask this because I love to sport a tough team and usually find the way the players are reacting especially the players who do regulary fight not actually performing into they're roles. I have noticed virtually every team in the NHL demotes anyone with toughness leaving teams with no sense to even dress guys that can fight leaving the feeling of a soft approach to the game ..

I am bumping Rob's question. It is very important, and no one seems to be answering it