Two Trading Questions

JMDurron · 01-06-2013, 11:11 PM

My initial searching did not indicate an answer to either of the following questions relating to trading in OOTP 13.

1) For "Thought Required Trades", where you submit the offer and await an AI response, has anyone actually had the AI accept such an offer? What I see the OOTP 13 manual describing as "No Brainer" trades are the only ones that I ever have seen the AI accept.

2) Does the AI actually factor in cash into any trade as an asset, beyond simply preventing budget hits for teams in the red? I ask because I was adding some cash to a deal where I was sending two middling prospects out of the most recent draft (so some potential upside, albeit unproven) and some cash in exchange for a late round draft pick. The initial offer of two players for the pick led to the "Thought Required Trades" submission option, which I obviously did not select since that translates to "NO WAY!" in my mind, as that is the only response I have ever seen from the AI. I threw in $1M to sweeten the pot, and saw no change. I thought that was odd, so as an experiment, I increased my offer to $10M, then $70M. There was no change. That strikes me as odd, the AI should recognize the value difference in a trade offer between $1M, $10M, or $70M dollars, because I know I was trying to trade for something with significantly less value than my final experimental cash amount offer.

I did not force any trade because that's not the point here, I'm trying to understand where I might be missing something about the trade AI that the community at large might understand better than I do. If cash can't be used as a trade sweetener, but merely as a "do no harm" budget line balancing action for a team in the red, what can it actually be used for?

OBSL Commish · 01-06-2013, 11:32 PM

For me, the answer to both questions is yes. I have offered the AI cash in a trade where they were close to going over budget and they accepted it. I have also included cash in a deal where they didn't want an overpaid veteran and that swayed them to take my deal.

dawg_gone · 01-07-2013, 06:57 AM

I can only really speak to #1 but yes, I have had an AI GM come back to me on one of those 'I need to think about this' trades and say, 'Yeah, let's do this before I change my mind.' I've also had an AI GM come back and say, 'Let's discuss this some more. If you add X I'll go for it.'

On the cash thing, I have done some boundary testing involving low draft picks vs. cash and it's always easier to get what I want with draft picks - if the AI GM is above water. Cash does some to have its greatest utility in keeping the AI GM from going underwater on a trade, which practice you have already noted, but it may be because I have only played with low budget teams and haven't had truly serious cash to throw around.

Cinnamon J. Scudworth · 01-07-2013, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMDurron

For "Thought Required Trades", where you submit the offer and await an AI response, has anyone actually had the AI accept such an offer? What I see the OOTP 13 manual describing as "No Brainer" trades are the only ones that I ever have seen the AI accept.

I just had this happen.

I just traded my top shortstop (sort of a Jose Reyes/NY Mets situation -- last year of his contract, can't afford to re-sign him) for another team's very good pitching prospect. The other GM initially thought about it and came back asking for (among other possibilities) one of my major league outfielders. I didn't want to part with the specific outfielder he asked for, so I tried the trade again with a different outfielder. The other team's GM had to think about it again, and it came back accepted. One of the more satisfying trade experiences I've had in OOTP.

JMDurron · 01-07-2013, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cinnamon J. Scudworth

I just had this happen.

I just traded my top shortstop (sort of a Jose Reyes/NY Mets situation -- last year of his contract, can't afford to re-sign him) for another team's very good pitching prospect. The other GM initially thought about it and came back asking for (among other possibilities) one of my major league outfielders. I didn't want to part with the specific outfielder he asked for, so I tried the trade again with a different outfielder. The other team's GM had to think about it again, and it came back accepted. One of the more satisfying trade experiences I've had in OOTP.

Awesome! This is very exciting news for me! It'll stretch trades out over calendar days, but I'm perfectly happy with the tradeoff of knowing that there is at least a chance of something beyond instant acceptance being workable.

01-06-2013, 11:11 PM	#1
JMDurron All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2011 Posts: 1,262	Two Trading Questions My initial searching did not indicate an answer to either of the following questions relating to trading in OOTP 13. 1) For "Thought Required Trades", where you submit the offer and await an AI response, has anyone actually had the AI accept such an offer? What I see the OOTP 13 manual describing as "No Brainer" trades are the only ones that I ever have seen the AI accept. 2) Does the AI actually factor in cash into any trade as an asset, beyond simply preventing budget hits for teams in the red? I ask because I was adding some cash to a deal where I was sending two middling prospects out of the most recent draft (so some potential upside, albeit unproven) and some cash in exchange for a late round draft pick. The initial offer of two players for the pick led to the "Thought Required Trades" submission option, which I obviously did not select since that translates to "NO WAY!" in my mind, as that is the only response I have ever seen from the AI. I threw in $1M to sweeten the pot, and saw no change. I thought that was odd, so as an experiment, I increased my offer to $10M, then $70M. There was no change. That strikes me as odd, the AI should recognize the value difference in a trade offer between $1M, $10M, or $70M dollars, because I know I was trying to trade for something with significantly less value than my final experimental cash amount offer. I did not force any trade because that's not the point here, I'm trying to understand where I might be missing something about the trade AI that the community at large might understand better than I do. If cash can't be used as a trade sweetener, but merely as a "do no harm" budget line balancing action for a team in the red, what can it actually be used for?

01-06-2013, 11:32 PM	#2
OBSL Commish All Star Reserve Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 946	For me, the answer to both questions is yes. I have offered the AI cash in a trade where they were close to going over budget and they accepted it. I have also included cash in a deal where they didn't want an overpaid veteran and that swayed them to take my deal.

01-07-2013, 06:57 AM	#3
dawg_gone Minors (Double A) Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 106	I can only really speak to #1 but yes, I have had an AI GM come back to me on one of those 'I need to think about this' trades and say, 'Yeah, let's do this before I change my mind.' I've also had an AI GM come back and say, 'Let's discuss this some more. If you add X I'll go for it.' On the cash thing, I have done some boundary testing involving low draft picks vs. cash and it's always easier to get what I want with draft picks - if the AI GM is above water. Cash does some to have its greatest utility in keeping the AI GM from going underwater on a trade, which practice you have already noted, but it may be because I have only played with low budget teams and haven't had truly serious cash to throw around.