Pittsburgh radio host hates sabermetrics

[goosedennis]

So on my way to work this morning, I was listening to The Fan. Yes, I realize that this was probably my first mistake. However, coming off a good win yesterday and the first 4-game sweep at PNC Park in six years, I figured it would just be a nice way to hear some good "Go Bucs" talk. I was wrong. As a disclaimer, I must first say that I was not one of the callers. I am not simply trying to defend myself. One guy called in this morning and asked quite simply whether the Pirates might consider trading Joel Hanrahan at the deadline. Paul Alexander, quickly dismissed the idea and assured the caller that the Pirates weren't sellers anymore. A few minutes later, another guy called in and very calmly said that he thinks it might not be a terrible idea for the Pirates to try and move Hanrahan for another bat or a starting pitcher. Alexander started yelling about how it was a stupid idea. The guy jumped in and said that he actually had some stats that back up his point of view. Alexander said he didn't care what the guy's stats said, not just anybody can close. Not to be deterred, the caller jumped in again and pointed out that the Braves used 10 different closers during their 14 playoff appearances from '91-'05. Good point, right? Wrong. Because the Braves "only" won one World Series during that time. Apparently, a decade and a half of playoff baseball including five NL Pennants and one World Series title isn't good enough for Mr. Alexander. Alexander pointed to the Yankees' most recent dynasty and said that their string of WS titles proves that closers are important because Mariano Rivera was the closer the entire time. I see, Derek Jeter, Jorge Posada, Bernie Williams, Andy Pettite, Roger Clemens, Jason Giambi, Alex Rodriguez and the rest of the Yankees 200 million dollar payroll had nothing to do with it, it was all about Mo. Shame on me for not seeing that earlier.

Paul Alexander's Gut Feelings > Sabermetrics - Bucs Dugout

I tried calling in this morning and was screened out. I wonder why...

[jbergey22]

Paul Alexander is the reason baseball strategies are still flawed 140+ years after the first MLB game. Too stubborn to realize his outdated flawed strategies are being bypassed by smarter people. Its one thing to not agree with something its another to call a person out for being prepared.

[Green & Gold Heart]

The Phillies one from a year or so ago was the best, where the radio guy was mad at someone for saying Ryan Howard wasn't that good. Ryan Howard was awesome because of ZOMG RBIs!!!!!!!!!111

[RchW]

Half the broadcasters in Baseball believe this.

[Orcin]

The new fad in radio sports talk appears to be trolling.

The host throws out an obviously unsupportable opinion, and then proceeds to yell and scream in support of it. The listener is then supposed to call in, offering logic, which the host deflects with more emotionally-charged comments. The cycle repeats, creating more and more listeners as you tweet your friends telling them what this moron on the radio said.

Completely unlistenable, in my opinion.

[Jordan]

That dope apparently forgot about John Wetteland. I think he'd have something to say about it being all about Mariano

[Goody]

Sabermetrics are still working in Seattle.

[dsvitak]

You want a reason why I am a big sabermetrics fan???

Look up Luis Aparacio's stats, and attempt to justify to me why he was a starter, much less a Hall of Famer.

Luis Aparicio Statistics and History - Baseball-Reference.com

How the hell can a player with a lifetime OPS of 82 even be considered?

Lifetime .262 batting average.

Lifetime .311 OBP

Lifetime .343 SLG

Lifetime .654 OPS. Really? REALLY?

11230 plate appearances, and he batted leadoff the entire time, and never scored a hundred runs in a year.

He made more than 8000 outs in his career, higher than Cobb, Musial, or Mays. Jesus.

I will throw him a bone for his defense...but it isn't enough, for me.

[The Game]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

You want a reason why I am a big sabermetrics fan???

Look up Luis Aparacio's stats, and attempt to justify to me why he was a starter, much less a Hall of Famer.

Luis Aparicio Statistics and History - Baseball-Reference.com

How the hell can a player with a lifetime OPS of 82 even be considered?

Lifetime .262 batting average.

Lifetime .311 OBP

Lifetime .343 SLG

Lifetime .654 OPS. Really? REALLY?

11230 plate appearances, and he batted leadoff the entire time, and never scored a hundred runs in a year.

He made more than 8000 outs in his career, higher than Cobb, Musial, or Mays. Jesus.

I will throw him a bone for his defense...but it isn't enough, for me.

Little Luis was among the best defensive SS of his era and among his peak year of '56 thru '64 he led the league in SB each year. He isn't the same type of hitter as Cobb, Musial or Mays so why compare him to them?
He also didn;'t go in until his 6th year of eligibility so it's not like he was a 1st ballot HOFer.
Aparcio has more hits then Ozzie Smith, slightly less SB.Same career avg. More PO, slightly less Asst. More E and slightly less fld % Slightly more Chances. So if Aparicio is not a HOFer take Ozzie out also, yet Ozzie was 1st ballot.
Did I forget to mention I don't like sabermetrics either.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by The Game

Little Luis was among the best defensive SS of his era and among his peak year of '56 thru '64 he led the league in SB each year. He isn't the same type of hitter as Cobb, Musial or Mays so why compare him to them?
He also didn;'t go in until his 6th year of eligibility so it's not like he was a 1st ballot HOFer.
Aparcio has more hits then Ozzie Smith, slightly less SB.Same career avg. More PO, slightly less Asst. More E and slightly less fld % Slightly more Chances. So if Aparicio is not a HOFer take Ozzie out also, yet Ozzie was 1st ballot.
Did I forget to mention I don't like sabermetrics either.

Well Ozzie was a 70+ WAR player while Aparacio was a 51.7 WAR player. So really they arent that comparable.

[Goody]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

11230 plate appearances, and he batted leadoff the entire time, and never scored a hundred runs in a year.

Aren't runs scored much more attributed to the hitters after you? Assuming your OBP is at least a ways above .300

[Orcin]

Originally Posted by dsvitak

Look up Luis Aparacio's stats, and attempt to justify to me why he was a starter, much less a Hall of Famer.

I agree with much of what you said, but the context of the time in which he played needs to be considered. Look at the other shortstops in the 1960's. I think you will find that Luis was in the upper half offensively, without considering the stolen bases. With them, he was clearly in the upper echelon, without considering defense. With defense thrown in, he was arguably the best at his position over the course of the decade.

He would been the starter at shortstop on nearly every team in the majors. I give you Maury Wills. Throw in Dick Groat for the early part of the decade and Bert Campaneris for the last half. That's about it from memory. Please don't attempt to argue guys like Jim Fregosi who couldn't carry Luis' glove. If Luis were on the same team with Fregosi, Luis would have played SS and Fregosi 3B.

[damientheomen3]

Originally Posted by Orcin

The new fad in radio sports talk appears to be trolling.

The host throws out an obviously unsupportable opinion, and then proceeds to yell and scream in support of it. The listener is then supposed to call in, offering logic, which the host deflects with more emotionally-charged comments. The cycle repeats, creating more and more listeners as you tweet your friends telling them what this moron on the radio said.

Completely unlistenable, in my opinion.

Not only that, but the sports television shows are going the exact same way.

I call it the Skip Bayless Effect.

[Antonin]

Originally Posted by Orcin

The new fad in radio sports talk appears to be trolling.

The host throws out an obviously unsupportable opinion, and then proceeds to yell and scream in support of it. The listener is then supposed to call in, offering logic, which the host deflects with more emotionally-charged comments. The cycle repeats, creating more and more listeners as you tweet your friends telling them what this moron on the radio said.

Completely unlistenable, in my opinion.

You have provided a nearly perfect description of most sports talk radio here in Cleveland, Ohio. Lots of times, though, the host doesn't just deflect the caller with more emotionally-charged comments--he just screams "You're an idiot!" and hangs up, laughing to his cohost.

[hfield007]

Originally Posted by Green & Gold Heart

The Phillies one from a year or so ago was the best, where the radio guy was mad at someone for saying Ryan Howard wasn't that good. Ryan Howard was awesome because of ZOMG RBIs!!!!!!!!!111

Sean Forman from baseball reference was the one saying about Howard not being as great as he was claimed to be. haha it was hard to watch the others actually defend Howard.

funnily enough when introduced in the 1880s fans scoffed at the use of RBI in a Buffalo paper because of the many flaws.

[Jason Moyer]

Originally Posted by Goody

Aren't runs scored much more attributed to the hitters after you? Assuming your OBP is at least a ways above .300

To a degree, I suppose, but there's a much stronger correlation between ability and runs scored than there is between ability and RBI.

And to answer the Aparicio question, he's in partially because he stole 506 bases at a 78% clip, which means his offensive contributions were greater than his OPS would indicate, but mostly he's in because he's one of the greatest defensive players in history. Well, that's not really why he's in, but it's a justification for including him.

[Kobie]

Originally Posted by Orcin

The new fad in radio sports talk appears to be trolling.

The host throws out an obviously unsupportable opinion, and then proceeds to yell and scream in support of it. The listener is then supposed to call in, offering logic, which the host deflects with more emotionally-charged comments. The cycle repeats, creating more and more listeners as you tweet your friends telling them what this moron on the radio said.

Completely unlistenable, in my opinion.

This is Colin Cowherd's entire show. Which is why Colin Cowherd is an utterly worthless pustule.

[rocknfire7]

I'd love to be in an OOTP league with a few guys who didn't like sabermetrics. That is until I got bored trading dime a dozen closers for specs. Can anyone close? No. Is there always someone around who can? Yes! I love sabermetrics!

[The Game]

Originally Posted by Kobie

This is Colin Cowherd's entire show. Which is why Colin Cowherd is an utterly worthless pustule.

Coward said that Omar Vizquel is not HOF worthy. As far as his #'s as a SS he ranks 1st or 2nd in several categories. Also saying after just 8 seasons Eli Manning is a HOF even if he doesn't play another game vs Ben Roethlisberger is why he is worthless to me. I don't even watch Sportsnation anymore after Beads left.

[Kobie]

Originally Posted by The Game

Coward said that Omar Vizquel is not HOF worthy. As far as his #'s as a SS he ranks 1st or 2nd in several categories. Also saying after just 8 seasons Eli Manning is a HOF even if he doesn't play another game vs Ben Roethlisberger is why he is worthless to me. I don't even watch Sportsnation anymore after Beads left.

Actually, I think you can make several legitimate arguments as to why Omar Vizquel isn't a Hall of Famer. But Cowherd is still a first-class tool.

I didn't watch Sportsnation even with Beadle. Just an utterly awful show.