English and not familiar........Help

Crabster · 06-01-2003, 07:26 PM

I`m from over the pond (England) and I am one of those rare English baseball nuts so I`m sorry for being a bit dumb in these matters....There are a couple of abrieviations I don`t know..............What is a Whiff ? and what are :- RSTA , OPS, and RTO........ also what is WHIP....?? HELP anyone please ???

Scott Vibert · 06-01-2003, 07:43 PM

A whiff is slang for a strike out.

WHIP is Walks + Hits per Inning Pitched
OPS is On Base Plus Slugging
RTO is Runners Thrown Out
RSTA is (I Think) Runners Stealing Attempts

Hope this helps.

Crabster · 06-01-2003, 07:46 PM

Thanks very much for that.........It makes more sense now........
Could you explain the slugging % to me as well.........many thanks

tcblcommish · 06-01-2003, 07:53 PM

slugging percentage I can't explain but if you go to www.baseball-reference.com and go to a player and click the glossary link it will explain all the statistical catagories i think.

Hope this helps

Scott Vibert · 06-01-2003, 07:57 PM

Slugging Percentage is calculated by Adding a Batters "Total Bases" and dividing by the number of at bats.

A batter gets 1 base for a single, 2 for a double, 3 for a triple, and 4 for a home run.

You would add the value of all his hits together to get his total bases.

The highest possible slugging percentage is 4.000 (percentage is actually a misnomer (sp?)) or 4 bases per each at bat.

Hope this helps.

Crabster · 06-01-2003, 08:06 PM

Yeah..............great...............many thanks

baseball brat · 06-02-2003, 11:44 AM

I've got a question for you, Crabster...why do you think baseball hasn't caught on in England and Europe in general? It seems like that's a huge source of potential talent. With Major League Baseball becoming more international in scope with players from Latin America, Japan, Korea, and Australia, it seems like MLB would try to tap Europe as well.

Tyke · 06-02-2003, 12:26 PM

I'm also in the U.K. and apparently a British team won the World Amateur championship [beating the U.S.] in 1938, but things never took off. Our major summer sport in cricket, but I feel that is fading at the moment - probably due to the dreadful performances of the England team in recent years. I have always felt that, for a Brit growing up with cricket, it's not too much of a leap to baseball: bowlers and pitchers both use speed, flight and various forms of guile to try and beat the batter; play in the field is similar [though without gloves, in thecase of cricket]; and statistics also play a major part. The other big similarity is that, as with baseball, there is a great tradition of quality writing about cricket which helps evoke the game in days gone by, appealing to the nostagia in all of us.

Given the above, I also wonder why MLB has not made a big push over here. I went to a game in London about 8 years ago between minor leaguers from the Mets and Red Sox systems but, apart from that, I don't think there has been a serious effort. There is a domestic league, being helped at the moment by publicity on Channel 5, the TV station that broadcasts one MLB game per week - which will rise to 2 games per week when the NHL playoffs end. The MLB pundit on the show plays for the national team and they do what they can to "plug" the domestic game.

A few years back the NFL made quite an effort over here, with preseason games [I saw Joe Montana, Steve Young & the 49ers, Mike Ditka's cubs and the Cowboys] but it never really took off. There was the ambitiously titled "World Football League" with franchises in London, Edinburgh and cities in Europe, but that was rationalised into the present NFL Europe and the London franchise disappeared for lack of support. Possibly the NFL's lack of success has put off MLB, but I see them as offering completely different things and would be really happy to see MLB make a serious effort over here.

Gastric ReFlux · 06-02-2003, 12:35 PM

I think it all hinges on the fish and chips franchising.

ctorg · 06-02-2003, 12:59 PM

I think it's odd that soccer is so popular in the rest of the world outside the US, yet in the US it's still a fringe sport.

I guess when you give someone a choice between baseball and cricket, and they're much more familiar with cricket, they're going to choose that. Can you imagine trying to popularize cricket in the US? People would think it's too similar to baseball, most likely.

Tyke · 06-02-2003, 01:11 PM

"I think it all hinges on the fish and chips franchising"

With a name like yours, GR, I don't think anyone could argue.

CBL-Commish · 06-02-2003, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ctorg
I think it's odd that soccer is so popular in the rest of the world outside the US, yet in the US it's still a fringe sport.

I guess when you give someone a choice between baseball and cricket, and they're much more familiar with cricket, they're going to choose that. Can you imagine trying to popularize cricket in the US? People would think it's too similar to baseball, most likely.

I think the big problem you'd have trying to get cricket to catch on here is the pace and length of games. Many kids (and adults) today can't sit through two innings of baseball without whining about how slow and boring it is. International cricket test matches take something like five days to play, and the more recent, modified, quick game rules allow for a match to actually be completed in a single day.

What I'd like to see would be a US-based WWC... Vince McMahon bringing his unique (ahem) style to popularizing cricket in the US! Explosions! New York's leading bowler taking a folding chair to Seattle's star silly mid-off! Juiced balls for plenty of sixes and fours! No padding or masks, even for the wicket-keeper! Fireworks shooting out of the wicket when the bails are knocked off!! It would cause W.G. Grace to roll over in his grave about 200 times, but it would certainly make Americans aware of cricket for once in their lives.

Muppetus Galacticus · 06-02-2003, 06:33 PM

Just a quick note for the fellow Brits (hi)

If you have Sky or ntl there is a channel that covers baseball (5+ live games a week), hockey (5+ again), college US "football" (ahem), college basketball etc

www.nasn.com Its a tenner a month but its well worth it for us for the hockey alone. I'm the only one that likes the baseball, parents consider rounders it's superior relation

And also, cricket isn't meant to be exciting. It's an experiance

Muppetus Galacticus

Crabster · 06-02-2003, 07:36 PM

I agree with Tyke to some extent.....Being brought up on cricket in my family, I was taught how to hit a ball with a bat from a very early age at school and I thought it was great.....But I was totally unaware of the existance of baseball until I saw some game highlghts on the news in the seventies when I was in my teens.....It struck me as a very glitzy and glamourous affair and from that moment I was hooked....and by the way starved of any regular baseball on TV until the 1997 season........
Cricket, on the other hand, is basically taught and presented in a very English middle class environment and thus attracts a very English middle class audience who, I`m sorry to say, are not willing or ready to accept the philosophies and attitudes of baseball or indeed NFL NBA or even NHL, which in my view are quite down to earth and for everyone to enjoy................So, I think Baseball will always struggle for an audience over here because or the snobery and elitist attitudes which definately exists and are all too evident in sporting circles here and the fact that it`s someone elses national sport is probably too much to take......
You see, the usual attitude is that we were once world beaters in most of the sports we invented like Cricket, Soccer, Golf, Tennis, Rugby and even Hockey and with the possible exception of rugby we have been surpassed and get beaten on a regular basis by teams we once dominated.........but who cares about rugby. I think this really grates with many English sports fans who long for the day we actually win something again............
The very same sports fan who resents the US for calling the baseball finals the "World Series" when only US teams and a couple of token Canadian teams take part......and also have a major problem with the US being fantastic at games they invented or indeed distorted from other games like...Basketball from Netball....Baseball from Rounders or Softball and Ice hockey from hockey etc,...all of which have european origins ..........A little hypocritical I think...........
I keep trying to explain, but they are too rapped up in how bad we have become at soccer and cricket, there is no room for what are, to all intents and purposes, foreign games......So in conclusion I would say baseball, US football, Ice hockey and basketball are fighting a loosing battle to gain mass popularity here because of the real and intense desire for us to be superior at our own national sports.......and there is a distinct resentment of success when we fail. This intense desire to succeed at soccer and cricket results in the almost total exclusion of any alternative sport save for the very small minority........We do get live baseball on Sunday nights at around Midnight and are currently getting the Stanley cup finals around the same time, but as it`s the middle of the night, I shouldn`t imagine the figures are very large..but when the World Cup was on in the middle of the night everyone stayed up to watch and I mean everyone!!........
That says it all I think......
Anyway, I`ll be a baseball nut forever along with 1 of my mates...
I really do wish we were the champions of the soccer world again but the Braves winning the world series will do...........I`m not holding my breath though.........

Dave Crabtree

dougk62 · 06-02-2003, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tyke

A few years back the NFL made quite an effort over here, with preseason games [I saw Joe Montana, Steve Young & the 49ers, Mike Ditka's cubs and the Cowboys] but it never really took off.

I'm sure your mistake is totally innocent, but to me, being an avid Mike Ditka and Chicago Bear hater, that is very, very funny.

WeatherMike · 06-02-2003, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Tyke
...I have always felt that, for a Brit growing up with cricket, it's not too much of a leap to baseball: bowlers and pitchers both use speed, flight and various forms of guile to try and beat the batter...

What does bowling have to do with cricket?

Tyke · 06-03-2003, 05:03 AM

lol WeatherMike. If you'd seen recent England performances, you'd know!

And, dougk62, sorry about the slip. I was thinking about my post last night and realised I had put "Cubs" for "Bears" - but, like you I always hated them and especially Ditka and Jim McMahon.

Shefflad · 06-03-2003, 05:37 AM

Being an American who's lived in the UK for 18 years, I would love baseball to catch on. However, no 'new' sport has really caught on with the public here for more than a few years at a time ( American Football, for example) . A few have developed a minor following (ice hockey and basketball), and basketball has laid down roots in the community, to an extent. Baseball did have a period of growth in the late 19th century (Derby County FC's stadium was called the Baseball Ground, being built for that purpose.) America is similar: Soccer has laid down grass-roots, but has not developed into a major spectator sport. Maybe the culture of these 2 countries is unable to sustain any new sports, there is a limit.

Having travelled to the Netherlands and Italy recently, it is obvious that this is not a given in every country. Baseball is hardly a native Dutch sport, but they are more than capable: beating Cuba in the last olympics is indicative of this . Maybe their colonial heritage has something to do with this: Andruw Jones and the other 7 Netherlands-eligible players in MLB are from Curacao and Aruba. (BTW, Holland is also very competive in Cricket, so go figure) Italy and Australia are just sports-mad: I am certain they could pickup any sport and become competitive (Becoming a rugby league fan has made that obvious, bl+++y Kangaroos!)

So what's the answer? The answer might be better answered by a sociologist than a sports-fan I guess.

PFXCarty · 06-03-2003, 07:44 AM

I've discussed baseball and cricket to death on message boards around the internet...but I'll talk about a couple of factors to adress the bad reputation Cricket has...

The counties with the most people playing Cricket are Lancashire and Yorkshire. These are Working Class regions of England, not the snobby southern regions.

Cricket is in decline because of bad management which fails to succesfully tap into these areas. Average games often drew crowds of 40,000 or more in the 50s and 60s before the marketing gurus got into Football (soccer) and turned everyones attenton to that. They brought money and more importantly the media to Football and Cricket was left in the shadows.

The reason people see Cricket as an upper class sport is because the people who RUN it are. The people who manage the working of the sport have LORD in front of their name. Teams need to employ people with actual knowledge of marketing, and building firm financial bases. Not old men who only hamper the progress of the sport.

And the media doesn't help. It's ever so common to hear how "bad" the England national team is and how "boring" the sport it. But England ARE NOT that bad. In the last three years we have won 3 or 5 game series against the West Indies, Pakistan, South Africa, India and Sri Lanka. These are countries with great teams and players.

But the media, and so the non-cricketing public, forget these victories soon after and moan how we always lose to Australia. But Australia have aguably the BEST TEAM EVER in the history of Cricket at the moment. And yet to moan when we lose a series 3-1 for example. It's a pathetic, stereo-typical driven media.

English Cricket has been run badly for over a decade and the poor attendences, media coverage and reputation are a direct consequence. We've had and still do have some of the best players Cricket has seen, but they are demoralised and disillusioned by a sport where you put everything in and get little back from the media and fans alike.

Cricket needs sorting out. A great sport which is being killed off by old men in suits who are out of touch.

P.S For a nation of 60,000,000, the 2000 World series managed to pull in a watching public of 500,000. Not bad at all, and considering its in the early hours. Baseball is certainly growing. Terms are being used in Cricket for adapated purposes, such as Pinch Hitting (although not the same by definition in the two sports) and patricular grips such as the forkball.

I love Football (Soccer), Baseball and Cricket....but ironically Football is killing off pretty much every other sport around.

Tyke · 06-03-2003, 08:44 AM

PFXCarty, I pretty much agree with all you say, though I would have said that the mismanagement of cricket you talk about goes back way beyond 10 years!

The other comment I would make is in relation to what you say about Yorkshire and Lancashire. As my name imlplies, I am a Yorkshireman but I am ashamed of the attitude of the county organisation. We have a very large ethnically-mixed population, especially with Afro-Caribbean and Indian / Pakistani / Sri Lankan backgrounds, where cricket approaches the status of a religion. For all that, no Yorkshire born cricketer from any of those communities has ever been selected for the county team. Yes, the present "overseas professional" is Indian, but I remain saddened by this apparent racist approach. [I say "apparent" because some of those from our ethnic minorities have chosen to keep themselves apart from the county structure for cultural and sociological reasons that go way beyond sporting considerations - but that's whole other can of worms!]

06-01-2003, 07:26 PM	#1
Crabster Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Blackpool, England (Northwest) Posts: 229	English and not familiar..../...Why baseball is no hit in UK I`m from over the pond (England) and I am one of those rare English baseball nuts so I`m sorry for being a bit dumb in these matters....There are a couple of abrieviations I don`t know..............What is a Whiff ? and what are :- RSTA , OPS, and RTO........ also what is WHIP....?? HELP anyone please ??? Last edited by Crabster; 06-02-2003 at 09:13 PM.

06-01-2003, 07:46 PM	#3
Crabster Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Blackpool, England (Northwest) Posts: 229	Thanks very much for that.........It makes more sense now........ Could you explain the slugging % to me as well.........many thanks Last edited by Crabster; 06-01-2003 at 07:48 PM.

06-02-2003, 12:59 PM	#10
ctorg Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 9,848	I think it's odd that soccer is so popular in the rest of the world outside the US, yet in the US it's still a fringe sport. I guess when you give someone a choice between baseball and cricket, and they're much more familiar with cricket, they're going to choose that. Can you imagine trying to popularize cricket in the US? People would think it's too similar to baseball, most likely. __________________ My music "When the trees blow back and forth, that's what makes the wind." - Steven Wright Fjord emena pancreas thorax fornicate marmalade morpheme proteolysis smaxa cabana offal srue vitriol grope hallelujah lentils

06-02-2003, 07:36 PM	#14
Crabster Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Blackpool, England (Northwest) Posts: 229	I agree with Tyke to some extent.....Being brought up on cricket in my family, I was taught how to hit a ball with a bat from a very early age at school and I thought it was great.....But I was totally unaware of the existance of baseball until I saw some game highlghts on the news in the seventies when I was in my teens.....It struck me as a very glitzy and glamourous affair and from that moment I was hooked....and by the way starved of any regular baseball on TV until the 1997 season........ Cricket, on the other hand, is basically taught and presented in a very English middle class environment and thus attracts a very English middle class audience who, I`m sorry to say, are not willing or ready to accept the philosophies and attitudes of baseball or indeed NFL NBA or even NHL, which in my view are quite down to earth and for everyone to enjoy................So, I think Baseball will always struggle for an audience over here because or the snobery and elitist attitudes which definately exists and are all too evident in sporting circles here and the fact that it`s someone elses national sport is probably too much to take...... You see, the usual attitude is that we were once world beaters in most of the sports we invented like Cricket, Soccer, Golf, Tennis, Rugby and even Hockey and with the possible exception of rugby we have been surpassed and get beaten on a regular basis by teams we once dominated.........but who cares about rugby. I think this really grates with many English sports fans who long for the day we actually win something again............ The very same sports fan who resents the US for calling the baseball finals the "World Series" when only US teams and a couple of token Canadian teams take part......and also have a major problem with the US being fantastic at games they invented or indeed distorted from other games like...Basketball from Netball....Baseball from Rounders or Softball and Ice hockey from hockey etc,...all of which have european origins ..........A little hypocritical I think........... I keep trying to explain, but they are too rapped up in how bad we have become at soccer and cricket, there is no room for what are, to all intents and purposes, foreign games......So in conclusion I would say baseball, US football, Ice hockey and basketball are fighting a loosing battle to gain mass popularity here because of the real and intense desire for us to be superior at our own national sports.......and there is a distinct resentment of success when we fail. This intense desire to succeed at soccer and cricket results in the almost total exclusion of any alternative sport save for the very small minority........We do get live baseball on Sunday nights at around Midnight and are currently getting the Stanley cup finals around the same time, but as it`s the middle of the night, I shouldn`t imagine the figures are very large..but when the World Cup was on in the middle of the night everyone stayed up to watch and I mean everyone!!........ That says it all I think...... Anyway, I`ll be a baseball nut forever along with 1 of my mates... I really do wish we were the champions of the soccer world again but the Braves winning the world series will do...........I`m not holding my breath though......... Dave Crabtree Last edited by Crabster; 06-02-2003 at 08:54 PM.

06-01-2003, 07:43 PM	#2
Scott Vibert Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: My Computer Posts: 8,208	A whiff is slang for a strike out. WHIP is Walks + Hits per Inning Pitched OPS is On Base Plus Slugging RTO is Runners Thrown Out RSTA is (I Think) Runners Stealing Attempts Hope this helps.

06-01-2003, 07:53 PM	#4
tcblcommish Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 3,438	slugging percentage I can't explain but if you go to www.baseball-reference.com and go to a player and click the glossary link it will explain all the statistical catagories i think. Hope this helps

06-01-2003, 07:57 PM	#5
Scott Vibert Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: My Computer Posts: 8,208	Slugging Percentage is calculated by Adding a Batters "Total Bases" and dividing by the number of at bats. A batter gets 1 base for a single, 2 for a double, 3 for a triple, and 4 for a home run. You would add the value of all his hits together to get his total bases. The highest possible slugging percentage is 4.000 (percentage is actually a misnomer (sp?)) or 4 bases per each at bat. Hope this helps.

06-01-2003, 08:06 PM	#6
Crabster Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Blackpool, England (Northwest) Posts: 229	Yeah..............great...............many thanks

06-02-2003, 11:44 AM	#7
baseball brat Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 123	I've got a question for you, Crabster...why do you think baseball hasn't caught on in England and Europe in general? It seems like that's a huge source of potential talent. With Major League Baseball becoming more international in scope with players from Latin America, Japan, Korea, and Australia, it seems like MLB would try to tap Europe as well.

06-02-2003, 12:26 PM	#8
Tyke All Star Starter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Brighouse, West Yorkshire, U.K. Posts: 1,135	I'm also in the U.K. and apparently a British team won the World Amateur championship [beating the U.S.] in 1938, but things never took off. Our major summer sport in cricket, but I feel that is fading at the moment - probably due to the dreadful performances of the England team in recent years. I have always felt that, for a Brit growing up with cricket, it's not too much of a leap to baseball: bowlers and pitchers both use speed, flight and various forms of guile to try and beat the batter; play in the field is similar [though without gloves, in thecase of cricket]; and statistics also play a major part. The other big similarity is that, as with baseball, there is a great tradition of quality writing about cricket which helps evoke the game in days gone by, appealing to the nostagia in all of us. Given the above, I also wonder why MLB has not made a big push over here. I went to a game in London about 8 years ago between minor leaguers from the Mets and Red Sox systems but, apart from that, I don't think there has been a serious effort. There is a domestic league, being helped at the moment by publicity on Channel 5, the TV station that broadcasts one MLB game per week - which will rise to 2 games per week when the NHL playoffs end. The MLB pundit on the show plays for the national team and they do what they can to "plug" the domestic game. A few years back the NFL made quite an effort over here, with preseason games [I saw Joe Montana, Steve Young & the 49ers, Mike Ditka's cubs and the Cowboys] but it never really took off. There was the ambitiously titled "World Football League" with franchises in London, Edinburgh and cities in Europe, but that was rationalised into the present NFL Europe and the London franchise disappeared for lack of support. Possibly the NFL's lack of success has put off MLB, but I see them as offering completely different things and would be really happy to see MLB make a serious effort over here.

06-02-2003, 12:35 PM	#9
Gastric ReFlux Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Member #3409 Posts: 8,350	I think it all hinges on the fish and chips franchising.

06-02-2003, 01:11 PM	#11
Tyke All Star Starter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Brighouse, West Yorkshire, U.K. Posts: 1,135	"I think it all hinges on the fish and chips franchising" With a name like yours, GR, I don't think anyone could argue.

06-03-2003, 05:03 AM	#17
Tyke All Star Starter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Brighouse, West Yorkshire, U.K. Posts: 1,135	lol WeatherMike. If you'd seen recent England performances, you'd know! And, dougk62, sorry about the slip. I was thinking about my post last night and realised I had put "Cubs" for "Bears" - but, like you I always hated them and especially Ditka and Jim McMahon.

06-03-2003, 05:37 AM	#18
Shefflad Bat Boy Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: UK Posts: 14	Being an American who's lived in the UK for 18 years, I would love baseball to catch on. However, no 'new' sport has really caught on with the public here for more than a few years at a time ( American Football, for example) . A few have developed a minor following (ice hockey and basketball), and basketball has laid down roots in the community, to an extent. Baseball did have a period of growth in the late 19th century (Derby County FC's stadium was called the Baseball Ground, being built for that purpose.) America is similar: Soccer has laid down grass-roots, but has not developed into a major spectator sport. Maybe the culture of these 2 countries is unable to sustain any new sports, there is a limit. Having travelled to the Netherlands and Italy recently, it is obvious that this is not a given in every country. Baseball is hardly a native Dutch sport, but they are more than capable: beating Cuba in the last olympics is indicative of this . Maybe their colonial heritage has something to do with this: Andruw Jones and the other 7 Netherlands-eligible players in MLB are from Curacao and Aruba. (BTW, Holland is also very competive in Cricket, so go figure) Italy and Australia are just sports-mad: I am certain they could pickup any sport and become competitive (Becoming a rugby league fan has made that obvious, bl+++y Kangaroos!) So what's the answer? The answer might be better answered by a sociologist than a sports-fan I guess.

06-03-2003, 07:44 AM	#19
PFXCarty Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Apr 2003 Posts: 25	I've discussed baseball and cricket to death on message boards around the internet...but I'll talk about a couple of factors to adress the bad reputation Cricket has... The counties with the most people playing Cricket are Lancashire and Yorkshire. These are Working Class regions of England, not the snobby southern regions. Cricket is in decline because of bad management which fails to succesfully tap into these areas. Average games often drew crowds of 40,000 or more in the 50s and 60s before the marketing gurus got into Football (soccer) and turned everyones attenton to that. They brought money and more importantly the media to Football and Cricket was left in the shadows. The reason people see Cricket as an upper class sport is because the people who RUN it are. The people who manage the working of the sport have LORD in front of their name. Teams need to employ people with actual knowledge of marketing, and building firm financial bases. Not old men who only hamper the progress of the sport. And the media doesn't help. It's ever so common to hear how "bad" the England national team is and how "boring" the sport it. But England ARE NOT that bad. In the last three years we have won 3 or 5 game series against the West Indies, Pakistan, South Africa, India and Sri Lanka. These are countries with great teams and players. But the media, and so the non-cricketing public, forget these victories soon after and moan how we always lose to Australia. But Australia have aguably the BEST TEAM EVER in the history of Cricket at the moment. And yet to moan when we lose a series 3-1 for example. It's a pathetic, stereo-typical driven media. English Cricket has been run badly for over a decade and the poor attendences, media coverage and reputation are a direct consequence. We've had and still do have some of the best players Cricket has seen, but they are demoralised and disillusioned by a sport where you put everything in and get little back from the media and fans alike. Cricket needs sorting out. A great sport which is being killed off by old men in suits who are out of touch. P.S For a nation of 60,000,000, the 2000 World series managed to pull in a watching public of 500,000. Not bad at all, and considering its in the early hours. Baseball is certainly growing. Terms are being used in Cricket for adapated purposes, such as Pinch Hitting (although not the same by definition in the two sports) and patricular grips such as the forkball. I love Football (Soccer), Baseball and Cricket....but ironically Football is killing off pretty much every other sport around.

06-03-2003, 08:44 AM	#20
Tyke All Star Starter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Brighouse, West Yorkshire, U.K. Posts: 1,135	PFXCarty, I pretty much agree with all you say, though I would have said that the mismanagement of cricket you talk about goes back way beyond 10 years! The other comment I would make is in relation to what you say about Yorkshire and Lancashire. As my name imlplies, I am a Yorkshireman but I am ashamed of the attitude of the county organisation. We have a very large ethnically-mixed population, especially with Afro-Caribbean and Indian / Pakistani / Sri Lankan backgrounds, where cricket approaches the status of a religion. For all that, no Yorkshire born cricketer from any of those communities has ever been selected for the county team. Yes, the present "overseas professional" is Indian, but I remain saddened by this apparent racist approach. [I say "apparent" because some of those from our ethnic minorities have chosen to keep themselves apart from the county structure for cultural and sociological reasons that go way beyond sporting considerations - but that's whole other can of worms!]