Who is your Franchise Guy?

[Germaniac]

What I hate about Minoso - no matter how good he was in his prime and what a nice guy he was - is the fact that he came out of retirement in 1976 for a few AB's at age 50 and again in 1980 at 54, only to have played in five decades ...

Things like that make me mad, since these are things players do to get some individual "records", not to help the team.

When Nolan Ryan pitched after his 46th birthday, he was still an important part of the team, while Minoso's "un-retirements" only were PR-gimmicks - and as far as I'm concerned, that overshadows his achievements during his career.

[95Marinerschangedmylife]

Originally Posted by BMD

I get you but not like Junior. Largent was great but not star power. Teams were not scared of him. I think Gary Payton was probably better than Largent.

[bear]

Originally Posted by actionjackson

That makes Anson stand out from his contemporaries how exactly? I'm not going to sit here and defend racism because it's indefensible to me as a person living in the 21st century, but Anson retired 50 years before Jackie Robinson broke the colour barrier, and it was another 15-20 years before Martin Luther King Jr. picked up steam with the civil rights movement. It was a different time altogether, and unfortunately Anson's views were kind of the norm at the time. He was a real stubborn, obstinate mule on the issue, but the people who say he deserves most of the blame for the colour barrier not having been broken sooner are as full of hot air as Cap was IMHO.

I understand your point completely, realize its validity, and openly admit to holding a view that is facile. As a Sox fan, though, you can perhaps understand understand why I look at as ex-Cub as the embodiment of evil.

[bear]

Originally Posted by Chicagofan76

My dad hates Minnie, he wasnt on the 59 team, and although he came back in 60, it came at the expense of losing Cash & Romano...which turned out to be 1 of many bad Veeck deals. As for myself I never saw him play in a Sox uniform otherwise he might be in my top 25. Frank was the best player I have seen in a Sox uniform but he is only my 4th all time fav player.

Minnie is my all time fave, followed by Fisk. That's not gonna change for me.

The bad Veeck deals. Gene Freese for Johny Callison. Battey and Mincher for Roy Sievers. I've ranted and raved about those, once or twice on the forums.

[bear]

Originally Posted by Germaniac

What I hate about Minoso - no matter how good he was in his prime and what a nice guy he was - is the fact that he came out of retirement in 1976 for a few AB's at age 50 and again in 1980 at 54, only to have played in five decades ...

Things like that make me mad, since these are things players do to get some individual "records", not to help the team.

When Nolan Ryan pitched after his 46th birthday, he was still an important part of the team, while Minoso's "un-retirements" only were PR-gimmicks - and as far as I'm concerned, that overshadows his achievements during his career.

I normally sneer at contrived PR moments. The Minoso at returns, however, gimicky, are memories I cherish.

I'm still very much the little boy for whom the start of baseball season meant racing home from school to catch the end of a Sox game on TV and watch Minnie's last at bat in a game. For many seasons, as a little boy, this was spring baseball for me. As an adult, nearing retirement, that childhood memory still burns bright. I shamelessly admit to the Minoso comebacks being real moments of joy for me and a pleasure to have witnessed.

[funkadillo]

Originally Posted by Goody

If Jeter had put up stats like this and did so much for his team 70 years ago, without all the extra media to help people dislike him...without the dislike many baseball fans have simply because of the way the Yankees have been allowed to control the sport...with just the mystique of being an original star of baseball...

He'd be in the top 3 or 4.

Funny, I was thinking the opposite. I think he would rank lower if he played back then.

There's no way he should ever be ranked ahead of Ruth, Gehrig, Mantle, or DiMaggio. They were FAR superior players, and this would've been even more evident if he played along side them. It's more likely that he'd be thought of as a sidekick. (Kind of like how Gehrig's legend is a probably hurt a bit a bit due to playing along side Ruth.)

[1998 Yankees]

OFFICIAL RECAP:

So far, according to the readers of USA Today, we have these Franchise Guys:

• Cubs - Ernie Banks
• Orioles - Cal Ripken, Jr.
• Expos/Nats - Andre Dawson
• Mariners - Ken Griffey, Jr.

Who is the Franchise Guy for the Houston Astros?

Nolan Ryan: The only Hall of Famer on our list, Ryan spent nine seasons with the Astros (1980-1988) and holds the franchise record for strikeouts (1,866). Ryan was 106-94 with a 3.13 ERA, striking out 9.1 hitters per nine innings, and he averaged nearly 33 starts a season during the non-strike years he was an Astro. In 1981, he no-hit the eventual World Series champion Dodgers and had a 1.69 ERA, lowest in franchise history (minimum one inning pitched per team game played). Ryan pitched on three Astros playoff teams.

Jeff Bagwell: He's the franchise leader in home runs (449), RBI (1,529) and batting average (.297) over a minimum of 3,000 plate appearances. During Bagwell's 15-year Astros career (1991-2005), he also had a .408 on-base percentage and .540 slugging percentage. But then there's the whole suspicion by association with the steroids era that seems to trail the first baseman. Bagwell, who bulked up considerably over his career, has been outspoken in his steroid denials.

Craig Biggio: The second baseman is the franchise's career leader in games (2,850), 700 more than Bagwell's total. Biggio, who played 20 seasons (1988-2007) in Houston, is also the team's all-time leader in hits (3,060), runs (1,844), extra-base hits (1,014) and total bases (4,711). He is a .281 career hitter with 291 home runs and 1,175 RBI, a .363 on-base percentage and .433 slugging percentage. Like Bagwell, he played on six Astros playoff teams.

Lance Berkman: Over 12 seasons (1999-2010) with the Astros, he had the best on-base (.410) and slugging (.549) percentages in franchise history and hit .297 with 336 homers and 1,126 RBI. The first baseman/outfielder played on half as many Astros playoff teams Bagwell and Biggio, but resoundingly outperformed them in the postseason. In 29 games, Berkman hit .321 with six homers and 26 RBI. Bagwell hit .226 with two homers and 13 RBI in 33 games; Biggio batted .234 with two homers and 11 RBI in 40 games.

J.R. Richard: One can make a case that Richard was the most dominant pitcher in team history. Over 10 seasons with the Astros (1971-1980), 5 ½ in which he was a full-time starter, Richard was 107-101 with a 3.15 ERA and 1,493 strikeouts. For his Astros career, he averaged 8.4 strikeouts per nine innings and had 19 shutouts, six more than Ryan, who had 61 more starts as an Astro. Richard had a stroke midway through the 1980 season and never pitched in the major leagues again.

[jaxmagicman]

Jeff Baggwell

[Chicagofan76]

I am guessing most will say Bagwell, but since I dont think Bagwell should make the HOF (save it for another thread). I am going with Biggio.

[jaxmagicman]

Originally Posted by Chicagofan76

I am guessing most will say Bagwell, but since I dont think Bagwell should make the HOF (save it for another thread). I am going with Biggio.

I think there is a thread already for that. To the Jeff Bagwell HOF THREAD we go!

[95Marinerschangedmylife]

Since Ryan cant be everyones franchise player, for me it will be Biggio. Day in and day out he shows up and does well. He is a good face to any franchise.

[1998 Yankees]

Originally Posted by jaxmagicman

Jeff Baggwell

Originally Posted by Chicagofan76

I am guessing most will say Bagwell, but since I dont think Bagwell should make the HOF (save it for another thread). I am going with Biggio.

Originally Posted by 95Marinerschangedmylife

Since Ryan cant be everyones franchise player, for me it will be Biggio. Day in and day out he shows up and does well. He is a good face to any franchise.

Heh, sorry fellas. And since the Biggio guy that I invited here spurned my invitation, the heck with him.

NOLAN RYAN IS MR. ASTRO! [And by a landslide!]

[1998 Yankees]

OFFICIAL RECAP:

So far, according to the readers of USA Today, we have these Franchise Guys:

• Cubs - Ernie Banks
• Orioles - Cal Ripken, Jr.
• Expos/Nats - Andre Dawson
• Mariners - Ken Griffey, Jr.
• Astros - Nolan Ryan

So, who is the Chief Indian of all time?

[Chicagofan76]

For this 1 ya gotta go with Bob Feller, I dont see how it could be anyone else.

[TribeFanInNC]

I would vote for Rapid Robert as well. One could make a decent case for Boudreau, as he was a rare offensive star at SS for that generation + he was the manager. Feller kinda remained the face of the franchise after his career, whereas Boudreau did TV in Chicago and wasn't really a face of the franchise.

Guys like Speaker, Lajoie, Shoeless Joe, and Manny Ramirez were probably better players, but only played half their careers with the Tribe. I would give Larry Doby an honorable mention for this list as he is probably as synonomous with Indians baseball as anyone.

[Tribe Fan 24]

I agree with TribeFanInNC, Feller is the face of the franchise for me as well. I personally like Thome, but not as the face of the franchise all-time. (Maybe of the last 20 years or something.)

I also feel that Larry Doby should be included somehow. He is mentioned almost as much as Feller in Tribe conversations of this type. I think that his omission would be a crime.

Thanks to 1998Yankees for the PM, I didn't see this earlier!

[1998 Yankees]

Originally Posted by Chicagofan76

For this 1 ya gotta go with Bob Feller, I dont see how it could be anyone else.

Originally Posted by TribeFanInNC

I would vote for Rapid Robert as well.

Originally Posted by Tribe Fan 24

I agree with TribeFanInNC, Feller is the face of the franchise for me as well.

You guys called it!

Bob Feller is Chief Indian!

[1998 Yankees]

OFFICIAL RECAP:

So far, according to the readers of USA Today, we have these Franchise Guys:

• Cubs - Ernie Banks
• Orioles - Cal Ripken, Jr.
• Expos/Nats - Andre Dawson
• Mariners - Ken Griffey, Jr.
• Astros - Nolan Ryan
• Indians - Bob Feller

The last poll was no contest, and I think this one will be the same. Yet, we must go through the motions. Who is the Greatest Padre of all time?

[Chicagofan76]

Wheres Garry Templeton? Jody Gerut?

Ok With all do respect to the best hitter since Ted Williams and the 2nd best that I have seen behind Ichiro.
I am going with Trevor Hoffman. He's the All Time leader on GF and saves, and while Mo Rivera will surpass the saves record, he still has records. Gywnn doesnt hold any all time records.

20 yrs from now Hoffman should still be #2 in all time saves, while we will have 5 players flirt with .400

[PadresFan]

I saw Trevor and Tony at Jack Murphy/Qualcomm Stadium many times in the primes of their careers, and there isn't a doubt in my mind that Tony Gwynn is the greatest Padre of all time.