Just wanted to say "Thanks", but...

[Cornelius McGillicuddy]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

How can you write that? Ever since OOTP 2006 every new version has had more than enough new features to be well worth every penny paid for it.

Even factoring in the cost of a new version every year OOTP is a tremendous entertainment value.

I'm not arguing your second sentence. I've bought every year starting 2006 because every year there's been something extra I wanted. For 2012 it's the pbp save (as you mentioned). Without that feature real frankly I would skip ver 12 and look at 13 next year. But there are people who don't care about that or any of the other new features. They're happy with what they have, and some are still playing ver 10 or 9 or 8 or even 6.5. What I'm saying isn't new or revolutionary. Some people do it every year.

[Rebington]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

How can you write that? Ever since OOTP 2006 every new version has had more than enough new features to be well worth every penny paid for it.

Even factoring in the cost of a new version every year OOTP is a tremendous entertainment value.

This + 1.

I understand people wanting to be vocal about features they feel should be added to the game... but seriously the amount of time anyone in an online league or serious solo game players spend playing OOTP I can't see how anyone could accuse this game of not being value for money.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by fhomess

This is a completely subjective point of view.

What does that have to do with anything? Your answer was as well. None of us can write anything here except hard measured data that isn't.

The point remains. Anyone want to seriously contend that any version of OOTP since OOTP 2006 hasn't had more than enough new features to be well worth every penny they paid for it? If so, what version and why?

[Ktulu]

Originally Posted by Rebington

This + 1.

I understand people wanting to be vocal about features they feel should be added to the game... but seriously the amount of time anyone in an online league or serious solo game players spend playing OOTP I can't see how anyone could accuse this game of not being value for money.

Especially when certain people actually got the game for free last year.

[Queensryche]

This will actually be the first one I won't be buying. I've bought all of them but OOTP12 just doesn't offer up enough reasons to upgrade from OOTP11, which I feel is the best version of the game to date.

The discount for people who bought OOTP11 should be way higher for the content that comes with OOTP12. 10$ at the most is what we should have to pay for it. $40 is hilariously laughable.

Probably should have just not put out a game this year and took an extra year to make OOTP12 really spectacular, but as it is, it feels like a "map pack" for an old RTS game or something. Just a few little extras.

Oh, and it's always funny that one of the bullet points on the game is "improved AI"

It's a bullet point on every single version and it's in almost every single patch notes as well. Not slamming AI improvements, that's a great thing, just makes me chuckle a bit how many times you can list this as a bullet point/etc.

In the end, I'll be passing on OOTP12, I'll be just fine with my OOTP11 league on my laptop.

[fhomess]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

What does that have to do with anything? Your answer was as well. None of us can write anything here except hard measured data that isn't.

My answer was subjective only in that I tried to restate the OP's opinion about OOTP12, which was a subjective opinion. I didn't strongly state my own opinion on the value of OOTP, which I find to be quite good. My point really was the same as yours: everyone's opinion on this matter is subjective. It seems a good portion of the discussion in the thread centers around people feeling that a subjective opinion is wrong and should not be expressed when it disagrees with their own. Or that a dissenting subjective opinion should only be stated in private via PM.

Originally Posted by The Wolf

The point remains. Anyone want to seriously contend that any version of OOTP since OOTP 2006 hasn't had more than enough new features to be well worth every penny they paid for it? If so, what version and why?

I believe the OP is saying that's exactly how he currently perceives OOTP12 to be. He's got a version he's happy with, so the new features don't merit paying for a new version since he's not going to use them. Doesn't seem so hard to understand.

Don't get me wrong, I get tons of value out of OOTP and have owned every version since OOTP4, but I don't always feel the new features are worth the cost of upgrade. I will say that I got VERY little play time out of OOTP2006 and OOTP2007 (probably less than 20 hours combined), so those versions didn't connect with me while I continued to enjoy OOTP6.5. For you, those versions may have been very enjoyable, but it wasn't for me and I didn't get my money's worth out of it. It's not that different than giving a brand new Yankees hat to a Red Sox fan. There's nothing wrong with the hat, it just doesn't work for that individual.

[cephasjames]

Originally Posted by Ktulu

Especially when certain people actually got the game for free last year.

Paying for last year's or any year's games has nothing to do with anything that has been said in this thread.

[BusterKing]

BTW, I don't think Markus is done listing everything that will be new in 12.

[cephasjames]

Originally Posted by BusterKing

BTW, I don't think Markus is done listing everything that will be new in 12.

Totally true. That list doesn't usually get complete until, what, release day?

[BusterKing]

Originally Posted by cephasjames

Totally true. That list doesn't usually get complete until, what, release day?

And then he will include new features in patches also.

Now, not to many games offers that kind of support.

[mauboy]

I bought the game without knowing what features were in the game.. this is the first one I've done that since OOTP2006, I think. I wasn't going to get OOTP 12 this year but my league is moving to 12 and I'll probably try finding a new one to join and that will be easier to do with 12.

[cephasjames]

Originally Posted by BusterKing

And then he will include new features in patches also.

Now, not to many games offers that kind of support.

Which is yet another reason why OOTP is the best baseball sim out there.

[Ktulu]

Originally Posted by cephasjames

Paying for last year's or any year's games has nothing to do with anything that has been said in this thread.

Sure, but on the other hand maybe people who have received free copies in the past could refrain from starting public campaigns to essentially convince others to "protest" as well. Don't want to buy the game because your pet feature isn't in the game? That's fine, let Markus know about it, a big announcement so others can jump in isn't necessary or respectful in my book.

If everyone decided not to buy the game because their favorite feature isn't in the upcoming version... well there won't be many more upcoming versions.

[1998 Yankees]

Originally Posted by Queensryche

Oh, and it's always funny that one of the bullet points on the game is "improved AI"

It's a bullet point on every single version and it's in almost every single patch notes as well. Not slamming AI improvements, that's a great thing, just makes me chuckle a bit how many times you can list this as a bullet point/etc.

I've had the same reaction. Yet, we have to realize how complicated this game must be in terms of programming and how improvements in other aspects can set the AI performance bar even higher. Still, not a great talking point year after year, I agree.

[Afino]

Even if you feel the feature list has gotten unimpressive, do you realize how STABLE this game has gotten since even OOTP9? My first version of OOTP was 8. That thing crashed on me on an almost daily basis. Not to mention the bugs galore. It got better in 9, but not significantly better.

OOTPX was a landmark for game stability for me. And I can count the number of crashes of OOTP11 on one hand the entire time I've had the game. There are always going to be bugs, but most issues are very minor.

That alone right there is worth the cost to me.

[cephasjames]

Originally Posted by Ktulu

Sure, but on the other hand maybe people who have received free copies in the past could refrain from starting public campaigns to essentially convince others to "protest" as well. Don't want to buy the game because your pet feature isn't in the game? That's fine, let Markus know about it, a big announcement so others can jump in isn't necessary or respectful in my book.

If everyone decided not to buy the game because their favorite feature isn't in the upcoming version... well there won't be many more upcoming versions.

I am not campaigning anything. I am stating why I am not buying the game. I have not once asked others to not buy the game. I have not once asked others to state whether they will or will not buy the game. I have in fact spoken very highly of OOTP and Markus and Co. On the OOTP 11 forum I even strongly encouraged someone new to the game to buy both 11 and 12 because 11 is awesome and 12 will be better. But since 12 will not have what I'm looking I'm not going to buy it - and this is how I'm choosing to tell Markus. This is a forum where I have the fortunate privilege of being able to do just that.

p.s. I received free copies because I was on the beta team. It was Markus and Company's choice to hand out free copies to beta testers, not mine. And at one point I even suggested that they not do that anymore. But I'm not on beta this year so I don't know how that's being handled.

[Chicagofan76]

Originally Posted by Queensryche

This will actually be the first one I won't be buying. I've bought all of them but OOTP12 just doesn't offer up enough reasons to upgrade from OOTP11, which I feel is the best version of the game to date.

The discount for people who bought OOTP11 should be way higher for the content that comes with OOTP12. 10$ at the most is what we should have to pay for it. $40 is hilariously laughable.

Probably should have just not put out a game this year and took an extra year to make OOTP12 really spectacular, but as it is, it feels like a "map pack" for an old RTS game or something. Just a few little extras.

Oh, and it's always funny that one of the bullet points on the game is "improved AI"

It's a bullet point on every single version and it's in almost every single patch notes as well. Not slamming AI improvements, that's a great thing, just makes me chuckle a bit how many times you can list this as a bullet point/etc.

In the end, I'll be passing on OOTP12, I'll be just fine with my OOTP11 league on my laptop.

I will try to be nice so bare with me...How freaking cheap r u?

You think EA is gonna give anyone a discount for buying every version
of Madden? I had version 1 thru 2008? until they stopped making it for PC.
OOTP is about making money along with making a great game. $10 is more then far. I myself if/when I buy 12 will either pay full price or wait til the 4th of july sale which i doubt i will wait that long.

Can u find a PS3 or Xbox game for under $60 these days?

Games that try skipping a yr to come back witha better version 2 yrs form now get forgotten about ala HH2k6 never happened they went bankrupt trying to overhaul High Heat and ran out of money with no other income.

They have improved the AI each yr as they should I had version 5 & 6 and they r crap compared to 8 & 11

[Cooleyvol]

Originally Posted by Queensryche

The discount for people who bought OOTP11 should be way higher for the content that comes with OOTP12. 10$ at the most is what we should have to pay for it. $40 is hilariously laughable.

10 bucks? Are you being serious or just quoting the price that you'd pay for v12?

Originally Posted by Queensryche

Probably should have just not put out a game this year and took an extra year to make OOTP12 really spectacular, but as it is, it feels like a "map pack" for an old RTS game or something. Just a few little extras.

Now you're making no sense.

Originally Posted by Queensryche

Oh, and it's always funny that one of the bullet points on the game is "improved AI"

It's a bullet point on every single version and it's in almost every single patch notes as well. Not slamming AI improvements, that's a great thing, just makes me chuckle a bit how many times you can list this as a bullet point/etc.

Isn't it quite possible that the AI actually IS improved with each version/patch? Why not list that if its true?

[1998 Yankees]

Originally Posted by cephasjames

I am not campaigning anything. I am stating why I am not buying the game. I have not once asked others to not buy the game. I have not once asked others to state whether they will or will not buy the game. I have in fact spoken very highly of OOTP and Markus and Co. On the OOTP 11 forum I even strongly encouraged someone new to the game to buy both 11 and 12 because 11 is awesome and 12 will be better. But since 12 will not have what I'm looking I'm not going to buy it - and this is how I'm choosing to tell Markus. This is a forum where I have the fortunate privilege of being able to do just that.

p.s. I received free copies because I was on the beta team. It was Markus and Company's choice to hand out free copies to beta testers, not mine. And at one point I even suggested that they not do that anymore. But I'm not on beta this year so I don't know how that's being handled.

cj, you've got nothing to explain about. Over the years you have made significant contributions to this game, so if now you choose to use these forums for one of the purposes for which they exist, I say go for it. Or, you already went for it, and your point is made.

[BusterKing]

Originally Posted by cephasjames

I am not campaigning anything. I am stating why I am not buying the game. I have not once asked others to not buy the game. I have not once asked others to state whether they will or will not buy the game. I have in fact spoken very highly of OOTP and Markus and Co. On the OOTP 11 forum I even strongly encouraged someone new to the game to buy both 11 and 12 because 11 is awesome and 12 will be better. But since 12 will not have what I'm looking I'm not going to buy it - and this is how I'm choosing to tell Markus. This is a forum where I have the fortunate privilege of being able to do just that.

p.s. I received free copies because I was on the beta team. It was Markus and Company's choice to hand out free copies to beta testers, not mine. And at one point I even suggested that they not do that anymore. But I'm not on beta this year so I don't know how that's being handled.

If you love this game so much, did it ever occurred to you that by making this thread that you might actually HURT Markus sales for OOTP12?

I personally think that it was a selfish act to do so. All you had to do was to send him a pm. No need to make this kind of thread... really!