Feedback Wanted / OOTP Marketing

[blueturf]

Originally Posted by satchel

Yes I do, and I don't want to take up space here with a debate on this, but if someone is a Facebook or Twitter user who's never heard of OOTP, then how or why would they join the an OOTP group? Would you join a Facebook group, or listen to tweets, about a game you'd never heard of, or played?

For the me the Facebook option is only viable because there is no cost invovled. It can serve as virtual word of mouth. Many of my Facebook "friends" become a fan of something that I am unaware of so I click the link to check it out.

[Stu]

Originally Posted by endgame

Preseason is the time to roll out marketing and opening day is the time to have the game ready for those who may potentially come aboard.

Agreed. Considering the limited resources marketing should be very focused during times of the year where fans are thinking about what it would be like to run a team. Based on that I would use the following schedule:

- Announce the game w/ new feature list around the start of Free Agency/ winter meeting period
- Market heavily during spring training
- Release the game on/around opening day
- Market during the week of the MLB draft. Offer a discount during this time.
- Market during the week of the trade deadline. Offer a bigger discount during this time to rope any holdout customers and maybe get them in for next season
- rinse/repeat

[Stu]

Originally Posted by blueturf

For the me the Facebook option is only viable because there is no cost invovled. It can serve as virtual word of mouth. Many of my Facebook "friends" become a fan of something that I am unaware of so I click the link to check it out.

Exactly. Things can grow very quickly on facebook. Say 100 people here "become a fan" of Out of the Park Baseball. Each of those 100 people have 200-300 friends on facebook. That's suddenly 20,000 - 30,000 more people who might see it.

I don't think it should be the only thing done by any means, but it's free and won't due any harm so why not.

[blueturf]

Originally Posted by Stu

Agreed. Considering the limited resources marketing should be very focused during times of the year where fans are thinking about what it would be like to run a team. Based on that I would use the following schedule:

- Announce the game w/ new feature list around the start of Free Agency/ winter meeting period
- Market heavily during spring training
- Release the game on/around opening day
- Market during the week of the MLB draft. Offer a discount during this time.
- Market during the week of the trade deadline. Offer a bigger discount during this time to rope any holdout customers and maybe get them in for next season
- rinse/repeat

I would also add the playoffs/World Series to the timeline. A lot of fans renew their interest at that time of year.

[JWay]

Originally Posted by satchel

Facebook and Twitter aren't going to help you grab new people who've never heard of the game before. Those sites aren't vehicles for extensive learning about new things. Forming communities on those sites is great, but people who make up those communities are already fans, and they band together.

I'm sorry, you're missing the potential of these social marketing avenues.

[Stu]

Originally Posted by blueturf

I would also add the playoffs/World Series to the timeline. A lot of fans renew their interest at that time of year.

Definitely, especially if there team is in it. The HOF induction week would also be a good time to focus on Historicals.

[PSUColonel]

To me this isn't very complicated. (although funds may very well be an issue here) Why not create banners on a multitude of online fantasy leagues? (espn, fox, etc...) This is surely the kind of visibility that would benefit OOTP. Remember...you get what you pay for, and nothing in life is free.

[PSUColonel]

Originally Posted by kingcharlesxii

Three things I'd really look into (I do have somewhat of an advertising background):

1) As mentioned above, a better 2D/3D engine goes a long way to attract casual gamers.

2) Maybe a "lite" interface - the game is still rather daunting for newcomers.

3) Definitely offer free giveaways to sites - the more people you get playing the game, the more likely they're recommend to their friends and so on. Word of mouth is the best advertising.

4) This might not be feasible, but it's a huge advantage to have a box in the store. How many people came to OOTP through Season Ticket Baseball? I'm betting it was a lot.

5) Facebook/Twitter might be worth looking into. For a product like this, I'd say Facebook might be better because you can provide more info than Twitter.

6) Advertise, advertise, advertise. It seems like a lot of money, no doubt, but if you spend those dollars correctly it will return a lot more than you spend. If you're going after the fantasy baseball players, advertise on the sites those people go to.

7) And finally: if you're going after fantasy baseball players, those players will want to play a "real" league. It's very important the default rosters are ready to go at game release and the game is released by the start of the season. Those fantasy baseball players won't want to buy a game in June/July, unlike the fictional/historical gamers. Their interest in baseball runs from spring until football season starts.

You might want to even consider a lighter MLBish-only release, maybe disable a lot of the custom config features but offer at a lower price.

Hope this helps.

I don't like these. They fundamentally change the direction of OOTP.

[kingcharlesxii]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

I don't like these. They fundamentally change the direction of OOTP.

My point is that if they want to go after that market, they DO have to fundamentally change the direction of OOTP. You're never going to tap into it doing things as they are.

[PSUColonel]

I guess this begs the question: How is OOTP really doing? I can tell interest is really down from other years early on.

[PSUColonel]

Originally Posted by kingcharlesxii

My point is that if they want to go after that market, they DO have to fundamentally change the direction of OOTP. You're never going to tap into it doing things as they are.

Then why would you or I ever want to purchase it again?

[kingcharlesxii]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

Then why would you or I ever want to purchase it again?

Well, part of my proposal was basically a lite version and the normal version. We'd purchase the normal version, which would be the same as OOTP X plus whatever new features for that year.

Whether that is even remotely feasible, I have no idea but it is worth considering. Only Markus can answer that.

[bubba22plus]

Originally Posted by kingcharlesxii

Well, part of my proposal was basically a lite version and the normal version. We'd purchase the normal version, which would be the same as OOTP X plus whatever new features for that year.

Whether that is even remotely feasible, I have no idea but it is worth considering. Only Markus can answer that.

*gasp* Markus wouldn't do that, would he?

Anyways, how about like a lite mode in game, that's there just to get new users settled faster.

[PSUColonel]

Originally Posted by bubba22plus

*gasp* Markus wouldn't do that, would he?

Anyways, how about like a lite mode in game, that's there just to get new users settled faster.

how about reading the manual and having better tutorials provided?

[CubbyFan23]

I work in marketing and can echo a lot of the suggestions in this thread. Paid search/SEO, Twitter, Facebook, etc. should be huge avenues for you to look at. Facebook and Twitter will generate you fairly large amounts of business, I think. They do for my company and we do MUCH more boring and hard to sell stuff than video games.

If you guys would ever like any advice or help, please don't hesitate to get in touch with me, I believe Steve and Markus both have my e-mail.

[blueturf]

Blog Proposal - #1
Involving other blogs and some type of blog from OOTP developments might be the best way to get in front of the target group.

An endorsed OOTP league with high profile managers would probably grab some attention. Sporting News did it with SOM a few years ago and had a great lineup of managers and good dynasty type write-ups daily.

Seamheads has/had a league with very high profile names that uses OOTP as the game engine. However, it appears the 'managers' may have only been involved in selecting the initial teams and the outline of the content was not enough to keep my attention.

My proposal would be to send a free game to each of the prevelant bloggers for every MLB team and pit them against each other in an online league. The OOTPdevelopments blog could cover the high level league details and each blogging manager would probably make a comment occasionally throughout the season exposing the game to their readership. Some type of banner exchange could be arranged - even the league standings could reflect each site's logo/banner.

[Cool Papa Bell]

I brought this up years ago, but you cannot survive or grow your market share if all you do is release the new version each year. In my humble and unscientific opinion, but based on 40 years of playing simulation baseball games, mostly Strat-O-Matic...you need other products. At some point, a gamer is going to say, hey you know I don't really need version CXIV, I'm good with what I have. What are those other products are the key...official releases of season sets maybe...specialty sets, oh greatest franchise historical rosters, Negro League rosters, Deadball rosters, Civil War era players, who knows, the sky is the limit. Letting everyone modify what they have is all well and good, but how efficient is it that there are 25 different all-time roster sets running around, all based on the creators parameters.

Anyway, that is how Strat and many other companies have at least gotten a bite of a bigger slice of the pie so to speak. But the big one I think for SOM in particular is their affiliation with The Sporting News for on-line leagues and tournaments. Get OOTP as the official game engine and people pony up to win real cash money...that is how you will get the fantasy players...because those are really the gamblers who happen to be sports fans. On TSN, SOM has the ability to let leagues draft, trade, set lineups, etc just like their game, and it is somehow simmed on the site and results are posted like a real on-line league. The leagues are full season, but happen quickly...not sure but weeks I think...so you can have multiple leagues per season. Get a fantasy gamer hooked competing against 29 other guys in an OOTP on-line fantasy league on ESPN.com and he'll pony up money to do it, you can bet on that...metaphorically speaking... Again, just my 2 cents, but a little research on TSN site might go a long way. Pick up the phone...call ESPN or TSN or FOX, who knows. The only problem you may have is that darn MLB licensing...dang them...dang them all! :-)

[rem]

Originally Posted by blueturf

An endorsed OOTP league with high profile managers would probably grab some attention.

That's actually been tried.

[Cool Papa Bell]

Sorry, but I got off track...my whole rambling was to say that you first off have to keep your base...your core customers...coming back year after year after year...for something new and it can't just be the new release of the game. Sooner or later, they are going to say I'm good, I don't need the new version and you may have lost a long time customer...and you didn't really do anything wrong. I still think official OOTP created sets, whatever they happen to be, is a way to have additional products, but Markus set me straight years ago when I brought it up, that is not the route he thinks they should go.

In my opinion though, each year is a like a leaky bucket, losing satisfied gamers who don't feel the upgrade is worth the cost maybe at a quicker rate than gaining new ones. And true fantasy baseball players as many have pointed out here are not interested for the most part in day in and day out managing of a team in a simulation league. I agree with that, just thru knowing dozens if not hundreds of guys who dabble in fantasy leagues but could care less about simulation games. An social networking sites are fine, but all of that needs to be in conjunction with something bigger, they alone are not going to create a flood of new buyers...just my opinions.

[Cool Papa Bell]

Sorry still rambling, but just thought of something I did locally a few years back and it went over really well. I had a local bar set up a PC with the SOM game on it...guys played in leagues like bowling leagues and it was just for fun and something to do while the winter dragged on. Sounds silly I know, but get TGI Friday's to put a pc in every restaurant at the end of the bar and who knows. Wire it to the web and an on-line database and locations could compete against each other, who the heck knows. Hey, just thinking out loud is all but it did work at one local pub and guys loved it. But I do marketing for a living...wink wink, nod nod