More realistic injury file

[Matter2003]

Originally Posted by Curtis

Zero likelihood. Among other things, it eliminated CEIs (upon initial diagnosis). Markus will never go for that.

It didn't technically eliminate CEI's....it just made how they happen realistic with teh way they actually happen. When players are injured and suffer a setback, there is a small chance they will choose not to rehab and end their career instead, which is consistent with players attempting to come back from an injury and not being able to...

I have always thought the way CEI's are handled in game where players retire immediately was really nonsensical...

[GMahler]

I installed the injury file into the correct folder but I noticed that when I was receiving injury notifications there was a number in place of the injuries name...for example Alex Rodriquez suffered a 5 for 6 days...I reinstalled the original injury file and the original is working fine....I must have done something wrong...

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by GMahler

I installed the injury file into the correct folder but I noticed that when I was receiving injury notifications there was a number in place of the injuries name...for example Alex Rodriquez suffered a 5 for 6 days...I reinstalled the original injury file and the original is working fine....I must have done something wrong...

This happened for me as well just downloaded it tonight

[bababui]

Did you guys either delete or rename the original injury file?

[cameron]

Happened to me as well...and I did re-name the old injury file.It will only show on the notifications....when you view the injury log or under the knife.....everything reads fine.

[jbergey22]

Originally Posted by bababui

Did you guys either delete or rename the original injury file?

renamed it and went back to it

[DCG12]

I believe if you do the re-import then shut down OOTP and then restart the game it will solve this problem or at least it did with me.

[hmatthias]

Yes, always do a restart after re-importing the file, otherwise odd descriptions seem to happen.

[GMahler]

Originally Posted by hmatthias

Yes, always do a restart after re-importing the file, otherwise odd descriptions seem to happen.

Thanks for the tip...will try it tonight

[DUBBOH11]

I am still getting the weird messages some of the time saying things like the player has suffered a one or something after re importing and restarting...

[Cryomaniac]

Originally Posted by Matter2003

It didn't technically eliminate CEI's....it just made how they happen realistic with teh way they actually happen. When players are injured and suffer a setback, there is a small chance they will choose not to rehab and end their career instead, which is consistent with players attempting to come back from an injury and not being able to...

I have always thought the way CEI's are handled in game where players retire immediately was really nonsensical...

So those career ending setbacks can still happpen even if the CEI bool is set to 0?

[Matter2003]

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac

So those career ending setbacks can still happpen even if the CEI bool is set to 0?

Yup

[Matter2003]

Originally Posted by DUBBOH11

I am still getting the weird messages some of the time saying things like the player has suffered a one or something after re importing and restarting...

I will let Markus know about this...it seems to be an issue with reimporting the injury DB. The injury log and under the knife reports fine. This only occurs in the news stories...

[injury log]

Originally Posted by Matter2003

I will let Markus know about this...it seems to be an issue with reimporting the injury DB. The injury log and under the knife reports fine. This only occurs in the news stories...

The news uses a different field from injuries.txt than the injury log, so you wouldn't expect it to have the same issue (news uses the 'injury description', while the injury log, player histories, Player Profiles and Under the Knife all use the 'diagnosis' field).

[endgame]

Perhaps these comments should have been a thread of their own, but here, at this hour, I'm certain by morning it'll have led to enough trouble of its own without the isolation.

Originally Posted by Sweed

My experience with games I play are realistic injuries tend to turn people off as they just aren't aware of how many there are IRL (IIRC in Front Office Football the scale is 1-200 with 100 being default and 200 being realistic and a lot of players don't use 200). Then throw in random chance and your team is hit hard and the complaints come in.

FWIW injuries are mentioned in the patch fix list..

3165 - Batters should return faster than pitchers from serious arm injuries

2910 - Long Injuries Affect Too Many Batters, Not Enough Pitchers

I respect what Matter2003 is trying to do but I think I'll stick with injurylog's file. Being a beta and on the inside as the game was being developed IMHO gives him a better understanding of how things should work. Been waiting on the patch to see if this was addressed and will now get back into my game.

The great thing though about OOTP is that it is so modable so with a little effort we can all have it the way we want it.

Ah, Sweed. God bless you. You are ever the diplomat. I applaud you and your always-helpful and optimistic consensus-seeking outlook, as I would applaud my own restraint, if I possessed any quantity worthy of praise, but I do not.

Call this my little bitch for the day; it doesn't hurt, really. It's only another opinion and given it's mine assures some likelihood it will be, as time ensues, ignored or forgotten.

It annoys me - perhaps too strong a word, but it's a fresh one - continuing to see this thread title: "More realistic injury file." Frankly, it isn't. It is most certainly an "Alternative Injury File", and it may be one particular styles, or users of sensitive temperament, may prefer; not a model of real life and not in keeping with the philosophies and regiment built into the existing model for injury built into the game.

With some hesitancy - and admitted uncertainty - I have trouble comparing a new and improved public offering seemingly snatched from a nearly newborn release and purported to suddenly be developing and shaping itself into the form of walking, talking, community-embraced dogma to one that has been painstakingly researched, implemented with meticulous care to represent the physical realities of the baseball world; still evolving to encapsulate even the deeper intricacies still in the hands of the developer's judgment.

I still attempt to respect its modder & mod, but cannot help but feel in that odd contrast, a sense of disrespect to the predecessor; one that should not be usurped in a vacuum, or a void that fails to scrutinize its pretender. Data does not just fall together haphazardly with tweaks, updates, trials, and the search for a mythical 'balance'. This is design by sound, i.e. work at it until it creates an environment that makes the least amount of noise and call that a success. That does not define realistic. It not only defies realism, but defines service to a select community crying, "Make it stop! It's injuring my players!"

Torn between the inclination to terminate my diatribe and move on to how a quick and thoughtless embrace of a seemingly novel idea implicates others in ways unsolicited: Tech Support must now add to the already repetitious and incessant inquiries, "Which injury.txt are you using? Is it one you've modified or is it Matter's? Are you using the game-installed injury.txt?" I'll defer to my first and end this. Rage on, but rage rightly.

[WarFisch]

Originally Posted by endgame

"Make it stop! It's injuring my players!"

LMAO...I totally agree endgame.

I love the new injury system. Poeple should be free to tweak to their heart's content, that's what this game is all about. But, calling your thread "More Realistic..." is a bit insulting the the people who put a lot of hours into designing it.

[MB.Pelicans]

Originally Posted by Curtis

Zero likelihood. Among other things, it eliminated CEIs (upon initial diagnosis). Markus will never go for that.

And this is why Someone, in this case Matter had to do this work.... There is almost never a CEI in baseball the way they are handled in OOTP. I love this game and Markus has done a wonderful job, but CEI are a complete and utter disaster in the game. The only example of an OOTP style CEI in real baseball was Nick Adenhart, RIP.

[OldFatGuy]

Well, I'm going to come to the defense of Matter (even though my better judgement, and in fact actual opinion, argues against it).

I think, OOTP X, as released originally, DID have an unrealistice balance of long term injuries between pitchers and hitters (something Matter's file doesn't address, I'm quite aware), but I also think the original file, and OOTP in general, did "get wrong" CEI's in the sense that most (in fact I'd bet if a study were done it would be overwhelmingly the most) CEI's aren't CEI's right off the bat, they're the injury type that in most/some instances isn't career ending but in this particular player's instance becomes that way due to history/age/doesn't want to rehab again/etc. On this score, and this score alone, I think it could be argued Matter was onto something with the name of this thread. Also, I think it could be argued that some of the "naming conventions" used might be quite a bit "more realistic" in Matter's mod.

Sorry, didn't want to upset the cart in any real meaningful way, but I suppose I probably did anyways. Oh well, wouldn't be the first time.

And I just absolutely can't bring myself to leave without thanking InjuryLog for his efforts and contributions to the game. If you didn't get in the above that I mostly agree with where the game turned in the latest edition, I hope by my stating it outright leaves no doubt. Thank you, as well as a huge thank you to ALL who've contributed in the beta and research areas. Huge kudos.

[CalvinHobbes]

Originally Posted by OldFatGuy

but I also think the original file, and OOTP in general, did "get wrong" CEI's in the sense that most (in fact I'd bet if a study were done it would be overwhelmingly the most) CEI's aren't CEI's right off the bat, they're the injury type that in most/some instances isn't career ending but in this particular player's instance becomes that way due to history/age/doesn't want to rehab again/etc.

This is the sole reason I want to use this file. I want more day to day, 15 day dl trips and less 3-4 month injuries and CEI's. Is that realistic? I don't know, but it seems right. And it's my universe, so what I want goes, which is the most beautiful aspect of this fine game.

[injury log]

Originally Posted by CalvinHobbes

This is the sole reason I want to use this file. I want more day to day, 15 day dl trips and less 3-4 month injuries and CEI's. Is that realistic? I don't know, but it seems right. And it's my universe, so what I want goes, which is the most beautiful aspect of this fine game.

Thing is, you can't control most of those things by modifying the injury file - at least not if you have a file of any size. The game chooses a duration for an injury first, and if it finds a suitable diagnosis in the injury database, it uses that diagnosis. Unless this new file simply removes all SEIs that can possibly happen on certain play types ('while running', 'while fielding', etc), which wouldn't be realistic, it shouldn't affect the frequency of short term injuries, unless Markus edited the injury code without telling anyone. One thing that can be controlled is 'instant CEIs'; if you switch all the CEI booleans in the file to '0', they can be eliminated. That's easy enough to do with any injury file, however.

And, as I've mentioned elsewhere, there are far more instant CEIs in real baseball than some people think, judging by some of the posts in this thread.