Stanley Cup Final

[Bluenoser]

Pittsburgh vs Detroit

Two very good teams meet in a repeat of last years final. The Penguins are a year older and that much wiser/experienced. Detroit is just as, if not more experienced.

The biggest question mark lies with injuries, imo. How bad are Lidstrom & Datsyuk? The Red Wings won two games without them against the Blackhawks, but the Hawks are young and inexperienced at this level. I think with the Penguins it will different, and will make a difference in the outcome.

How bad is Gonchar's knee? He played despite the injury, and it did affect him but he was still effective.

Pittsburgh, like Detroit, are playing great hockey right now, and fortunately with Detroits win last night, will only have to wait a couple of days to start the final. Less downtime means less chance of losing momentum imo.


My pick - Like last year it will go 6 games, but this time the Penguins come out on top.

[vuroth]

Haven't been following much this year (no cable!), but Detroit should have been favourites all year long. No reason to change now.

[johnnybourbon]

Originally Posted by BruceM

My pick - Like last year it will go 6 games, but this time the Penguins come out on top.

Sounds about right to me. Osgood, though solid left a LOT of rebounds that the young hawks just weren't in the right place at the right time to capitalize on...two in game 5 alone that had open nets just waiting for them. There's no doubt that the young pens have enough experience to be in the right place at the right time against a banged up and tired wings team with a shaky goaltender who's been plagued by *dehydration*WAT?*.

It could be wishful thinking on my part that someone takes down my most hated sports team in history...and this is including the Minnesota North Stars before they moved to Dallas.

[phenom]

Why do you hate them?

[AndrewG]

Im an old goalie myself, each season I attend at least 6-12 Habs games.. as much as I love Baseball (OOTP Fourm!!!) Hockey is my passion as a sport...

Id like to see the Pens win.. Im simply irritated a guy like Osgood has managed to rack up such good career numbers and its only because of the team in front of him... he is a back up and third stringer on I feel half the teams in the league. (Conservatively)

Yes, hes been in the past a ligit NHL player, hes not useless, but I feel if he was playing in say the 21 team NHL in 1981, he would be in the minors...

When a guy like Glen Hall (who many will argue is one of the top golaies ever, including myself who thinks hes #1 or 2 ever) played on poor teams for years and only won 1 cup while Osgood has multiple.. it steams me.

At least when Vernon was in goal with his Red Wing cup win, he won games on his own on that drive... but Osgood?? Probably the worst multiple stanley cup winning starting goalies in NHL history sicne the 1940's and if I dug into soem old books I might be inclined to say ever....

[phenom]

Then big boxes of kudos to Ken Holland for assembling a team in front of him that can hide Osgood's downfalls, perceived or real.

[johnnybourbon]

Originally Posted by phenom

Why do you hate them?

preface this comment with...by hate, I obviously mean in a "I hope your team loses" usually reserved by cub fans regarding the cardinals or white sox kind if way...and not in a "I'm gonna kick ur a$$ cuz ur a red wings fan" kind of way

Here's an abridged list (and yes i am aware that many of these are from years past)
federov's diving to get calls
probert beating the crap out of us
probert coming to chicago
chelios going to detroit
keith primeau, darren mccarty- no comment necessary
brendan shanahhan's shot was blistering. i flinched and missed awesome saves by the blackhawks because of it
yzerman--american hockey coverage's golden boy.
the hit on havlat...and the national announcers on versus claiming it was clean, and licking the detroit's defensmen's bootyholes even though they commit dozens of interference calls (and other penalties that they like to call "good defense") each game that don't get called, especially on their home ice (and Lindstrom-Konstantinov's clone) is the same way)
their playoff beards are annoying. black hair'd beards rock and they dont have enough of em...that peach fuzz blonde pubic hair on their faces makes me wanna elope with an antelope.
dan cleary is a hack
that octopus crap
...and what the other post said about osgood

[phenom]

Long story: You're a fan of a bunch of losers.

Got it.

[Kekkonen]

My prediction: the Pens will win, and do it in a convincing manner. If the Wings get no mileage from Datsyuk and Lidström, it'll be the most boring Cup finals since the Wings - Caps series from ca. 10 years ago.

[phenom]

Lidstrom is slated to return for Game 1. No word on Datsyuk yet.

[johnnybourbon]

Originally Posted by phenom

Long story: You're a fan of a bunch of losers.

Got it.

yep. die hard blackhawks & white sox fan. it's my achilles (sp?) heel.

[Long_Long_Name]

Originally Posted by Kekkonen

My prediction: the Pens will win, and do it in a convincing manner. If the Wings get no mileage from Datsyuk and Lidström, it'll be the most boring Cup finals since the Wings - Caps series from ca. 10 years ago.

So, Hossa, Zetterberg, Rafalski, Franzen, they're not going to have a good series? Sure, missing the best defenseman I've seen in my lifetime as well as one of the top 5 forwards in the league doesn't help the Wings, but it's not like they're lost without them. Take away the Penguins' top 2 players, and they don't stand a chance, but the Red Wings aren't like that.

I think that Lidstrom on one leg and Datsyuk not being there might make the series more even. I just dont see the Penguins as nearly as good a team as the Red Wings are.

[PotatoPeeler]

Originally Posted by Long_Long_Name

So, Hossa, Zetterberg, Rafalski, Franzen, they're not going to have a good series? Sure, missing the best defenseman I've seen in my lifetime as well as one of the top 5 forwards in the league doesn't help the Wings, but it's not like they're lost without them. Take away the Penguins' top 2 players, and they don't stand a chance, but the Red Wings aren't like that.

I think that Lidstrom on one leg and Datsyuk not being there might make the series more even. I just dont see the Penguins as nearly as good a team as the Red Wings are.

I completely agree.

[vuroth]

Originally Posted by Long_Long_Name

Sure, missing the best defenseman I've seen in my lifetime....

Granted, I haven't seen a ton of Lidstrom down through the years, but I'm not convinced he's better than Bourque was.

Otoh, he has a vastly better supporting cast.

[Long_Long_Name]

Originally Posted by vuroth

Granted, I haven't seen a ton of Lidstrom down through the years, but I'm not convinced he's better than Bourque was.

Otoh, he has a vastly better supporting cast.

Raymond Bourque has impressed me a lot. He'd be second to Lidstrom. The other one who has is Andrei Markov, but I guess it's because I've just seen him play so often that there are more good points I remember.

That said, it does indeed help that Lidstrom's plays don't aborted by incapable forwards.

[Kekkonen]

Originally Posted by Long_Long_Name

So, Hossa, Zetterberg, Rafalski, Franzen, they're not going to have a good series? Sure, missing the best defenseman I've seen in my lifetime as well as one of the top 5 forwards in the league doesn't help the Wings, but it's not like they're lost without them. Take away the Penguins' top 2 players, and they don't stand a chance, but the Red Wings aren't like that.

No, but hockey isn't like that either. Crosby and Malkin are healthy, and if the hockey those two are playing right now isn't the best I've seen in the 2000s, I'd like to know what is.

[Long_Long_Name]

Originally Posted by Kekkonen

No, but hockey isn't like that either. Crosby and Malkin are healthy, and if the hockey those two are playing right now isn't the best I've seen in the 2000s, I'd like to know what is.

What do you mean, hockey isn't like that?

I agree with you that Malkin and Crosby are fantastic. Along with Ovechkin, Datsyuk and Lidstrom, I think they're in the top 5 skaters in the league. But, sadly for the Penguins, they don't have the stamina to play 60 minutes every game, and Maxime Talbot is only a superstar in his television advertisements.

[phenom]

Not only that but Detroit's 3rd and 4th lines have been fantastic in this playoffs. The 1st line didn't do much in the Chicago series but didn't have to.

[AndrewG]

Originally Posted by phenom

Then big boxes of kudos to Ken Holland for assembling a team in front of him that can hide Osgood's downfalls, perceived or real.

No question there.. Holland is wizard.

[AndrewG]

Okay... although I am a huge Habs fan, and I own a Hawks red jersey with my name on it (Only because its the nicest jersey int he league IMHO) Id like to address some points..

I udnerstand and resepct these are someones opinions, and am just giving my own!

Originally Posted by johnnybourbon

federov's diving to get calls

Theres quite a few players in the league like this, always have been. I remember the first game I attended in 1982 in the old Stampede Corral in Calgary and saw Kent Nillson dive when Bob Bourne did squat to him.. its one of these things. Federov in his prime unsed to get knocked around alot, and yes, he was a bit of a diver.. but there are worse.

Originally Posted by johnnybourbon

probert beating the crap out of us
probert coming to chicago
chelios going to detroit

I feel for Hawks fans.. I cant stand the Leafs, and when a player crosses to the dark side form Motnreal... well I can relate!!

Originally Posted by johnnybourbon

keith primeau, darren mccarty- no comment necessary

Good role players, and good funtioning parts of the team. Players you liek to have on your team, but dotn like to play against.

Originally Posted by johnnybourbon

yzerman--american hockey coverage's golden boy.

Steve Yzerman... okay this will start trouble.. POSSIBLY one of the most overrated players in NHL history. I wouldnt put this guy in the top 100 players in NHL history.. (OKAY if I actually did make this list... he MIGHT sneak in 85-100.. but probably not.)

Racked up alot of his points when the Norris division was filled with crappy goaltenders.

A good captain? Okay, but when soem peopel I have heard say he might be the best captain ever in the NHL.. hes not even close.

An All Star, yes, Hall of Famer.. yes (But then again Bill Barber is a hall of famer) But one of the best ever... NO WAY.

Originally Posted by johnnybourbon

the hit on havlat...and the national announcers on versus claiming it was clean,

Sicne he was a Senator, I have always liked Havlat.. but putting that aside, it was a clean hit. He had the puck and was skating with his head down. If you watch hockey, or have played hockey, if your head is down and you have the puck.... your open game...

Originally Posted by johnnybourbon

and licking the detroit's defensmen's bootyholes even though they commit dozens of interference calls (and other penalties that they like to call "good defense") each game that don't get called, especially on their home ice (and Lindstrom-Konstantinov's clone) is the same way)

The veteran Dretroit team intimnidated the young Hawks.. a strategy if I were coaching Id use too. theres a fine line between interference and clever defensive play, and yes, you might get awayt with intereference if the ref isnt in the mood to call it, but then the other team should do the same.. the Hawks dont have these type defensemen though


I was pulling for the Hawks to beat Detroit, but experience beat the kids. The kids needed to lose to becoem bette rfurther down the road.

Two things about the Hawks:

They need to unload Campbell who was brutal in this series and was a major dissapointment this year, consider the issues with salary cap with thier 2 goalies and that down the line both Kane & Toews will end entry level deals the same time.. they need to shed soem bucks...

I believe Kane is too small a player to be effective. Hell have highlight reel moments in the regular season but when push comes to shove and the hitting gets harder in playoffs on every play.. his what... 160-170 lb frame just cant do it.