Illogical Expectations

[jasonditz]

Has this every happened to anyone:

I had a really elite contact hitter with good speed and very little power (typical season: .350 10 75 60) and he keeps getting angry about his position in the batting order. Almost his whole career I had him as a #2 hitter, with three major sluggers behind him (he scored 200 runs one season this way) and he keeps getting it in his head that he's a "middle of the order" hitter.

[StyxNCa]

Originally Posted by jasonditz

Has this every happened to anyone:

I had a really elite contact hitter with good speed and very little power (typical season: .350 10 75 60) and he keeps getting angry about his position in the batting order. Almost his whole career I had him as a #2 hitter, with three major sluggers behind him (he scored 200 runs one season this way) and he keeps getting it in his head that he's a "middle of the order" hitter.

Yes. I finally turned off morale because of stuff like that.

My leadoff hitter, in just 4 full season out of 8 seasons I have played, is already 3rd all time in runs scored, 4th in stolen bases, 4 in walks and 1st in OB% yet he kept wanting to bat in the middle of the lineup. Here's a guy who is a definite HOF candidate (if he stays healthy) as a leadoff hitter, and he wants to bat middle of lineup where all the players who keep knocking him in are batting. I have tried him in the 3, 4 and 5 slot, and he sucks.

I had a few other batters who stunk who wanted middle of the lineup also. One was a .220 hitter with good gap power but no HR power and he was just awful in the clutch.

So I just got fed up with the morale thing and turned it off.

[kckid4u]

Well, I know this isn't real life, but it's supposed to "sim" real life, and in real life, managers have to deal with big ego jerks all the time. So.........I keep morale on to simulate that part of the game.

[StyxNCa]

Originally Posted by kckid4u

Well, I know this isn't real life, but it's supposed to "sim" real life, and in real life, managers have to deal with big ego jerks all the time. So.........I keep morale on to simulate that part of the game.

Well I got fed up with having to trade people when they got the pouty face and stopped performing. I can't have 8 guys batting middle of the lineup.

[RonCo]

Ultimately, these things come down to what you want to play--if you want a role-playing/arcade game with the flavor of baseball, you leave these kinds of things on. If you want a raw baseball game, you turn them off.

[markprior22]

Originally Posted by StyxNCa

Yes. I finally turned off morale because of stuff like that.

My leadoff hitter, in just 4 full season out of 8 seasons I have played, is already 3rd all time in runs scored, 4th in stolen bases, 4 in walks and 1st in OB% yet he kept wanting to bat in the middle of the lineup. Here's a guy who is a definite HOF candidate (if he stays healthy) as a leadoff hitter, and he wants to bat middle of lineup where all the players who keep knocking him in are batting. I have tried him in the 3, 4 and 5 slot, and he sucks.

I had a few other batters who stunk who wanted middle of the lineup also. One was a .220 hitter with good gap power but no HR power and he was just awful in the clutch.

So I just got fed up with the morale thing and turned it off.

See Alfonso Soriano for a real life example of a guy playing in a less than ideal spot because he can't seem to perform anywhere else.

In situations like your leadoff hitter above, I have just ignored the request and usually a player like that will come around. Sometimes they don't and you will have to address it but I think the feature adds a nice challenge.

[StyxNCa]

Originally Posted by markprior22

See Alfonso Soriano for a real life example of a guy playing in a less than ideal spot because he can't seem to perform anywhere else.

In situations like your leadoff hitter above, I have just ignored the request and usually a player like that will come around. Sometimes they don't and you will have to address it but I think the feature adds a nice challenge.

To each his own I reckon, but I wasn't exaggerating when I said I had/have 8 guys who want to be middle of the lineup. All the mood thing is, in my opinion, is a way to keep all teams equal since you can't have a lineup stacked with stars when the mood is turned on.

I know I paid enough for these players before the mood setting was added to the game.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by RonCo

Ultimately, these things come down to what you want to play--if you want a role-playing/arcade game with the flavor of baseball, you leave these kinds of things on. If you want a raw baseball game, you turn them off.

A little harsh methinks. I play with morale on and see no evidence that the actual baseball part is affected at all. I used to think otherwise.

Originally Posted by StyxNCa

To each his own I reckon, but I wasn't exaggerating when I said I had/have 8 guys who want to be middle of the lineup. All the mood thing is, in my opinion, is a way to keep all teams equal since you can't have a lineup stacked with stars when the mood is turned on.

I know I paid enough for these players before the mood setting was added to the game.

I win a lot, but not every year, and quite often with several pisd off players. One year my bullpen all wanted to be closers.

[StyxNCa]

Originally Posted by RchW

A little harsh methinks. I play with morale on and see no evidence that the actual baseball part is affected at all. I used to think otherwise.

Unless it's been changed, a pissed off player tends to stop playing as well. This is why I turned it off. It was totally destroying my team with 5 pissed off players. I admit this was back in the first version that moods was introduced. I have not tried it in OOTP9. However, if what you say is true then it must have been tweaked so I may try it again.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by StyxNCa

Unless it's been changed, a pissed off player tends to stop playing as well. This is why I turned it off. It was totally destroying my team with 5 pissed off players. I admit this was back in the first version that moods was introduced. I have not tried it in OOTP9. However, if what you say is true then it must have been tweaked so I may try it again.

Yes I believe it was tweaked. there is a thread(s) somewhere. I have also noted, unscientifically that some players seem to perform well when unhappy but they will not re-sign with you. I can't say whether one of the attributes like leadership/greed applies here or not, but it seems likely.

One reason why I like this element of the game is it presents a realistic model for planning ahead and for player acquisition. I had a superb CF on a 5 year contract that developed some good power in his mid 20's. He was a tremendous lead off hitter and could steal 50+ bases per year. However he wanted to bat in the middle of the line up. I knew he would not re-sign so I drafted with that in mind and also traded him for a good young pitcher in his last year. He batted third, was a solid 30-40 HR 100-120 RBI guy and signed a couple of big contracts over the next 8 seasons.

[StyxNCa]

Well I'll check it out but if it destroys my team the guilt will ride with you to your grave.

[Long_Long_Name]

I have 6 or 7 hitters wanting to be in the middle of the order too. Why can't leadoff-type hitters want to lead off? I have this 9/6/9 guy, perfect leadoff hitter (especially with the bunch of guys I have), and he still complains about the way I use him. Now, I wouldn't mind that if it was merely possible for good hitters not to be pissed about not being in the middle of the lineup - some shouldn't care, and some should see that when you play on a stacked team, hitting 1st or 2nd isn't really bad at all. But, what irritates me is that when you suck, you want to be a bench player, when you're ordinary you want to be a starter, and when you're good you automatically want to be in the middle of the lineup. There is little room to play with here - why can't stars realize that their skills make them ideal leadoff hitters? Or, would it be possible that some of them just don't care and just want to play?

As for closers, well, the bullpen use in OOTP is something I have little respect for, so I don't mind putting ordinary guys as my 2nd, and maybe 1st, closer. I don't really want to use a closer anyway, so...

[StyxNCa]

Originally Posted by Long_Long_Name

I have 6 or 7 hitters wanting to be in the middle of the order too. Why can't leadoff-type hitters want to lead off? I have this 9/6/9 guy, perfect leadoff hitter (especially with the bunch of guys I have), and he still complains about the way I use him. Now, I wouldn't mind that if it was merely possible for good hitters not to be pissed about not being in the middle of the lineup - some shouldn't care, and some should see that when you play on a stacked team, hitting 1st or 2nd isn't really bad at all. But, what irritates me is that when you suck, you want to be a bench player, when you're ordinary you want to be a starter, and when you're good you automatically want to be in the middle of the lineup. There is little room to play with here - why can't stars realize that their skills make them ideal leadoff hitters? Or, would it be possible that some of them just don't care and just want to play?

As for closers, well, the bullpen use in OOTP is something I have little respect for, so I don't mind putting ordinary guys as my 2nd, and maybe 1st, closer. I don't really want to use a closer anyway, so...

The one I like is a rookie wanting to be middle of the lineup even though he has no experience on the major league roster. Exactly which one of the stars does he think he is going to replace? There are way too many "middle of the lineup" demands.

But I will test this version and see how it is.

[RonCo]

Originally Posted by RchW

A little harsh methinks. I play with morale on and see no evidence that the actual baseball part is affected at all. I used to think otherwise.

Perhaps Markus decoupled it. Dunno. Regardless, since no one knows what affect this has on any aspect of the game, it falls into the realm of role-playing. That's all good and well. Just not something I care much about.

[RchW]

Originally Posted by StyxNCa

Well I'll check it out but if it destroys my team the guilt will ride with you to your grave.

That's a cross I'm willing to bear as guilt occupies little of my time.

[Left-handed Badger]

Originally Posted by RchW

That's a cross I'm willing to bear as guilt occupies little of my time.

I guess we'll have to hit you where it hurts. You'll have to play with Dusty Baker as your OOTP9 manager.

(or is this too cruel)

[RchW]

Originally Posted by Left-handed Badger

I guess we'll have to hit you where it hurts. You'll have to play with Dusty Baker as your OOTP9 manager.

(or is this too cruel)

Definitely, I'm on my knees... no_Dusty_please.

[StyxNCa]

I turned the moods on and some of the players that formerly wanted middle of the lineup now say they will be happy just to be in the starting lineup, including my lead off guy.