Does this game reward good pitching?

DMan · 07-29-2007, 10:12 PM

It's said that good pitching will almost always beat good hitting.

I've not found that to be the case so far with OOTB7 however. It seems to me that if I stock my team with great pitchers, I still get beat up and slugged on quite often. Is anyone else finding this to be the case, or have you found that your good pitching almost always beats good hitting?

I mean I stocked a team with great pitching to test the results and struggled to hit .500 by the end of the season.

tcblcommish · 07-29-2007, 11:04 PM

How is the defence? That is the true key in these game, I am pretty sure.

I always try to get good solid defensive players and win a lot. Decent pitchers have really good records and good pitchers are great with solid "D"

CHCfan · 07-29-2007, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMan

It's said that good pitching will almost always beat good hitting.

I've not found that to be the case so far with OOTB7 however. It seems to me that if I stock my team with great pitchers, I still get beat up and slugged on quite often. Is anyone else finding this to be the case, or have you found that your good pitching almost always beats good hitting?

I mean I stocked a team with great pitching to test the results and struggled to hit .500 by the end of the season.

well, the saying is "Good Pitching always beats good hitting. And vice-versa." So there's your problem

DMan · 07-29-2007, 11:24 PM

Oh, okay! I knew there must be something!

(Steinbrenner mode on) That's it! I'm firing everybody!

I'll have to look into the defensive ratings.

injury log · 07-30-2007, 07:12 AM

Pitching does seem more volatile than hitting in OOTP as well (much like real life). While I often get consistent (near-identical, sometimes) performances from my lineup, my pitchers' stats tend to be all over the place, for better or for worse. Three further comments:

-I would never judge a pitcher based on a month or so of performance; I've often had guys go on to win the Cy Young who looked like they should change careers after April;

-Check your park factors. It may be that you play in a park where offense is inflated, and your pitchers may look worse than they really are;

-I agree with tcbl about defense. You can do a quick check to see how your pitchers have been affected by defense (and/or by bad luck) by checking, in your Manager --> Options screen, your rank in BABIP against. If you're ranked poorly in that, you probably don't have much range on defense, and your pitcher ERAs will look worse than they should. Infield and Outfield Range seem to be the most important factors in influencing a staff's ERA, besides the ratings of the pitchers themselves.

beorn · 07-30-2007, 09:19 AM

I would say it is eerily realistic. Week after week, the bats grab all the attention. Then, just when it really matters, great pitching shuts down great hitting.

Dog Days Baseball just witnessed one of the all time hitting teams shut down in six games by a great pitching staff. I've seen it happen over and over.

If you think about it, this is not totally unexpected. During the more routine games, those star hitters go up against a lot of #4 and #5 pitchers, and some pretty weak pitching staffs, and the stats are looking great. Then comes the World Series against a staff boasting three starters with WHIPS around 1.00, and the runs just dry up.

Mattymo · 07-30-2007, 10:45 AM

All I know is right now, on August 1, I'm 10th in the NL in hitting (out of 16 teams) but 1st in pitching, and I have the best record in the National League. For me, good pitching is definitely beating good hitting.

Assos · 07-30-2007, 02:45 PM

I have my 1977 Royals, with an added J.R. Richards, in first place by 13 games at July 1st and I will tell you, it is pitching and more pitching. I have one guy that is in double figures in dingers, but we have alot of average hitters with tons of RBIs.

Charlie Hough · 07-30-2007, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMan

I'll have to look into the defensive ratings.

No offense, but this is the kind of shortsightedness that leads to many of the postings here. I don't understand how anyone thinks that simply having fast players means you're going to steal bases or having good pitchers means you're going to win games. If you can't get a good lead off first base, if you're playing against good catchers and pitchers that can hold runners, then you're not going to steal at will. Just the same, if you don't have fielders with good range, good arms, and good error ratings, then you will never have great sucess, even with outstanding pitchers.

If you put a great defense behind a mediocre pitching staff, then you can compete for a title almost every time. It's just that simple. If you can add some good pitching to that great defense, then your team is probably going to win some championships.

DMan · 07-30-2007, 09:07 PM

I'm not a wiz at this stuff. I'm learning the game. The only ratings I have to time to base decisions on are the stars that the scouts give the players. I work 12 hours a day and don't have time to sit at the pc and analyze all this other stuff. So, I go for players at any position who receive the most stars for their overall ratings.

Most of my main players have at least 3 star ratings. That's all I can go on at this point.

Charlie Hough · 07-30-2007, 11:31 PM

You might want to rely on the recommendations of your scouts then. If you don't have much time to review player ratings, then that might be your best bet. Stars only give you a vague idea of the player's overall value. For example, he might get a number of stars because he is a great hitter who can hit for average and power. But he could also be a defensive liability and a sloth on the basepaths.

MiddiePlayer · 07-31-2007, 11:14 AM

One thing I have noticed is it seems easy to stock your team up with middle relievers to improve your staff. The computer AI seems to undervalue them a bit. Find some good long relievers... put them in as sometime starters and you will notice a big improvement.

DMan · 07-31-2007, 02:46 PM

I have been relying on my scouts, thanks. I figured that was where the stars ratings came from.

I'll also experiment with middle relievers. Thanks for the tips.

james17 · 07-31-2007, 03:01 PM

I've noticed that pitching, especially starting pitchers, has more variablity in OOTP7 than OOTP6. Every pitcher seems to go through hot and cold cycles. The better the pitcher, the less often he goes cold and vice versa. It's more realistic this way though it makes it harder to win with just superior pitching than it used to be.

Charlie Hough · 07-31-2007, 05:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMan

I have been relying on my scouts, thanks. I figured that was where the stars ratings came from.

What I meant was that you can ask a scout to recommend a player for you to take in the draft. By using that feature, you can put the decision in the hands of the scouts, though you can always decide whether or not to select the player that was recommended.

If you just click on the player's profile, you'll see his fielding and arm ratings. Your best bet is never to have anyone on your team with lower than a 5 rating at his primary position, and no one with less than a 5 infield or outfield arm. If you're not using a 1-10 scale for ratings, then just do some simple multiplication to figure out how this standard computes for your scale.

07-29-2007, 10:12 PM	#1
DMan Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 18	Does this game reward good pitching? It's said that good pitching will almost always beat good hitting. I've not found that to be the case so far with OOTB7 however. It seems to me that if I stock my team with great pitchers, I still get beat up and slugged on quite often. Is anyone else finding this to be the case, or have you found that your good pitching almost always beats good hitting? I mean I stocked a team with great pitching to test the results and struggled to hit .500 by the end of the season.

07-30-2007, 09:19 AM	#6
beorn All Star Starter Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: near Rochester, NY Posts: 1,269	I would say it is eerily realistic. Week after week, the bats grab all the attention. Then, just when it really matters, great pitching shuts down great hitting. Dog Days Baseball just witnessed one of the all time hitting teams shut down in six games by a great pitching staff. I've seen it happen over and over. If you think about it, this is not totally unexpected. During the more routine games, those star hitters go up against a lot of #4 and #5 pitchers, and some pretty weak pitching staffs, and the stats are looking great. Then comes the World Series against a staff boasting three starters with WHIPS around 1.00, and the runs just dry up. __________________ Commish of Dog Days Baseball Commish Pennant Chase Baseball League (PCBL) Commish and Blue Jays GM Extra Innings Baseball

07-30-2007, 09:07 PM	#10
DMan Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 18	I'm not a wiz at this stuff. I'm learning the game. The only ratings I have to time to base decisions on are the stars that the scouts give the players. I work 12 hours a day and don't have time to sit at the pc and analyze all this other stuff. So, I go for players at any position who receive the most stars for their overall ratings. Most of my main players have at least 3 star ratings. That's all I can go on at this point. __________________ Oliver Platt, the most realistic portrayal of George Steinbrenner ever, aside from Seinfeld....

07-31-2007, 02:46 PM	#13
DMan Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 18	I have been relying on my scouts, thanks. I figured that was where the stars ratings came from. I'll also experiment with middle relievers. Thanks for the tips. __________________ Oliver Platt, the most realistic portrayal of George Steinbrenner ever, aside from Seinfeld....

07-29-2007, 11:04 PM	#2
tcblcommish Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 3,438	How is the defence? That is the true key in these game, I am pretty sure. I always try to get good solid defensive players and win a lot. Decent pitchers have really good records and good pitchers are great with solid "D"

07-29-2007, 11:24 PM	#4
DMan Bat Boy Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Indianapolis Posts: 18	Oh, okay! I knew there must be something! (Steinbrenner mode on) That's it! I'm firing everybody! I'll have to look into the defensive ratings.

07-30-2007, 07:12 AM	#5
injury log Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Toronto Posts: 9,162	Pitching does seem more volatile than hitting in OOTP as well (much like real life). While I often get consistent (near-identical, sometimes) performances from my lineup, my pitchers' stats tend to be all over the place, for better or for worse. Three further comments: -I would never judge a pitcher based on a month or so of performance; I've often had guys go on to win the Cy Young who looked like they should change careers after April; -Check your park factors. It may be that you play in a park where offense is inflated, and your pitchers may look worse than they really are; -I agree with tcbl about defense. You can do a quick check to see how your pitchers have been affected by defense (and/or by bad luck) by checking, in your Manager --> Options screen, your rank in BABIP against. If you're ranked poorly in that, you probably don't have much range on defense, and your pitcher ERAs will look worse than they should. Infield and Outfield Range seem to be the most important factors in influencing a staff's ERA, besides the ratings of the pitchers themselves.

07-30-2007, 10:45 AM	#7
Mattymo All Star Starter Join Date: May 2002 Location: Colchester, CT Posts: 1,448	All I know is right now, on August 1, I'm 10th in the NL in hitting (out of 16 teams) but 1st in pitching, and I have the best record in the National League. For me, good pitching is definitely beating good hitting.

07-30-2007, 02:45 PM	#8
Assos All Star Starter Join Date: May 2004 Location: Just on the fair side of the foul pole! Posts: 1,772	I have my 1977 Royals, with an added J.R. Richards, in first place by 13 games at July 1st and I will tell you, it is pitching and more pitching. I have one guy that is in double figures in dingers, but we have alot of average hitters with tons of RBIs.

07-30-2007, 11:31 PM	#11
Charlie Hough Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,644	You might want to rely on the recommendations of your scouts then. If you don't have much time to review player ratings, then that might be your best bet. Stars only give you a vague idea of the player's overall value. For example, he might get a number of stars because he is a great hitter who can hit for average and power. But he could also be a defensive liability and a sloth on the basepaths.

07-31-2007, 11:14 AM	#12
MiddiePlayer Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 47	One thing I have noticed is it seems easy to stock your team up with middle relievers to improve your staff. The computer AI seems to undervalue them a bit. Find some good long relievers... put them in as sometime starters and you will notice a big improvement.

07-31-2007, 03:01 PM	#14
james17 All Star Starter Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,305	I've noticed that pitching, especially starting pitchers, has more variablity in OOTP7 than OOTP6. Every pitcher seems to go through hot and cold cycles. The better the pitcher, the less often he goes cold and vice versa. It's more realistic this way though it makes it harder to win with just superior pitching than it used to be.