Major Vs. Minor. Vs. Independent Vs. Winter...

RANGER11JP · 03-30-2007, 12:45 AM

To the Powers that Be:

First and foremost let me state right up front that the game is very good.

That being said, I am now in the situation where I want to play it and watch what it does with all it's bells and whitles. I am having a problem with leagues and players, however.

I am a hybrid player. By that I mean that sometimes I like straight history, sometime all fictional, sometimes a combination of both. The problems I'm having are that I can't controll the fictional creation of players in the way I would like (age and talent wise and sheer numbers of them) and I can't figure out how to get independent minor leagues to function without having them be classified as MAJOR LEAGUE. And I'm really clueless with how the ML and Winter leagues should interact, if at all. Should I be seeing some ML players showing up there in the off season? Should they be coming back to their ML team next year? Can a player be a late bloomer on some independent league team and get picked up by a team "in the system"? I'm sooooo confused.

Does anybody else have these issues? Maybe I'm missing something. I've been waiting for 50+ years for a game like this. (Okay maybe I've only been waiting 45 of those years

) Can anyone help me out here?

Thanks!

JP

darkenigma510 · 03-30-2007, 12:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RANGER11JP

To the Powers that Be:

First and foremost let me state right up front that the game is very good.

That being said, I am now in the situation where I want to play it and watch what it does with all it's bells and whitles. I am having a problem with leagues and players, however.

I am a hybrid player. By that I mean that sometimes I like straight history, sometime all fictional, sometimes a combination of both. The problems I'm having are that I can't controll the fictional creation of players in the way I would like (age and talent wise and sheer numbers of them) and I can't figure out how to get independent minor leagues to function without having them be classified as MAJOR LEAGUE. And I'm really clueless with how the ML and Winter leagues should interact, if at all. Should I be seeing some ML players showing up there in the off season? Should they be coming back to their ML team next year? Can a player be a late bloomer on some independent league team and get picked up by a team "in the system"? I'm sooooo confused.

Does anybody else have these issues? Maybe I'm missing something. I've been waiting for 50+ years for a game like this. (Okay maybe I've only been waiting 45 of those years

) Can anyone help me out here?

Thanks!

JP

Independent minors should be set up as "International Leagues"

Winter leagues don't act like Winter Leagues in real life. They simply take place in Winter and are independent of your Major leagues.

Arlie Latham · 03-30-2007, 01:33 AM

Making all independent minor leagues of international league caliber does not necessarily work.

For example, what if I want an independent league like the old Kitty League, which was Class D? You certainly wouldn't want players who could jump to the major leagues from Kitty League ball.

It seems a step missing in the add fictional league walk-through OOTP does this year would be to list the level of league you want this new league to be. They all default to major leagues and you have to set them to another level. Then, if the game created the players for that league, you have a whole league of players overqualified for that level of play and you have to release them.

This leads to another problem. Say you want to solve the above issue and release all the players from this new league, adjust the creation modifiers to .9, .8., .7, etc. and get ready to add this league to your universe. By releasing all those players the game added unnecessarily, you have flooded your free agent market with too much talent. You don't want to erase all the free agents in the pool, since some of them have a history with your ongoing league.

Going back to the original idea, if the game asked what level of players to create for this league at the onset, these issues would not come up.

Let me know if I am missing something in this process. I know you can limit ages in the league and at creation, but this does not seem to affect the initial ages of players in the league.

darkenigma510 · 03-30-2007, 12:36 PM

You're right, you still have to manually adjust the quality of the league.

RANGER11JP · 03-30-2007, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkenigma510

You're right, you still have to manually adjust the quality of the league.

How do we do that and get the results we want?

Curtis · 03-30-2007, 11:24 PM

There are some different opinions on that. My suggestion would be to add up what in 2006 were called the MLEs for your league level, average them, then insert those numbers in what used to be called the PCM fields. For the Japan League this will give a modifier of around .96, for most International Level leagues around .85, and much lower for leagues equivalent to low minors.

kroney37 · 04-07-2007, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curtis

There are some different opinions on that. My suggestion would be to add up what in 2006 were called the MLEs for your league level, average them, then insert those numbers in what used to be called the PCM fields (now sabremetric PCMs?). For the Japan League this will give a modifier of around .96, for most International Level leagues around .85, and much lower for leagues equivalent to low minors.

I'm thinking of having a Japanese league to go along with my North American leagues, and I'm curious as to what peoples' ides are regarding modifiers. I've read that .96 may be a good idea, does anyone else have ideas? I'm thinking that the difference in fielding ratings may be smaller than the difference in power, for example.

Curtis · 04-07-2007, 05:39 PM

I agree with you about fielding vs. power.

I was forced to come up with a more complete answer to the 'equivalent MLE' question in another thread, and to my surprise discovered that in 2007 the game rates the Japanese IL and AAA leagues exactly equivalent to their MLB cousins. Even in 2006, where all its other PCMs were .95, power was 1.00. I don't get it, and I changed it in my universe.

For brief reference, out-of-the-box in 2007:
MLB/[league redacted] — 1.00
Cuban/Mexican — .96
Korean/Taiwan/Dominican Winter/Mexican Winter/Puerto Rican Winter — .84
AAA/Nippon Baseball Ni-Gun — .73
Venezuelan Winter — .72
AA — .65
A — .56
Short Season A — .46
Rookie — .35

kroney37 · 04-07-2007, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Curtis

I agree with you about fielding vs. power.

I was forced to come up with a more complete answer to the 'equivalent PCM' question in another thread, and to my surprise discovered that in 2007 the game rates the Japanese IL and AAA leagues exactly equivalent to their MLB cousins. Even in 2006, where all its other PCMs were .95, power was 1.00. I don't get it, and I changed it in my universe.

I'm guessing you're talking about this thread:
http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...d.php?t=144371

Do you remember what you set your traditional PCMs and Sabermetric PCMs to? I've set them all to .960 and that still seems a bit off.

Curtis · 04-08-2007, 03:08 AM

The original (in 2006) was 1.000 in homers and.950 in the other four in the MLE section.

I just went back and checked it. I had confused the PCMs and MLEs in my earlier posts. I'll try to edit them.

I used 1.000 for Batting Average, Contact, Running Speed and Fielding Ratings.
.960 for Stuff, Movement and Control.
.950 for all others.

I can see arguements for putting the 1.000 into Gap and Extra Base Hits and dropping Contact and Batting Average back to .950. I guess it comes down to how well you think the Japanese exports do in the majors. I think the guys who come over here tend to be better than the average Nippon League players, so I think I'd drop their batting averages IF you're planning on having much movement between Asia and America. (My universe has only Asian leagues in it — five in Japan, two Taiwanese, one Korean and one Chinese.)

And, hey! What do YOU think?

03-30-2007, 12:45 AM	#1
RANGER11JP All Star Starter Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,373	Major Vs. Minor. Vs. Independent Vs. Winter... To the Powers that Be: First and foremost let me state right up front that the game is very good. That being said, I am now in the situation where I want to play it and watch what it does with all it's bells and whitles. I am having a problem with leagues and players, however. I am a hybrid player. By that I mean that sometimes I like straight history, sometime all fictional, sometimes a combination of both. The problems I'm having are that I can't controll the fictional creation of players in the way I would like (age and talent wise and sheer numbers of them) and I can't figure out how to get independent minor leagues to function without having them be classified as MAJOR LEAGUE. And I'm really clueless with how the ML and Winter leagues should interact, if at all. Should I be seeing some ML players showing up there in the off season? Should they be coming back to their ML team next year? Can a player be a late bloomer on some independent league team and get picked up by a team "in the system"? I'm sooooo confused. Does anybody else have these issues? Maybe I'm missing something. I've been waiting for 50+ years for a game like this. (Okay maybe I've only been waiting 45 of those years ) Can anyone help me out here? Thanks! JP

03-30-2007, 01:33 AM	#3
Arlie Latham Major Leagues Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Iowa Cornfields Posts: 472	Making all independent minor leagues of international league caliber does not necessarily work. For example, what if I want an independent league like the old Kitty League, which was Class D? You certainly wouldn't want players who could jump to the major leagues from Kitty League ball. It seems a step missing in the add fictional league walk-through OOTP does this year would be to list the level of league you want this new league to be. They all default to major leagues and you have to set them to another level. Then, if the game created the players for that league, you have a whole league of players overqualified for that level of play and you have to release them. This leads to another problem. Say you want to solve the above issue and release all the players from this new league, adjust the creation modifiers to .9, .8., .7, etc. and get ready to add this league to your universe. By releasing all those players the game added unnecessarily, you have flooded your free agent market with too much talent. You don't want to erase all the free agents in the pool, since some of them have a history with your ongoing league. Going back to the original idea, if the game asked what level of players to create for this league at the onset, these issues would not come up. Let me know if I am missing something in this process. I know you can limit ages in the league and at creation, but this does not seem to affect the initial ages of players in the league. __________________ Here are my logos from the Arlie Latham Amateur Logo Hour, Coming to you Weeknights on your local public broadcasting station,between Sesame Street and The Joy of Painting with Bob Ross. http://s83.photobucket.com/albums/j303/Arlie_Latham/

03-30-2007, 11:24 PM	#6
Curtis Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Watertown, New York Posts: 4,567	There are some different opinions on that. My suggestion would be to add up what in 2006 were called the MLEs for your league level, average them, then insert those numbers in what used to be called the PCM fields. For the Japan League this will give a modifier of around .96, for most International Level leagues around .85, and much lower for leagues equivalent to low minors. Last edited by Curtis; 04-08-2007 at 03:09 AM.

04-07-2007, 05:39 PM	#8
Curtis Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Watertown, New York Posts: 4,567	I agree with you about fielding vs. power. I was forced to come up with a more complete answer to the 'equivalent MLE' question in another thread, and to my surprise discovered that in 2007 the game rates the Japanese IL and AAA leagues exactly equivalent to their MLB cousins. Even in 2006, where all its other PCMs were .95, power was 1.00. I don't get it, and I changed it in my universe. For brief reference, out-of-the-box in 2007: MLB/[league redacted] — 1.00 Cuban/Mexican — .96 Korean/Taiwan/Dominican Winter/Mexican Winter/Puerto Rican Winter — .84 AAA/Nippon Baseball Ni-Gun — .73 Venezuelan Winter — .72 AA — .65 A — .56 Short Season A — .46 Rookie — .35 Last edited by Curtis; 04-08-2007 at 03:09 AM.

03-30-2007, 12:36 PM	#4
darkenigma510 All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The Wild West Posts: 1,353	You're right, you still have to manually adjust the quality of the league.

04-08-2007, 03:08 AM	#10
Curtis Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Watertown, New York Posts: 4,567	The original (in 2006) was 1.000 in homers and.950 in the other four in the MLE section. I just went back and checked it. I had confused the PCMs and MLEs in my earlier posts. I'll try to edit them. I used 1.000 for Batting Average, Contact, Running Speed and Fielding Ratings. .960 for Stuff, Movement and Control. .950 for all others. I can see arguements for putting the 1.000 into Gap and Extra Base Hits and dropping Contact and Batting Average back to .950. I guess it comes down to how well you think the Japanese exports do in the majors. I think the guys who come over here tend to be better than the average Nippon League players, so I think I'd drop their batting averages IF you're planning on having much movement between Asia and America. (My universe has only Asian leagues in it — five in Japan, two Taiwanese, one Korean and one Chinese.) And, hey! What do YOU think?