What do you look for in an online league?

Cole · 02-17-2003, 01:01 PM

Hello .. first I'm posting this here because I think I'll get more reaction, and I don't think it's outside of the confines of this board, since it is a disccussion of something OOTP related.

Anyways.. I was just curious, I'm planning to start an online league soon, and I was wondering, as owners, what do you guys look for when searching for an online league to join? Ex. How many sims a week? How many teams? How many games in a season? Fictional or real players? Starting year? Any other things you've noticed that work well in online leagues, please let me know ... I've got some ideas, but I'd like a general idea from the community of what works, and what doesn't work..

Thank you.

LivnLegend · 02-17-2003, 01:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ripwalk
Hello .. first I'm posting this here because I think I'll get more reaction, and I don't think it's outside of the confines of this board, since it is a disccussion of something OOTP related.

Anyways.. I was just curious, I'm planning to start an online league soon, and I was wondering, as owners, what do you guys look for when searching for an online league to join? Ex. How many sims a week? How many teams? How many games in a season? Fictional or real players? Starting year? Any other things you've noticed that work well in online leagues, please let me know ... I've got some ideas, but I'd like a general idea from the community of what works, and what doesn't work..

Thank you.

3 sims per week, one game week per sim is my favorite.
16-24 teams
Fictional all the way, baby.
162 games/season

What works: Getting a few high quality guys who will tirelessly "work" the league. They can do this through writing articles, working the trade lines, and just providing excitement for the league. If you get the right kind of owners to fill this role, their contributions will pull some of the "quiet" type owners into participating more -- it's contagious! It's like a snowball at the top of a hill just rolling and picking up speed and mass.

Have a twist to your league. The leagues that I like to visit are leagues like Laseron and Northern Midwest League - fantastic leagues with imagination and something different (although not TOO different, if you know what I mean).

Be open to outsiders. The USBA has picked up a couple of regular contributors/writers who do not own teams because we have a complete open door policy. I know of several people who come by the league web site just to keep up. I had one new league last year actually tell me they did not want any outsiders reading their league message boards - they banned me after I posted a "good luck" message! That league has since had many owner defections and now has a new commissioner so maybe things changed for the better.

Just a few thoughts, hope it helps.

spleen1015 · 02-17-2003, 01:31 PM

Scott's advice is very good, but don't let him fool you. The job he does as commish helps his league tremendously as well. USBA is one of the best leagues around. It's a good league because Scott does a good job and the guys in his league are top owners. It takes both to be really successful.

thefreaks · 02-17-2003, 01:53 PM

I think I have different criteria depending on what stage the league is in.

When checking out a league that is just starting up, the first thing I do is look at the league website. If there is not an extensive league constitution that addresses the important issues of an online league, I walk away. I'd rather have a set structure in place before the league starts, rather than join the league, have several changes be voted in, and then realize the league isn't what I thought it was going to be. Also, while looking at the league constitution, I'm examining the writing style of the commish. Does the commish seem too authoritative or too lackadaisical? Is there any immaturity that comes across from the commish? Does the commish have an oustanding OOTP reputation that other people readily verify via postings in the OOTP Forum, pumping up the new league? Or does the commish have a reputation for failing to finish what they start?

Also, does the league website look professional? Are there annoying pop up ads? Does it take a long time to load? I've basically got my radar up and using any tool I can to determine if the league is going to be worthy of spending time on. Those initial tools at my disposal are the league website, the league constitution and any posts the commish has made in the OOTP forums. If I see any red flags, I walk away and wait for another opportunity.

When an established league advertises an opening, there's a couple things I can quickly look at to see if the league passes my initial test. First, do I know what team is available? If that is not advertised, I normally walk away unless there is some intriguing reason for me not to (e.g. well known league, outstanding website, very active owners, etc). Also, when looking at the league site, are all owners listed by name? I like to see exactly who it is I'm competing with. Some established online league owners are well known within the OOTP community, for better or worse. A big turnoff for me is to go to the Owners section of a league website and find a list of email addresses or AIM names next to a team logo.

In addition, if the league is established, I like to visit the League Forum to see how active it is. The more active, the better. While in the Forum, I keep my radar up for evidence of any league disputes, or disputes between individual owners and how those are handled. Are these issues addressed in a mature manner, or does it deteriorate into a big flame session with nothing being accomplished? If these flame sessions are evident, is it constantly the same owners involved with each other? Or is it more of a league wide epidemic?

And with the available teams within the league, are they in decent financial shape? Or am I entering a situation that has no chance of improving in the near future? Has the team traded away their draft picks, or have they stockpiled future picks? Is the team filled with older overpriced veterans in the twilight of their career? Or do they have several up and coming youngsters who aren't good now, but have a bright future ahead? Are there any albatross contracts that I'll be stuck with? Did the previous owner go on an insane free agent spending spree and then ditch the squad because it didn't work out, dooming the next owner for years?

Also, I'm a huge fan of a participation points system in OOTP online leagues, whether the league is just starting out, or is established. Rare are the leagues that have outstanding participation by all owners involved. However, it has been my experience when owners are rewarded for participation, more people in the league participate, thus making the league more fun and stronger as a whole.

That's all I can think of, hope this helps you in some fashion. Good luck with your endeavor.

bigphesta · 02-17-2003, 01:56 PM

The absense of Holyroller and darkhorse

In reality, the owners do make the league. I try to find leagues with good owners I know from other leagues or a solid commish who I know from other leagues. Rules are important as well. I am not a big fan of leagues who make up totaly new financial systems

Cole · 02-17-2003, 02:14 PM

Thanks for the advice guys ... It's all been really helpful ... Hopefully other people will chime in with their 2 cents as well ..

Now, a question ....

Quote:

Originally posted by spleen1015
Scott's advice is very good, but don't let him fool you. The job he does as commish helps his league tremendously as well. USBA is one of the best leagues around. It's a good league because Scott does a good job and the guys in his league are top owners. It takes both to be really successful.

Can you expand on this spleen? What is it that Scott does that makes the league so successful? I would obviously want to have a league where owners said similar things about me, so I'm really interested in a little bit of insight of what makes a great commish.

spleen1015 · 02-17-2003, 02:41 PM

First, he does all of the right things. Sims are complete on time. The website is one of the better websites I have seen for an online leagues. Have you read anything that he writes? He does an awesome job with the writeups he does. He spends the needed time to make the league one of the best. Have you seen the ballpark diagrams he did. Top notch stuff. You can tell that he had a clear vision of what he wanted when he got started. I'm sure I'm missing some things. The guys in his league can speak to it better.

This is where I think I lack as a commish. I can get the sims done, but I'm not a good writer and I don't think I'm very creative.

Killebrew · 02-17-2003, 03:13 PM

In order of importance to me:
1. A good commish. A good commish displays good communication ability. You find this out right away when you email a commish to inquire about possible future GM openings. I assume the commish is also judging my communication ability at the same time

. A good commish has a lot of online league experience, is friendly & sociable but still able to make the tough-but-fair choices when required.
2. Consistancy and stability. Have to follow the schedule strictly. A good league will have 1 or 2 league presidents who help a commish keep the league schedule tight when a personal or work conflict arrises. Some leagues even have more GM's very involved in this process, need very good GM's for that.
3. Good Rules. They do not have to be too deep but they must make sense and cover most major things that could come up in a league.
4. Website. i) No popups allowed, not an unreasonable demand in this day and age with free server space from .400.
ii) Someone in the league needs to know enough html that the website is not painful to look at

. Does not need to be fancy but it is a site you will be looking at almost every day so if it looks awful there are enough good leagues that have a nicer looking site. Think of the site as part of the games interface when you are in an online, so again, I think this is a valid requirement.
iii) Ideally someone in the league is able to update the site frequently, and by this I mean the game html output.
5. League type. I prefer fictional, but have joined a excellent historical leagues in the past. I am 0 for 2 with modern leagues, IMO they last the shortest. Possibly because people that want to follow todays stars get bored with the league after todays stars begin retiring in year #2 of the league

.
6. Sim schedule - I'd prefer 3 or 4 a week, covering 1-2 weeks each of game time. This is not that vital to me though.
7. Good, active GM's. If #1-6 get passing grades then you should be able to gather a very good, active group of online GM's without any extra effort.

Treches · 02-17-2003, 03:28 PM

Some of the ones posted up above and also the fact that the league isn't intended to be a second, albeit unpaid, day job. If people want to contribute writting stuff, creating goodies, etc, great; if writting an article per week is mandatory, don't count me in; if the commish can't update the html pages one week and it's going to be seen as a freaking tragedy, don't count me in either. This is for fun, some leagues just don't get it. Commishes do an invaluable job, some owners don't get it.

Darren Drewitz · 02-17-2003, 04:57 PM

I prefer the way the league im in does things. We sim 3 times a week, almost always the same days every week. We sim one week at a time. That works well, the season doesnt take to long nor is it to short.
Good owners is also important. Active owners is the first thing to look for when choosing a league. In my league, people are constantly posting messages and talking baseball along with other stuff.
Professional looking website and rules is also important. The rules should be there but some of it should be open for discussion.
Check out my league for some ideas.
http://nwbl.homeip.net/baseball.htm
Also, we have one opening if anyone is interested. Maui is available if you are intersted in taking over a team in our league. We have just expanded and only have one opening.

sporr · 02-17-2003, 05:14 PM

I echo everyone above. The best thing you can do for your league is create an immersive experience. This requires a little bit of writing/ storytelling. It helps to have several owners who will go the extra mile for you. Let's face it, it is VERY time consuming to run an online league, update the pages 3 times a week, write some articles, update other odds and ends, and process FA signings, contracts, etc. Doing all of these things will leave you with little time to do some of the extra stuff that can take the league over the top. In our case (Baseball Maelstrom), it helps that Mr. Dugan and myself share Commish duties. It takes some of the burden off. Of course, we still have a handful of ideas that we still don't have the time to implement, but one of these days we'll find a "League Administrator" who will handle some of these duties for us and make our league even better.

Finally, it's amazing how much of a difference the little touches can make. For example, I take a little bit of time each sim to put the proper hat on player photos (we run a modern league). Just a few minutes of time, but it adds to the illusion of reality for the league. If you can find little things to do like this, it can really help.

LivnLegend · 02-17-2003, 05:33 PM

Thanks to Matt/Spleen for the extraordinarily complimentary things he said about the USBA. That's the nicest thing I've read in some time!

ripwalk, Shane/sporr nailed it with his comment about writing/storytelling. It does not need to be much to make me happy but a little bit goes a long way. Here's an example of a small story, 5 minutes in the works, that kind of helped set the tone for our current off-season:
http://www.ootp-leagues.com/mbs/usba...d.php?tid=1851
(the photos used are from my fictional facepack)

I am also lucky in that the league has three owners who help put together ESPN style articles and another 3 or 4 owners who have writing pseudonyms for various themed articles. Like I said, it's contagious! But we also have some guys in the league who are like Treches, who don't wish to write and do not want it to be mandatory. No sweat. Besides, if everyone writes, you'd never have time to read it all and it could become a burden - the opposite of the desired effect! A good mix of A-type and B-type personalities can be good

Treches · 02-17-2003, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by LivnLegend
But we also have some guys in the league who are like Treches, who don't wish to write and do not want it to be mandatory.

Just to clarify that I don't think it has to be mandatory (some good owners don't have the time, don't like to write or simply don't think they can write anything readable) nor could I be interested in a league with those characteristics, but as long as I'm the CBL webmaster despite not being the commish, you can bet I wish to write stuff and create some goodies every week. The point is I do because I like it, it's fun and does not really take much, not because it is mandatory. If for some reason I can't update the site, it isn't a big deal nor am I going to be penalized. Otherwise, I would have left long ago. It sure adds to the league, but lets not forget about the point here is having fun.

crackpott · 02-17-2003, 07:02 PM

I look for a league without Hornsmaniac or Rockze as commish.

Seriously, one thing that hasn't been covered is the amount of hype a league generates. Many assume that to be a good sign of a league, and more than anything it's a sign that the owners in the league frequently browse the OOTP boards. Although it can be good, you shouldn't discount any leagues that don't have the hype of Maelstrom (which IS a very good league...) and the USBA (haven't been in it, can't comment, although it looks good). Much of the hype generated on various leagues is from commissioners telling owners "We need new guys... go make the league sound good." and other leagues that are among the best out there have no mention at all on the board. Anyway, that ends my rant about that.

The other thing that I look for is a commissioner who is online a lot, and dedicated to whatever his goal for the league is. If they don't have a clear goal, it's more likely the whole thing will go off course.

Mind you, I agree with most of what has been said. I just thought I'd add some other things that likely wouldn't get covered.

LivnLegend · 02-17-2003, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crackpott
Although it can be good, you shouldn't discount any leagues that don't have the hype of...the USBA (haven't been in it, can't comment, although it looks good). Much of the hype generated on various leagues is from commissioners telling owners "We need new guys... go make the league sound good."

Could not be further form the truth in my case. You have never seen the USBA looking for owners here because no one in the USBA is willing to give up their spot! In three seasons, the USBA has never advertised for owners. And much of the "hype" is from people who are not in the league. 75% of my league's team owners never post here.

holyroller · 02-17-2003, 07:08 PM

Never once done that either and I assume that it is the same for most, if not all, leagues. Any replies in my recruiting threads by my owners are always completely unsolicited.

crackpott · 02-17-2003, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by LivnLegend
Could not be further form the truth in my case. You have never seen the USBA looking for owners here because no one in the USBA is willing to give up their spot! In three seasons, the USBA has never advertised for owners. And much of the "hype" is from people who are not in the league. 75% of my league's team owners never post here.

I didn't mean to offend you, I was just using your league as an example of one that has hype surrounding it. It can very well be the best league on the internet for all I know, my point was merely that you should judge leagues based on checking out ALL leagues and not just the ones which people around here are praising, as not everyone visits these boards. Again, if I offended you or holyroller, I apologise, and I'll shut up in this thread from this point on.

MannyTrillo · 02-17-2003, 07:15 PM

Wow, LOTS of good advice here.

I would add a couple of things:

-One is that it is important for the commish to try to communicate a certain level of enthusiasm about the league. When the commish is obviously psyched about the league, it really rubs off on the owners... when the commish seems a little disinterested, it seems to have a bad effect on participation.

-Similar to thefreaks' comment earlier... I may have slightly different criteria than he does, but the main thing I would check for in a new league would be "warning signs" that would put me off, as he said. The message is, be very thorough from the beginning- take the time to come up with a solid set of rules, make a nice website, maybe add some lengthy background articles about the league to start, and think carefully about what you are going to say in your pitch to new owners on the boards.

The most important thing, IMO, is for your website to give a strong impression that this is a league that's going to be around for awhile.

holyroller · 02-17-2003, 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by crackpott
. Again, if I offended you or holyroller, I apologise, and I'll shut up in this thread from this point on.

No offense taken. For that you would have to call me a ******

UKSubs · 02-17-2003, 07:43 PM

Ideally, the best way to start a league is to spend a few weeks beforehand preparing everything. A post like this is an excellent start for your league, since it shows that you are interested in the opinions of others and to me, that you are putting a lot of time and effort in the setup of a league.

A league that has a lot of setup beforehand is less likely to fail than a league that does not, simply because a commissioner who has already made a significant investment of his time and labor is less likely to fold up shop than one who hasn't.

A good rules page and website can speak volumes for a new league. If it looks like someone has put the effort into these things, then they seem serious about starting a league and are more likely to keep the league together during the first two seasons, when running a league is the hardest.

I also wanted to touch on Crackpot's point as well. If you have good owners who like your league, then they will add to your posts with their own enthusiasm when you are looking for new owners later on. (Something that basically every league goes through.) But, if you ask your owners to do it, most likely the new guys will find out that the owners' enthusiasm in the recruiting thread is false and realize that the league is more pedestrian than you were led to believe. (Based on true experience.)

Finally, I will be the first person to say that this is the kind of league I would look to join when it starts if I had the time, since you seem to be putting a great deal of thought and planning into the league, something that every good commissioner does.

Best of luck.

02-17-2003, 01:53 PM	#4
thefreaks Minors (Single A) Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 73	I think I have different criteria depending on what stage the league is in. When checking out a league that is just starting up, the first thing I do is look at the league website. If there is not an extensive league constitution that addresses the important issues of an online league, I walk away. I'd rather have a set structure in place before the league starts, rather than join the league, have several changes be voted in, and then realize the league isn't what I thought it was going to be. Also, while looking at the league constitution, I'm examining the writing style of the commish. Does the commish seem too authoritative or too lackadaisical? Is there any immaturity that comes across from the commish? Does the commish have an oustanding OOTP reputation that other people readily verify via postings in the OOTP Forum, pumping up the new league? Or does the commish have a reputation for failing to finish what they start? Also, does the league website look professional? Are there annoying pop up ads? Does it take a long time to load? I've basically got my radar up and using any tool I can to determine if the league is going to be worthy of spending time on. Those initial tools at my disposal are the league website, the league constitution and any posts the commish has made in the OOTP forums. If I see any red flags, I walk away and wait for another opportunity. When an established league advertises an opening, there's a couple things I can quickly look at to see if the league passes my initial test. First, do I know what team is available? If that is not advertised, I normally walk away unless there is some intriguing reason for me not to (e.g. well known league, outstanding website, very active owners, etc). Also, when looking at the league site, are all owners listed by name? I like to see exactly who it is I'm competing with. Some established online league owners are well known within the OOTP community, for better or worse. A big turnoff for me is to go to the Owners section of a league website and find a list of email addresses or AIM names next to a team logo. In addition, if the league is established, I like to visit the League Forum to see how active it is. The more active, the better. While in the Forum, I keep my radar up for evidence of any league disputes, or disputes between individual owners and how those are handled. Are these issues addressed in a mature manner, or does it deteriorate into a big flame session with nothing being accomplished? If these flame sessions are evident, is it constantly the same owners involved with each other? Or is it more of a league wide epidemic? And with the available teams within the league, are they in decent financial shape? Or am I entering a situation that has no chance of improving in the near future? Has the team traded away their draft picks, or have they stockpiled future picks? Is the team filled with older overpriced veterans in the twilight of their career? Or do they have several up and coming youngsters who aren't good now, but have a bright future ahead? Are there any albatross contracts that I'll be stuck with? Did the previous owner go on an insane free agent spending spree and then ditch the squad because it didn't work out, dooming the next owner for years? Also, I'm a huge fan of a participation points system in OOTP online leagues, whether the league is just starting out, or is established. Rare are the leagues that have outstanding participation by all owners involved. However, it has been my experience when owners are rewarded for participation, more people in the league participate, thus making the league more fun and stronger as a whole. That's all I can think of, hope this helps you in some fashion. Good luck with your endeavor. Last edited by thefreaks; 02-17-2003 at 01:59 PM.

02-17-2003, 03:13 PM	#8
Killebrew Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 3,326	In order of importance to me: 1. A good commish. A good commish displays good communication ability. You find this out right away when you email a commish to inquire about possible future GM openings. I assume the commish is also judging my communication ability at the same time. A good commish has a lot of online league experience, is friendly & sociable but still able to make the tough-but-fair choices when required. 2. Consistancy and stability. Have to follow the schedule strictly. A good league will have 1 or 2 league presidents who help a commish keep the league schedule tight when a personal or work conflict arrises. Some leagues even have more GM's very involved in this process, need very good GM's for that. 3. Good Rules. They do not have to be too deep but they must make sense and cover most major things that could come up in a league. 4. Website. i) No popups allowed, not an unreasonable demand in this day and age with free server space from .400. ii) Someone in the league needs to know enough html that the website is not painful to look at. Does not need to be fancy but it is a site you will be looking at almost every day so if it looks awful there are enough good leagues that have a nicer looking site. Think of the site as part of the games interface when you are in an online, so again, I think this is a valid requirement. iii) Ideally someone in the league is able to update the site frequently, and by this I mean the game html output. 5. League type. I prefer fictional, but have joined a excellent historical leagues in the past. I am 0 for 2 with modern leagues, IMO they last the shortest. Possibly because people that want to follow todays stars get bored with the league after todays stars begin retiring in year #2 of the league. 6. Sim schedule - I'd prefer 3 or 4 a week, covering 1-2 weeks each of game time. This is not that vital to me though. 7. Good, active GM's. If #1-6 get passing grades then you should be able to gather a very good, active group of online GM's without any extra effort. Last edited by Killebrew; 02-17-2003 at 05:36 PM.

02-17-2003, 03:28 PM	#9
Treches Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Damned Hell Posts: 2,150	Some of the ones posted up above and also the fact that the league isn't intended to be a second, albeit unpaid, day job. If people want to contribute writting stuff, creating goodies, etc, great; if writting an article per week is mandatory, don't count me in; if the commish can't update the html pages one week and it's going to be seen as a freaking tragedy, don't count me in either. This is for fun, some leagues just don't get it. Commishes do an invaluable job, some owners don't get it. __________________ The Computer Baseball League

02-17-2003, 04:57 PM	#10
Darren Drewitz Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mother Warsaw Posts: 28	I prefer the way the league im in does things. We sim 3 times a week, almost always the same days every week. We sim one week at a time. That works well, the season doesnt take to long nor is it to short. Good owners is also important. Active owners is the first thing to look for when choosing a league. In my league, people are constantly posting messages and talking baseball along with other stuff. Professional looking website and rules is also important. The rules should be there but some of it should be open for discussion. Check out my league for some ideas. http://nwbl.homeip.net/baseball.htm Also, we have one opening if anyone is interested. Maui is available if you are intersted in taking over a team in our league. We have just expanded and only have one opening. __________________ Darren Drewitz Warsaw Warriors

02-17-2003, 05:33 PM	#12
LivnLegend Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: 100% pure adrenaline! Posts: 5,624	Thanks to Matt/Spleen for the extraordinarily complimentary things he said about the USBA. That's the nicest thing I've read in some time! ripwalk, Shane/sporr nailed it with his comment about writing/storytelling. It does not need to be much to make me happy but a little bit goes a long way. Here's an example of a small story, 5 minutes in the works, that kind of helped set the tone for our current off-season: http://www.ootp-leagues.com/mbs/usba...d.php?tid=1851 (the photos used are from my fictional facepack) I am also lucky in that the league has three owners who help put together ESPN style articles and another 3 or 4 owners who have writing pseudonyms for various themed articles. Like I said, it's contagious! But we also have some guys in the league who are like Treches, who don't wish to write and do not want it to be mandatory. No sweat. Besides, if everyone writes, you'd never have time to read it all and it could become a burden - the opposite of the desired effect! A good mix of A-type and B-type personalities can be good __________________ Excess ain't rebellion. You're drinking what they're selling.

02-17-2003, 01:01 PM	#1
Cole Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Fredericton, New Brunswick Posts: 2,685	What do you look for in an online league? Hello .. first I'm posting this here because I think I'll get more reaction, and I don't think it's outside of the confines of this board, since it is a disccussion of something OOTP related. Anyways.. I was just curious, I'm planning to start an online league soon, and I was wondering, as owners, what do you guys look for when searching for an online league to join? Ex. How many sims a week? How many teams? How many games in a season? Fictional or real players? Starting year? Any other things you've noticed that work well in online leagues, please let me know ... I've got some ideas, but I'd like a general idea from the community of what works, and what doesn't work.. Thank you.

02-17-2003, 01:31 PM	#3
spleen1015 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,008	Scott's advice is very good, but don't let him fool you. The job he does as commish helps his league tremendously as well. USBA is one of the best leagues around. It's a good league because Scott does a good job and the guys in his league are top owners. It takes both to be really successful.

02-17-2003, 01:56 PM	#5
bigphesta Banned Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Des Moines, Iowa Posts: 1,366	The absense of Holyroller and darkhorse In reality, the owners do make the league. I try to find leagues with good owners I know from other leagues or a solid commish who I know from other leagues. Rules are important as well. I am not a big fan of leagues who make up totaly new financial systems

02-17-2003, 02:41 PM	#7
spleen1015 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 6,008	First, he does all of the right things. Sims are complete on time. The website is one of the better websites I have seen for an online leagues. Have you read anything that he writes? He does an awesome job with the writeups he does. He spends the needed time to make the league one of the best. Have you seen the ballpark diagrams he did. Top notch stuff. You can tell that he had a clear vision of what he wanted when he got started. I'm sure I'm missing some things. The guys in his league can speak to it better. This is where I think I lack as a commish. I can get the sims done, but I'm not a good writer and I don't think I'm very creative.

02-17-2003, 05:14 PM	#11
sporr Global Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Muscatine, IA Posts: 8,277	I echo everyone above. The best thing you can do for your league is create an immersive experience. This requires a little bit of writing/ storytelling. It helps to have several owners who will go the extra mile for you. Let's face it, it is VERY time consuming to run an online league, update the pages 3 times a week, write some articles, update other odds and ends, and process FA signings, contracts, etc. Doing all of these things will leave you with little time to do some of the extra stuff that can take the league over the top. In our case (Baseball Maelstrom), it helps that Mr. Dugan and myself share Commish duties. It takes some of the burden off. Of course, we still have a handful of ideas that we still don't have the time to implement, but one of these days we'll find a "League Administrator" who will handle some of these duties for us and make our league even better. Finally, it's amazing how much of a difference the little touches can make. For example, I take a little bit of time each sim to put the proper hat on player photos (we run a modern league). Just a few minutes of time, but it adds to the illusion of reality for the league. If you can find little things to do like this, it can really help.

02-17-2003, 07:02 PM	#14
crackpott Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Toronto Posts: 2,961	I look for a league without Hornsmaniac or Rockze as commish. Seriously, one thing that hasn't been covered is the amount of hype a league generates. Many assume that to be a good sign of a league, and more than anything it's a sign that the owners in the league frequently browse the OOTP boards. Although it can be good, you shouldn't discount any leagues that don't have the hype of Maelstrom (which IS a very good league...) and the USBA (haven't been in it, can't comment, although it looks good). Much of the hype generated on various leagues is from commissioners telling owners "We need new guys... go make the league sound good." and other leagues that are among the best out there have no mention at all on the board. Anyway, that ends my rant about that. The other thing that I look for is a commissioner who is online a lot, and dedicated to whatever his goal for the league is. If they don't have a clear goal, it's more likely the whole thing will go off course. Mind you, I agree with most of what has been said. I just thought I'd add some other things that likely wouldn't get covered. __________________ Abandoned Planet - Check it out. The photos don't suck anymore.

02-17-2003, 07:08 PM	#16
holyroller Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: OTBL Forums Posts: 3,532	Never once done that either and I assume that it is the same for most, if not all, leagues. Any replies in my recruiting threads by my owners are always completely unsolicited. __________________ Back to work, but not drawing a paycheck. TonyJ et. al.'s alias “I confused it with the chicken’s neck,” Mocanu, who was admitted to the emergency hospital in Galati, was quoted as saying. “I cut it ... and the dog rushed and ate it.”

02-17-2003, 07:15 PM	#18
MannyTrillo All Star Reserve Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 664	Wow, LOTS of good advice here. I would add a couple of things: -One is that it is important for the commish to try to communicate a certain level of enthusiasm about the league. When the commish is obviously psyched about the league, it really rubs off on the owners... when the commish seems a little disinterested, it seems to have a bad effect on participation. -Similar to thefreaks' comment earlier... I may have slightly different criteria than he does, but the main thing I would check for in a new league would be "warning signs" that would put me off, as he said. The message is, be very thorough from the beginning- take the time to come up with a solid set of rules, make a nice website, maybe add some lengthy background articles about the league to start, and think carefully about what you are going to say in your pitch to new owners on the boards. The most important thing, IMO, is for your website to give a strong impression that this is a league that's going to be around for awhile. __________________ Poster emeritus "Not butchery, dining!!" obt sk cmh ct President, A-1 Aces OT Posting Club Click here to join

02-17-2003, 07:43 PM	#20
UKSubs Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 272	Ideally, the best way to start a league is to spend a few weeks beforehand preparing everything. A post like this is an excellent start for your league, since it shows that you are interested in the opinions of others and to me, that you are putting a lot of time and effort in the setup of a league. A league that has a lot of setup beforehand is less likely to fail than a league that does not, simply because a commissioner who has already made a significant investment of his time and labor is less likely to fold up shop than one who hasn't. A good rules page and website can speak volumes for a new league. If it looks like someone has put the effort into these things, then they seem serious about starting a league and are more likely to keep the league together during the first two seasons, when running a league is the hardest. I also wanted to touch on Crackpot's point as well. If you have good owners who like your league, then they will add to your posts with their own enthusiasm when you are looking for new owners later on. (Something that basically every league goes through.) But, if you ask your owners to do it, most likely the new guys will find out that the owners' enthusiasm in the recruiting thread is false and realize that the league is more pedestrian than you were led to believe. (Based on true experience.) Finally, I will be the first person to say that this is the kind of league I would look to join when it starts if I had the time, since you seem to be putting a great deal of thought and planning into the league, something that every good commissioner does. Best of luck. __________________ Counter Culture Baseball Commissioner/Houston Astros RANZBA Adelaide Crows