AL Comeback Player Award a Joke!!!! - Page 2

dougfireghost · 10-07-2006, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by magnet

Much better? I throughly disagree with the much part.

Thome's VORP+WARP1+EQA: 63.2 6.4 .333
Thomas's VORP+WARP1+EQA: 40.3 4.7 .313

Even looking at stats the voters will care about, Thome wins. Thomas has him barely in RBI's, but Thome beats him in both homers and batting average (by a fair amount on the latter one too).

dougfireghost · 10-07-2006, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mlyons

I really don't see how you can say Thomas had a worse 2005 than Thome did. Thome had a slugging percentage of .352, for crying out loud.

You're right. I overlooked that.

Raidergoo · 10-07-2006, 05:17 PM

Thomas should have been run out of baseball due to the last two seasons full of injuries, and he came back to hit 39 HR's in a masoleum of a stadium. Thome, while having a better season, had less to overcome.

The A's were delusional when they took a flyer on Thomas, and it has paid off in spades.

Thomas was jobbed.

magnet · 10-07-2006, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raidergoo

Thomas should have been run out of baseball due to the last two seasons full of injuries, and he came back to hit 39 HR's in a masoleum of a stadium. Thome, while having a better season, had less to overcome.

The A's were delusional when they took a flyer on Thomas, and it has paid off in spades.

Thomas was jobbed.

I'm still with Raidergoo on this one.

Scoman · 10-07-2006, 05:26 PM

thomas thome
ab 466 490
hits 126 141
runs 77 108
d 11 26
t 0 0
hr 39 42
rbi 114 109
bb 81 107
ba .270 .288
oba .381 .416
slg .545 .598

Thome made the allstar team,thomas didnt,the numbers dont lie,not sure what the big debate is,thome won the award,and should have.

Long_Long_Name · 10-07-2006, 05:27 PM

I agree with mlyons here - Thomas played fine in the past few years, when he was in shape. Plus, CHCFan noted that Thomas had a bad start to the season - if anything, that hurts his chances of being a better comeback than had he played fine.

CHCfan · 10-07-2006, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scoman

thomas thome
ab 466 490
hits 126 141
runs 77 108
d 11 26
t 0 0
hr 39 42
rbi 114 109
bb 81 107
ba .270 .288
oba .381 .416
slg .545 .598

Thome made the allstar team,thomas didnt,the numbers dont lie,not sure what the big debate is,thome won the award,and should have.

Again though, it's not about how had the better year.

Who had the greater COMEBACK? I still say Thomas. They each were limited/useless last year, but Thomas's struggles existed even the year before. And as someone else said, Thome was the centerpiece of a big trade, Thomas was barely signed to a team. Thomas's COMEBACK, imo, easily makes up for the difference in their numbers this year.

Again, not an off-the-wall awful pick for the award, but I do disagree.

Erik W. · 10-07-2006, 06:07 PM

I can see the arguments for both players.

That said, saying you're going to boycott the 2007 season because the writers chose the "wrong" guy in a close race is ridiculous.

It IS a popularity contest. It always has been, the same as every award that every sport gives out. You should care less about the meaningless awards and just enjoy what Thomas and Thome both did this season.

GoCubsAndJays · 10-07-2006, 06:37 PM

Writers don't vote on it anymore. Fans do.

CHCfan · 10-07-2006, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GoCubsAndJays

Writers don't vote on it anymore. Fans do.

ugghh . . . I hate the fans!!

magnet · 10-07-2006, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Azamien

I can see the arguments for both players.

That said, saying you're going to boycott the 2007 season because the writers chose the "wrong" guy in a close race is ridiculous.

It IS a popularity contest. It always has been, the same as every award that every sport gives out. You should care less about the meaningless awards and just enjoy what Thomas and Thome both did this season.

I guess you are correct; teddy ballgame got completely screwed out of 2 MVP's when he won the Triple Crown.

Arlie Rahn · 10-07-2006, 07:29 PM

Thome:
05 - .207/.360/.352, 193 ABs
06 - .288/.416/.598, 490 ABs

Thomas:
05 - .219/.315/.590, 105 ABs
06 - .270/.381/.545, 466 ABs

Thome had a worse 05 than Thomas, and a better 06. That would make it hard for me to state Thomas had a better comeback than Thome.

magnet · 10-07-2006, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arlie Rahn

Thome:
05 - .207/.360/.352, 193 ABs
06 - .288/.416/.598, 490 ABs

Thomas:
05 - .219/.315/.590, 105 ABs
06 - .270/.381/.545, 466 ABs

Thome had a worse 05 than Thomas, and a better 06. That would make it hard for me to state Thomas had a better comeback than Thome.

And Thome had a far, far better 2004 than Thomas.

Long_Long_Name · 10-07-2006, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by magnet

And Thome had a far, far better 2004 than Thomas.

Thomas' OPS for the past 4 seasons:
.952, .997, .905, .926.

2006 is not even Thomas' best comeback.

magnet · 10-07-2006, 07:50 PM

I'm sorry, but I can't call a 105 AB season with a .905 OPS a good season. He wasn't around to be good!

Long_Long_Name · 10-07-2006, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by magnet

And Thome had a far, far better 2004 than Thomas.

If it were true, wouldn't it make Thome the best candidate? It'sfar from true, though, in rate statistics:

Thome: 274/396/581
Thomas: 271/434/563

JDOldSchool · 10-07-2006, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by magnet

If thomas was just fine the last couple of years, I think he would have made more than $500K this year.

Thomas ended up making about $3.5 mil.

mlyons · 10-07-2006, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by magnet

And Thome had a far, far better 2004 than Thomas.

Not really; he just played more. Thomas had an excellent .271/.434/.562 season (slightly better rate stats than Thome's .274/.396/.581 season). The only problem was that he was out half the season. It's kind of a moot point, though, really, since most people only go back one season when looking at a "comeback".

Long_Long_Name · 10-07-2006, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by magnet

I'm sorry, but I can't call a 105 AB season with a .905 OPS a good season. He wasn't around to be good!

Well then, a comeback player was someone who was merely injured the previous year? Because Thomas hasn't had a bad statistical season since 2001, when he played 20 games.

magnet · 10-07-2006, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Long_Long_Name

Well then, a comeback player was someone who was merely injured the previous year? Because Thomas hasn't had a bad statistical season since 2001, when he played 20 games.

That is who usually wins it, yes. Rate stats to me are pointless if you don't make a starter's contribution to the team, at least when discussing this award.

10-07-2006, 05:26 PM	#25
Scoman All Star Starter Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: heath ohio Posts: 1,830	thomas thome ab 466 490 hits 126 141 runs 77 108 d 11 26 t 0 0 hr 39 42 rbi 114 109 bb 81 107 ba .270 .288 oba .381 .416 slg .545 .598 Thome made the allstar team,thomas didnt,the numbers dont lie,not sure what the big debate is,thome won the award,and should have. Last edited by Scoman; 10-07-2006 at 07:13 PM.

10-07-2006, 05:27 PM	#26
Long_Long_Name Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Montréal Posts: 7,065	I agree with mlyons here - Thomas played fine in the past few years, when he was in shape. Plus, CHCFan noted that Thomas had a bad start to the season - if anything, that hurts his chances of being a better comeback than had he played fine. __________________ Beta Baseball. Join it!

10-07-2006, 06:07 PM	#28
Erik W. Global Moderator Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Rivière-du-Loup, Qc Posts: 4,615	I can see the arguments for both players. That said, saying you're going to boycott the 2007 season because the writers chose the "wrong" guy in a close race is ridiculous. It IS a popularity contest. It always has been, the same as every award that every sport gives out. You should care less about the meaningless awards and just enjoy what Thomas and Thome both did this season. __________________ Free agent baseball fan. Let's go (insert team name here)!

10-07-2006, 07:29 PM	#32
Arlie Rahn All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 564	Thome: 05 - .207/.360/.352, 193 ABs 06 - .288/.416/.598, 490 ABs Thomas: 05 - .219/.315/.590, 105 ABs 06 - .270/.381/.545, 466 ABs Thome had a worse 05 than Thomas, and a better 06. That would make it hard for me to state Thomas had a better comeback than Thome. __________________ Developer of Bowl Bound College Football http://www.greydogsoftware.com

10-07-2006, 05:17 PM	#23
Raidergoo Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Posts: 9,005	Thomas should have been run out of baseball due to the last two seasons full of injuries, and he came back to hit 39 HR's in a masoleum of a stadium. Thome, while having a better season, had less to overcome. The A's were delusional when they took a flyer on Thomas, and it has paid off in spades. Thomas was jobbed.

10-07-2006, 06:37 PM	#29
GoCubsAndJays All Star Reserve Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 839	Writers don't vote on it anymore. Fans do.

10-07-2006, 07:50 PM	#35
magnet Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 5,029	I'm sorry, but I can't call a 105 AB season with a .905 OPS a good season. He wasn't around to be good!