The Draft, Forced Retirements, Reserve Roster and League Age - Page 2

Dark Horse · 07-16-2006, 11:27 PM

sorry we haven't posted before dougation. But this issue is being discussed and looked at. We're trying to settle on the source of the problem. Hopefully, it will be taken care of soon.

JimG · 07-17-2006, 03:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkcloud4579

It's certainly an issue, but I don't think its going to get addressed anytime soon.

Its a huge issue though and hes already gone to the trouble of proposing three possible solutions. All of which would work and at least one cant be that hard to implement. And theres a fourth solution which is to stop putting major-league quality players in the draft unless you are trying to simulate 1877.

dougaiton · 07-17-2006, 05:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dark Horse

sorry we haven't posted before dougation. But this issue is being discussed and looked at. We're trying to settle on the source of the problem. Hopefully, it will be taken care of soon.

No problem at all! Sorry for getting ratty.

thepbl · 07-31-2006, 02:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jordan

I would like to see this worked on. What's the point of having all these new features if they don't work?

Makes the fine folks at SI look good. whats new with this approach? many software companies release broken material assuming they will apologize and fix later.

tysok · 07-31-2006, 11:36 AM

Lower draft rounds might work in this case...
I was looking (lightly mind you) at this type of thing and was told the aging curves are better with less draft rounds, the young guys are pushing the old ones out... the less young guys the less they can push out. Makes sense, I was dealing with 25 rounds, 5 levels of minors.
So I set a new league up, 10 rounds of draft and tried that... within 6 years one of the minor league teams ran out of players. Although there were plenty of pitchers to have filled out every roster of every team with at least 14 pitchers each....

Anyhow... the thing is that if 10 rounds would result normally in (just for instance) 20 players going on to big league careers, then why would 25 rounds result in any more going on to big league careers?

Personally, some work needs to be done that gives a usual number of players that are necessary to replenish the major league teams as players retire. Say, with proper aging curves, that each draft should yield roughly 2 players per ML team that would go on to ML careers. So a 5 round draft is all that's absolutely necessary. But a 5 round draft isn't good enough to maintain anything more than a single level of minors, if that. So you set it for 25 rounds so you have more than enough players to maintain your 5 levels of minor leagues.... that doesn't mean that it should create 10 players per ML team that will go on to ML careers, it just means it creates a bunch more players to help you maintain those leagues.
Right now it seems to be creating more players that will develop into ML careers with each draft round you add... it shouldn't be doing so. If the game is such that a 5 round draft would be the ideal setup for the aging curve, then anything you set it to over 5 rounds should just be creating a bunch of scrubs to help fill out the minor league rosters.

A good point on this would be that the real MLB draft is 50 rounds. If next year they decide to make it 75 rounds instead, that doesn't mean that there will suddenly be more guys that will become ML players... it just means the MLB drafts more guys.

Anyhow, whether that makes sense or not I don't know... kind of a confusing issue on draft rounds.
This issue has been looked into VERY deeply, and the entire aging curve is found wanting. It's a real issue, not just in people's heads, and a TT# has been revived on it.

andymac · 07-31-2006, 12:24 PM

Agreed. The talent in the draft should be created on a bell curve. If there are a lesser number of rounds in the draft, that just means that only the top of the bell curve of players is created. As more rounds are included and more players are created, those extra players should be created with the part of the bell curve that previously wasn't used (i.e. the lower part).

Archangel878 · 08-01-2006, 02:00 PM

I haven't played around much with the game, but I recall there was a setting during setup where you could adjust the rate at which players develop. I even think you could change how fast they decline. Would adjusting these do anything to alleviate what appears to be too many ML-ready prospects in drafts, which in turn seems to be causing forced retirement of middle-aged players? I don't know if adjusting that rate only affects their rate of development or if it would adjust their stage of development at draft-time. If it adjusted their stage of development at the time of the draft, that might alleviate some of the problem.

Just some thoughts. Someone who's played around with it will know much more than I. Anyone looked into this?

07-16-2006, 11:27 PM	#21
Dark Horse Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2002 Location: Texas! Posts: 2,633	sorry we haven't posted before dougation. But this issue is being discussed and looked at. We're trying to settle on the source of the problem. Hopefully, it will be taken care of soon. __________________ A Justafan Fan LBA Geo Bahn Rock Hounds fan of the ISLANDIAN PRO ALLIANCE

07-31-2006, 12:24 PM	#26
andymac Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Effingham, IL Posts: 5,725	Agreed. The talent in the draft should be created on a bell curve. If there are a lesser number of rounds in the draft, that just means that only the top of the bell curve of players is created. As more rounds are included and more players are created, those extra players should be created with the part of the bell curve that previously wasn't used (i.e. the lower part). __________________ June Madness: Links FTB: andymac

07-31-2006, 11:36 AM	#25
tysok Hall Of Famer Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 4,925	Lower draft rounds might work in this case... I was looking (lightly mind you) at this type of thing and was told the aging curves are better with less draft rounds, the young guys are pushing the old ones out... the less young guys the less they can push out. Makes sense, I was dealing with 25 rounds, 5 levels of minors. So I set a new league up, 10 rounds of draft and tried that... within 6 years one of the minor league teams ran out of players. Although there were plenty of pitchers to have filled out every roster of every team with at least 14 pitchers each.... Anyhow... the thing is that if 10 rounds would result normally in (just for instance) 20 players going on to big league careers, then why would 25 rounds result in any more going on to big league careers? Personally, some work needs to be done that gives a usual number of players that are necessary to replenish the major league teams as players retire. Say, with proper aging curves, that each draft should yield roughly 2 players per ML team that would go on to ML careers. So a 5 round draft is all that's absolutely necessary. But a 5 round draft isn't good enough to maintain anything more than a single level of minors, if that. So you set it for 25 rounds so you have more than enough players to maintain your 5 levels of minor leagues.... that doesn't mean that it should create 10 players per ML team that will go on to ML careers, it just means it creates a bunch more players to help you maintain those leagues. Right now it seems to be creating more players that will develop into ML careers with each draft round you add... it shouldn't be doing so. If the game is such that a 5 round draft would be the ideal setup for the aging curve, then anything you set it to over 5 rounds should just be creating a bunch of scrubs to help fill out the minor league rosters. A good point on this would be that the real MLB draft is 50 rounds. If next year they decide to make it 75 rounds instead, that doesn't mean that there will suddenly be more guys that will become ML players... it just means the MLB drafts more guys. Anyhow, whether that makes sense or not I don't know... kind of a confusing issue on draft rounds. This issue has been looked into VERY deeply, and the entire aging curve is found wanting. It's a real issue, not just in people's heads, and a TT# has been revived on it.

08-01-2006, 02:00 PM	#27
Archangel878 Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 23	I haven't played around much with the game, but I recall there was a setting during setup where you could adjust the rate at which players develop. I even think you could change how fast they decline. Would adjusting these do anything to alleviate what appears to be too many ML-ready prospects in drafts, which in turn seems to be causing forced retirement of middle-aged players? I don't know if adjusting that rate only affects their rate of development or if it would adjust their stage of development at draft-time. If it adjusted their stage of development at the time of the draft, that might alleviate some of the problem. Just some thoughts. Someone who's played around with it will know much more than I. Anyone looked into this?