A Good Challenge

Vezna31 · 11-30-2005, 01:16 PM

I recently started a new league, simmed it 10 years with financials on and then took over the worst team. The Detroit Tigers were 64-98 with a fan interest of 17 and -$5m in cash. The San Diego Padres also had the same record, but they had a fan interest of 19, so off to Detroit I went. I was a little bummed since I live in San Diego

The first thing I did was come up with a plan on how to turn it around. Negative cash is a killer...no signing of coaches, free agents, or promotion days. So my first task was to analyze my salaries and revenue. With a fan interest interest of 17, not much attendance or revenue is going to be generated, so I immediately started trading off my top salary guys whom I didn't think were worth the money in exchange for 3-star or better prospects and as much money as I could get. One of the things that killed me was the trading of my total stud LF'er who had hit over .330 with over 30 HR's and had tremendous ratings. But he was making $10M a year which represented 20% of my revenue.

By the time I actually started the season, my highest salary was $798,000 and my total payroll was $15M and had accumulated $5M in cash by the trade deadline to start doing promotion days. I had a bunch of prospects that were going to get plenty of playing time. The season turned out like I expected. I went 52-110, but I made a $35M profit and had the first pick in the draft. My lineup was pretty decent. Most of my hitters had over 50 contact and I think my lowest starting batting average was .268. Where I got killed was pitching and killed even more in the bullpen. I was hoping to get a good SP as the first pick but there were only 2 top SP prospects and I didn't think they were that good, so I went with offense and banked on making a trade or 2 and Spring Training for my pitching prospects to really increase their ratings. Since I know MR's are usually the last to go, I went a little early and secured two 5-star relievers with already decent ratings.

I started out the 2nd season pretty well going 4-1 and quickly started getting shelled dropping to .500. But I am confident that my team can play .500 ball for the whole season. This game rocks!

ctorg · 11-30-2005, 02:20 PM

Playing the turnaround game is one of the most fun ways to play OOTP. You get some worthless mess of a team and turn them into a real contender. I should probably play that way more often. It's more rewarding than my usual practice of sticking with one team. I usually end up with a team that's either the top or one of the top teams every season, once I get them on track.

Vezna31 · 11-30-2005, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctorg

Playing the turnaround game is one of the most fun ways to play OOTP. You get some worthless mess of a team and turn them into a real contender. I should probably play that way more often. It's more rewarding than my usual practice of sticking with one team. I usually end up with a team that's either the top or one of the top teams every season, once I get them on track.

Yeah, I made the change because I have 4 active historical leagues where I win the championship every year. I also have a small fictional league where my team has never won the championship, but have lost in the finals the last 3 years. I also play MD's Texas League, but that is a whole different beast with everything turned off.

chriskelly · 11-30-2005, 02:35 PM

I tried taking a team, releasing all players at pro and AAA, and all AA or A guys over 25. Then, I used the rule 5 draft and free agents to build a team. you really start off with crap that way, and have to be creative.

Vezna31 · 11-30-2005, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chriskelly

I tried taking a team, releasing all players at pro and AAA, and all AA or A guys over 25. Then, I used the rule 5 draft and free agents to build a team. you really start off with crap that way, and have to be creative.

What was your result?

ctorg · 11-30-2005, 02:51 PM

A couple of times now I've used this rather morbid premise:

An entire team and their manager dies in a tragic, fiery plane crash. I am a new manager taking over the team, which is left with only its minor leaguers and some money to spend on free agents.

What I've found is that it's actually easier to build a good team this way than it is by taking over a bad team. Or at least it's faster. No commitments to bad players.

chriskelly · 11-30-2005, 03:07 PM

My results were in line with what CTORG said. that first year, you'll lose 110 games. and...you'll constantly try to deal older talent for prospects. Your fan approval will suck, so you'll look for popular guys on the wire just to sit them on the bench. Within 3 years or so, you can probably have a young team built thru draft and free agency.

one fun way to do it is to build your orig roster, then backup and sim year 1.
Then, play out year 1 and try to win 10 more games than the AI did.

jcurtis423 · 11-30-2005, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vezna31

I recently started a new league, simmed it 10 years with financials on and then took over the worst team. The Detroit Tigers were 64-98 with a fan interest of 17 and -$5m in cash. The San Diego Padres also had the same record, but they had a fan interest of 19, so off to Detroit I went. I was a little bummed since I live in San Diego

The first thing I did was come up with a plan on how to turn it around. Negative cash is a killer...no signing of coaches, free agents, or promotion days. So my first task was to analyze my salaries and revenue. With a fan interest interest of 17, not much attendance or revenue is going to be generated, so I immediately started trading off my top salary guys whom I didn't think were worth the money in exchange for 3-star or better prospects and as much money as I could get. One of the things that killed me was the trading of my total stud LF'er who had hit over .330 with over 30 HR's and had tremendous ratings. But he was making $10M a year which represented 20% of my revenue.

By the time I actually started the season, my highest salary was $798,000 and my total payroll was $15M and had accumulated $5M in cash by the trade deadline to start doing promotion days. I had a bunch of prospects that were going to get plenty of playing time. The season turned out like I expected. I went 52-110, but I made a $35M profit and had the first pick in the draft. My lineup was pretty decent. Most of my hitters had over 50 contact and I think my lowest starting batting average was .268. Where I got killed was pitching and killed even more in the bullpen. I was hoping to get a good SP as the first pick but there were only 2 top SP prospects and I didn't think they were that good, so I went with offense and banked on making a trade or 2 and Spring Training for my pitching prospects to really increase their ratings. Since I know MR's are usually the last to go, I went a little early and secured two 5-star relievers with already decent ratings.

I started out the 2nd season pretty well going 4-1 and quickly started getting shelled dropping to .500. But I am confident that my team can play .500 ball for the whole season. This game rocks!

are you playing out each game with this league or are you simming it slowly now that you've taken over the Tigers? if so how many games do you generally sim at a time before checking things over? Although I mainly play in online leagues, I've been trying to get a rhythm going with simming out a solo league, but I just can't decide how quickly or slowly I want to get through it.

bp_ · 11-30-2005, 04:09 PM

You can find bad teams like these in online leagues. I think it can be even more of a challenge to rebuild there as it is more work to trade when you have to get in contact with other real people to strike up a deal. The process can be a little agonizing as you have to wait through a sim season but I do a lot of waiver wire grabbing and scouring the FA list for potential minor league FAs and press on. I love it!

jcurtis423 · 11-30-2005, 04:25 PM

I have taken over some really ugly teams in some online leagues. It is quite a bit of fun to get them turned around. You just have to have patience and be able to appreciate those seasons when you've got a bunch of guys who should probably be on the bench or in AAA in your starting lineup.

It is easy to find teams in bad shape in online leagues due to them likely being available because the previous owner was negligent or didn't pay any attention!

Vezna31 · 11-30-2005, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcurtis423

are you playing out each game with this league or are you simming it slowly now that you've taken over the Tigers? if so how many games do you generally sim at a time before checking things over? Although I mainly play in online leagues, I've been trying to get a rhythm going with simming out a solo league, but I just can't decide how quickly or slowly I want to get through it.

I play out each game, although I did sim most of the month of September one day at a time to see if the AI could get a few more wins than I was getting. I was playing out the games with my #1 SP who is a 5-star prospect. It is really frustrating when you are up 5 or 6 runs and having a good game and then either your SP blows up or your bullpen gets blasted for 7 runs in the late innings and lose the game by a run.

Comedian2004 · 11-30-2005, 05:10 PM

I went the traditional route and took a last place team (also the Tigers), and turned them around the same way you did and I did make the playoffs the next year. As I expected, they blew me away in post season. The next season I had to battle from 11 games back to move within 4 games of the lead and end up missing the WC by 1 friggin game!

Try the ultimate challenge. No ratings, no coaches, game play set to hard and the MONITOR OFF!

jcurtis423 · 11-30-2005, 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comedian2004

Try the ultimate challenge. No ratings, no coaches, game play set to hard and the MONITOR OFF!

That would make things rather difficult now, wouldn't it?

ublguy · 12-02-2005, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vezna31

I recently started a new league, simmed it 10 years with financials on and then took over the worst team. The Detroit Tigers were 64-98 with a fan interest of 17 and -$5m in cash. The San Diego Padres also had the same record, but they had a fan interest of 19, so off to Detroit I went. I was a little bummed since I live in San Diego

The first thing I did was come up with a plan on how to turn it around. Negative cash is a killer...no signing of coaches, free agents, or promotion days. So my first task was to analyze my salaries and revenue. With a fan interest interest of 17, not much attendance or revenue is going to be generated, so I immediately started trading off my top salary guys whom I didn't think were worth the money in exchange for 3-star or better prospects and as much money as I could get. One of the things that killed me was the trading of my total stud LF'er who had hit over .330 with over 30 HR's and had tremendous ratings. But he was making $10M a year which represented 20% of my revenue.

By the time I actually started the season, my highest salary was $798,000 and my total payroll was $15M and had accumulated $5M in cash by the trade deadline to start doing promotion days. I had a bunch of prospects that were going to get plenty of playing time. The season turned out like I expected. I went 52-110, but I made a $35M profit and had the first pick in the draft. My lineup was pretty decent. Most of my hitters had over 50 contact and I think my lowest starting batting average was .268. Where I got killed was pitching and killed even more in the bullpen. I was hoping to get a good SP as the first pick but there were only 2 top SP prospects and I didn't think they were that good, so I went with offense and banked on making a trade or 2 and Spring Training for my pitching prospects to really increase their ratings. Since I know MR's are usually the last to go, I went a little early and secured two 5-star relievers with already decent ratings.

I started out the 2nd season pretty well going 4-1 and quickly started getting shelled dropping to .500. But I am confident that my team can play .500 ball for the whole season. This game rocks!

I liked this idea so much - I decided to give it a try: After 20 years, Tampa Bay was the worse team. The main problem I have right now, I have a player who is a little past his prime making 35 million per year for the next three seasons. He is paid 8 million more than the next, and 11 million more than the 3rd most.

Thanks again for this great idea!

Vezna31 · 12-02-2005, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ublguy

I liked this idea so much - I decided to give it a try: After 20 years, Tampa Bay was the worse team. The main problem I have right now, I have a player who is a little past his prime making 35 million per year for the next three seasons. He is paid 8 million more than the next, and 11 million more than the 3rd most.

Thanks again for this great idea!

That would have been the first player I got rid of. You most likely will not get any young, good prospect for him because of his age and salary. You may not even get many offers because some teams won't be able to afford his contract. Your best bet is one of two things: Shop the player and see if anyone offers anything decent. You can trade for the best offered and try to get some money or simply put him on waiverw and le some poor schlep AI claim him and take over the huge salary.

ublguy · 12-02-2005, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vezna31

That would have been the first player I got rid of. You most likely will not get any young, good prospect for him because of his age and salary. You may not even get many offers because some teams won't be able to afford his contract. Your best bet is one of two things: Shop the player and see if anyone offers anything decent. You can trade for the best offered and try to get some money or simply put him on waiverw and le some poor schlep AI claim him and take over the huge salary.

Good thinking about the waiver wire, didn't think of that. I did some research: 1 team has 30 mil in cap space, and 2 in 20+ mil.

But I agree, he is the first to go, I didn't take over as the GB until opening day, so my scouts really bad.

Lastly, I wonder if I have the worst average post per day from all members, 20 posts in 3 years

ctorg · 12-02-2005, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ublguy

Lastly, I wonder if I have the worst average post per day from all members, 20 posts in 3 years

Well, you have more posts than ria, and she's been here for a while.

Comedian2004 · 12-02-2005, 02:43 PM

Yea, it does make it hard to play. I am currently still stick on the CONTINUE LEAGUE screen, but I know I am getting closer to that button.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcurtis423

That would make things rather difficult now, wouldn't it?

Vezna31 · 12-02-2005, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Comedian2004

Yea, it does make it hard to play. I am currently still stick on the CONTINUE LEAGUE screen, but I know I am getting closer to that button.

You should get yourself to the game screen and then shut the monitor off and just keep hitting 1 or 2 or 3 and then after 10 or 15 minutes, turn on the monitor and see if you've finished the game

Mike Donlin · 12-02-2005, 03:41 PM

I just did this after a very succesful run with another league where my team became just too dominant. However, I have adopted a house rule from that other league, which limits me to two trades per year: one following free agency and another at the deadline.

I'm thinking of moving to three trades every two years. It is more realistic that way. MLB teams, even bad ones, do not trade nearly as frequently as most GMs do in the wheeling and dealing OOTP.

(Edit: Except the Marlins--but that would seem to be the exception that proves the rule.)

11-30-2005, 02:20 PM	#2
ctorg Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 9,848	Playing the turnaround game is one of the most fun ways to play OOTP. You get some worthless mess of a team and turn them into a real contender. I should probably play that way more often. It's more rewarding than my usual practice of sticking with one team. I usually end up with a team that's either the top or one of the top teams every season, once I get them on track. __________________ My music "When the trees blow back and forth, that's what makes the wind." - Steven Wright Fjord emena pancreas thorax fornicate marmalade morpheme proteolysis smaxa cabana offal srue vitriol grope hallelujah lentils

11-30-2005, 02:35 PM	#4
chriskelly All Star Reserve Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 753	another fun way to do it I tried taking a team, releasing all players at pro and AAA, and all AA or A guys over 25. Then, I used the rule 5 draft and free agents to build a team. you really start off with crap that way, and have to be creative.

11-30-2005, 02:51 PM	#6
ctorg Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 9,848	A couple of times now I've used this rather morbid premise: An entire team and their manager dies in a tragic, fiery plane crash. I am a new manager taking over the team, which is left with only its minor leaguers and some money to spend on free agents. What I've found is that it's actually easier to build a good team this way than it is by taking over a bad team. Or at least it's faster. No commitments to bad players. __________________ My music "When the trees blow back and forth, that's what makes the wind." - Steven Wright Fjord emena pancreas thorax fornicate marmalade morpheme proteolysis smaxa cabana offal srue vitriol grope hallelujah lentils

11-30-2005, 04:09 PM	#9
bp_ Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: New York, NY Posts: 2,804	You can find bad teams like these in online leagues. I think it can be even more of a challenge to rebuild there as it is more work to trade when you have to get in contact with other real people to strike up a deal. The process can be a little agonizing as you have to wait through a sim season but I do a lot of waiver wire grabbing and scouring the FA list for potential minor league FAs and press on. I love it! __________________ Commish: Over The Mound

11-30-2005, 05:10 PM	#12
Comedian2004 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: In a house in Saint Cloud, Florida. Posts: 7,085	I went the traditional route and took a last place team (also the Tigers), and turned them around the same way you did and I did make the playoffs the next year. As I expected, they blew me away in post season. The next season I had to battle from 11 games back to move within 4 games of the lead and end up missing the WC by 1 friggin game! Try the ultimate challenge. No ratings, no coaches, game play set to hard and the MONITOR OFF! __________________ Like BLUES? Visit www.smokestacklightnin.com, you will LOVE it! New show every Monday!! New Blues HOF![/COLOR][/FONT]

11-30-2005, 01:16 PM	#1
Vezna31 All Star Starter Join Date: May 2004 Location: Wherever My VPN says Posts: 1,986	A Good Challenge I recently started a new league, simmed it 10 years with financials on and then took over the worst team. The Detroit Tigers were 64-98 with a fan interest of 17 and -$5m in cash. The San Diego Padres also had the same record, but they had a fan interest of 19, so off to Detroit I went. I was a little bummed since I live in San Diego The first thing I did was come up with a plan on how to turn it around. Negative cash is a killer...no signing of coaches, free agents, or promotion days. So my first task was to analyze my salaries and revenue. With a fan interest interest of 17, not much attendance or revenue is going to be generated, so I immediately started trading off my top salary guys whom I didn't think were worth the money in exchange for 3-star or better prospects and as much money as I could get. One of the things that killed me was the trading of my total stud LF'er who had hit over .330 with over 30 HR's and had tremendous ratings. But he was making $10M a year which represented 20% of my revenue. By the time I actually started the season, my highest salary was $798,000 and my total payroll was $15M and had accumulated $5M in cash by the trade deadline to start doing promotion days. I had a bunch of prospects that were going to get plenty of playing time. The season turned out like I expected. I went 52-110, but I made a $35M profit and had the first pick in the draft. My lineup was pretty decent. Most of my hitters had over 50 contact and I think my lowest starting batting average was .268. Where I got killed was pitching and killed even more in the bullpen. I was hoping to get a good SP as the first pick but there were only 2 top SP prospects and I didn't think they were that good, so I went with offense and banked on making a trade or 2 and Spring Training for my pitching prospects to really increase their ratings. Since I know MR's are usually the last to go, I went a little early and secured two 5-star relievers with already decent ratings. I started out the 2nd season pretty well going 4-1 and quickly started getting shelled dropping to .500. But I am confident that my team can play .500 ball for the whole season. This game rocks! __________________ Owner/Operator - Vezna Financial Services - Accounting and taxes. Last edited by Vezna31; 11-30-2005 at 01:19 PM.

11-30-2005, 03:07 PM	#7
chriskelly All Star Reserve Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 753	My results were in line with what CTORG said. that first year, you'll lose 110 games. and...you'll constantly try to deal older talent for prospects. Your fan approval will suck, so you'll look for popular guys on the wire just to sit them on the bench. Within 3 years or so, you can probably have a young team built thru draft and free agency. one fun way to do it is to build your orig roster, then backup and sim year 1. Then, play out year 1 and try to win 10 more games than the AI did.

11-30-2005, 04:25 PM	#10
jcurtis423 Banned Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 57	I have taken over some really ugly teams in some online leagues. It is quite a bit of fun to get them turned around. You just have to have patience and be able to appreciate those seasons when you've got a bunch of guys who should probably be on the bench or in AAA in your starting lineup. It is easy to find teams in bad shape in online leagues due to them likely being available because the previous owner was negligent or didn't pay any attention!

12-02-2005, 03:41 PM	#20
Mike Donlin All Star Reserve Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Life, friends, is boring. Posts: 840	I just did this after a very succesful run with another league where my team became just too dominant. However, I have adopted a house rule from that other league, which limits me to two trades per year: one following free agency and another at the deadline. I'm thinking of moving to three trades every two years. It is more realistic that way. MLB teams, even bad ones, do not trade nearly as frequently as most GMs do in the wheeling and dealing OOTP. (Edit: Except the Marlins--but that would seem to be the exception that proves the rule.)