Interest in an Owner-GM league?

darkcloud4579 · 11-20-2007, 09:46 PM

I'm either interested in joining or starting a league that has an owner/GM setup. Meaning that there is a team owner, who has his or her own goal for owning the team -- profitability, ego, pride or whatever else -- and then a GM whose goal, of course, is to win titles.

If it were a league we were starting, I could see it being small (8-10 teams) that plays a pretty consistent schedule and with reliable folks who are really interested in the concept and making it work.

We could use real players or not, I'm not married to either..though I imagine in this sort of setup that real players could be more interesting.

I have web space and lots of OOTP experience as a solo player and dedication isn't an issue (for me, because I actually want to play OOTP against other people now)..it's about being immersed enough to carry on, really.

If such a league is out there, I don't want to reinvent the wheel, let me know and I'll check out your site.

Thanks.

~DC

edddgar · 11-20-2007, 09:55 PM

I, like the agent idea, like the idea. I love the idea of having the highest possible amount of interaction of humans as possible in OOTP. I'd be interested in for sure and could assist in any way needed if you want to go along with it.

If you need any help putting it together or are just looking for owners/GMs, I'd be interested either way.

darkcloud4579 · 11-20-2007, 10:37 PM

Well, my thinking with this is that it gets boring with just having an owner talking to another owner or whatever. But that it would be cool to add a level of human interaction into it where you have two people. I mean, you could have situations where it "seems" like a power struggle, where a GM gets fired because an owner is a meglomaniac and other guys woo him to their side offering said person more control, a bigger budget or whatever.

With the financial model I devised and have tweaked a ton (more than what's on the form for download currently) it would be easy to create a realistic system for dealing with league finances, too.

So...that'd be taken care of.

I mean, you could even get it down to the point where we have an owner, a GM and human managers running the ballclub. It would be kinda crazy, but..I think it could be an interesting way to do things and more 'realistic' than the one-stop shopping model.

Though I see the potential pitfalls of a model like this too. So that's why I suggested just GM/Owner.

I'm intriuged by the idea..but would need to see if there is more interest before plunging forward. But it seems doable.

edddgar · 11-20-2007, 10:49 PM

Agreed on all accounts. This really gives everyone involved a chance to get deep into league, developing friendships and rivalries. If you find the right number of participants, it could be awesome. If you go too small, you run the risk of it getting to bland and if you go to large you can get deadbeat participants.

I like the idea of leaving a possibility of agents as well, but I think there'll be enough to do before it gets to that. As for the idea of field manager, I'd wait and see with that and maybe a few seasons in let some teams test drive it and see if it works. I love the ideas and you count me in for whatever you need with the idea. If we can get a bunch of guys that can get deep into this, it'll be a lot of fun for everyone.

darkcloud4579 · 11-20-2007, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edddgar

Agreed on all accounts. This really gives everyone involved a chance to get deep into league, developing friendships and rivalries. If you find the right number of participants, it could be awesome. If you go too small, you run the risk of it getting to bland and if you go to large you can get deadbeat participants.

I like the idea of leaving a possibility of agents as well, but I think there'll be enough to do before it gets to that. As for the idea of field manager, I'd wait and see with that and maybe a few seasons in let some teams test drive it and see if it works. I love the ideas and you count me in for whatever you need with the idea. If we can get a bunch of guys that can get deep into this, it'll be a lot of fun for everyone.

Yeah, I was just thinking owner-GM to start. And you're right about the number of teams and creating appropriate rivalries and such alike. 8-12 teams is a good number, because then you have enough space for newbs, without it being so huge that it's like a train station.

Probably be best to start off with 8 to get things going and work out the kinks and then once there is a successful season or two, do an expansion draft and let others in.

It's an exciting concept...just talking about it. I think I'll set the gears in motion.

edddgar · 11-20-2007, 11:21 PM

Yeah, eight is a good round number to start, not over the top, but not too few either. Anytime you need anything from me for it, PM me or something, I'll be more than happy to help and am definitely interested in the idea.

DWK · 11-21-2007, 06:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edddgar

Agreed on all accounts. This really gives everyone involved a chance to get deep into league, developing friendships and rivalries. If you find the right number of participants, it could be awesome. If you go too small, you run the risk of it getting to bland and if you go to large you can get deadbeat participants.

This sounds like a great idea but you do need the right people so they stay involved. If your looking for players count me in

statfreak · 11-21-2007, 12:57 PM

what happens if a human owner fires his human GM? Is the GM just out of the league then (assuming there are no openings and no one else is interested in hiring him)? Seems kind of crappy to invest a significant amount of time as GM only to be fired by the owner for whatever reason with no recourse or possible further involvement in the league.

Also, what would the owner due other than assign a budget and tell the GM what to do?

Just seeking answers, not trying to poke holes.

darkcloud4579 · 11-21-2007, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by statfreak

what happens if a human owner fires his human GM? Is the GM just out of the league then (assuming there are no openings and no one else is interested in hiring him)? Seems kind of crappy to invest a significant amount of time as GM only to be fired by the owner for whatever reason with no recourse or possible further involvement in the league.

Also, what would the owner due other than assign a budget and tell the GM what to do?

Just seeking answers, not trying to poke holes.

No, it's a good thing. All stuff to think about actively..

If the human GM is fired before his or her contract ends, we'd assess a penalty on the owner, to deter such silliness. After all, we're not making millions here. Building that into the model would be easy.

We could assign the GM to a gig in the commissioner's office for the rest of that season or find some other suitable way for them to stay involved, even as a "consultant" to other teams. In other words, giving away trade secrets.

Umm...the owners roles would vary. In some situations, I could see the owner and GM as two friends who want to be in a league, but don't have significant time to commit and plus, it'd be fun to have someone who knows your team like you do, etc.

In other scenarios, I could see the owner as the one who keeps the financial ship sailing. Other owners could offer GMs with partial ownership, veto rights, full control or other such things to entice them to stay on and do well.

And we can also set the rules up so that successful GMs get right of first refusal to own their own ballclubs. So rather than a waiting list, there is a direct path to being able to be an owner in the league.

And of course, another idea would be to force real or derelict owners to 'sell' their teams if they're not actively involved throughout the year.

I could see the owner as the PR arm of the operation. Writing releases in the forum, ensuring the team is being "marketed" well with financial incentives for doing so, etc., while the GM has the day-to-day operations in tow.

This is stuff to talk about. I just think it could be a potentially fun/interesting model, but like with any league...there are possible pitfalls and things that might not work.

But I think if you get the right group together, its doable and could work.

For me, the idea was having something where you could interact with someone in game life about your team. Because most online teams don't have "fans" per se and so, it's just you against the other owners. Sure that works, but it'd be fun to have someone else on board for the ride.

And if an owner was a rouge, no one would want to work for him and he'd have to do his owner duties, as well as run the team...and we'll make that intentionally difficult to do over a period of time, to deter people from trying to do that.

But all of this is negotiable. It's just an idea to me at this point...but I'm glad there is preliminary interest.

Anyone else?

statfreak · 11-21-2007, 01:56 PM

well, depending on the league rules, I may be interested in participating. Looking forward to hearing more.

JB1983 · 11-22-2007, 12:02 PM

When would it start and how would you choose who is owner and who is GM? I am interested in this idea!

bordercats · 11-22-2007, 03:58 PM

I like this idea count me in when you get started ( although Im fairly new at ootp) I would like to give it a shot

lloydbentsen · 11-23-2007, 03:48 AM

This sounds like a nice endeavor!

Is there a way to provide an incentive for an owner to make money?

darkcloud4579 · 11-23-2007, 09:29 AM

Certainly. We'll need to hammer out details a bit more, but yes...there is surely a way to provide the owner an incentive to want to make money. I'll need to take a look at the financial model a bit, but I think so.

adunner3 · 11-23-2007, 01:26 PM

i am somewhat new to ootp and i would love to join this league or help out if possible i am very in depth with the leauge im in now. i would like to hear more as well

darkcloud4579 · 11-30-2007, 08:38 PM

I'm tempted to try to get this up and running before the holidays, so we can go through and start playing a bit when people might have a little downtime and work out the kinks.

But something labour intensive might be hard to sustain. I'll spend this weekend trying to mapping some pre-constitutional ideas and see if we can't get going from there.

edddgar · 11-30-2007, 09:21 PM

Alright, sounds good, I don't think anyone would blame you for some early minor kinks, this is certainly not an easy project to do, especially on your own. Again, let me know if you need any help with anything and I'm very excited to see what you've got planned.

darkcloud4579 · 12-26-2007, 05:54 PM

I changed my mind about this. It's not so much a bad idea as much as, I think it would make playing online even harder or more annoying than it can already be. I do intend to start a league though and I'll post the information in the next day or so on another thread.

It'll use my financial system and we'll try to make it more "real world" to some degree...I haven't settled upon a roster set yet...but that'll be next and I'm half tempted to start in 1994 and going from there.

11-20-2007, 09:46 PM	#1
darkcloud4579 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 8,688	Interest in an Owner-GM league? I'm either interested in joining or starting a league that has an owner/GM setup. Meaning that there is a team owner, who has his or her own goal for owning the team -- profitability, ego, pride or whatever else -- and then a GM whose goal, of course, is to win titles. If it were a league we were starting, I could see it being small (8-10 teams) that plays a pretty consistent schedule and with reliable folks who are really interested in the concept and making it work. We could use real players or not, I'm not married to either..though I imagine in this sort of setup that real players could be more interesting. I have web space and lots of OOTP experience as a solo player and dedication isn't an issue (for me, because I actually want to play OOTP against other people now)..it's about being immersed enough to carry on, really. If such a league is out there, I don't want to reinvent the wheel, let me know and I'll check out your site. Thanks. ~DC __________________ ------ My Mods OOTP Advanced Stats & DFS Suite Managerial Strategy Pack Competitive Balance Tax Calculator Major League Women's Baseball (OOTP24) quickstart Indian Premier League \| 300+ years of baseball quickstart \| Expatriate League quickstart \| Off-Field Injuries Update \| Women's Name File for OOTP \| ---- Dynasty classics: Centurion comes to OOTP5 \| DC Moneyball Dynasty (2004)

11-21-2007, 12:57 PM	#8
statfreak Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 2,434	what happens if a human owner fires his human GM? Is the GM just out of the league then (assuming there are no openings and no one else is interested in hiring him)? Seems kind of crappy to invest a significant amount of time as GM only to be fired by the owner for whatever reason with no recourse or possible further involvement in the league. Also, what would the owner due other than assign a budget and tell the GM what to do? Just seeking answers, not trying to poke holes. __________________ Roll out the barrel!

11-21-2007, 01:56 PM	#10
statfreak Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 2,434	well, depending on the league rules, I may be interested in participating. Looking forward to hearing more. __________________ Roll out the barrel!

11-22-2007, 03:58 PM	#12
bordercats Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Thunder Bay, Ont Canada Posts: 24	owner/gm league I like this idea count me in when you get started ( although Im fairly new at ootp) I would like to give it a shot

11-23-2007, 09:29 AM	#14
darkcloud4579 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 8,688	Certainly. We'll need to hammer out details a bit more, but yes...there is surely a way to provide the owner an incentive to want to make money. I'll need to take a look at the financial model a bit, but I think so. __________________ ------ My Mods OOTP Advanced Stats & DFS Suite Managerial Strategy Pack Competitive Balance Tax Calculator Major League Women's Baseball (OOTP24) quickstart Indian Premier League \| 300+ years of baseball quickstart \| Expatriate League quickstart \| Off-Field Injuries Update \| Women's Name File for OOTP \| ---- Dynasty classics: Centurion comes to OOTP5 \| DC Moneyball Dynasty (2004)

11-20-2007, 09:55 PM	#2
edddgar Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 254	I, like the agent idea, like the idea. I love the idea of having the highest possible amount of interaction of humans as possible in OOTP. I'd be interested in for sure and could assist in any way needed if you want to go along with it. If you need any help putting it together or are just looking for owners/GMs, I'd be interested either way.

11-20-2007, 10:37 PM	#3
darkcloud4579 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 8,688	Well, my thinking with this is that it gets boring with just having an owner talking to another owner or whatever. But that it would be cool to add a level of human interaction into it where you have two people. I mean, you could have situations where it "seems" like a power struggle, where a GM gets fired because an owner is a meglomaniac and other guys woo him to their side offering said person more control, a bigger budget or whatever. With the financial model I devised and have tweaked a ton (more than what's on the form for download currently) it would be easy to create a realistic system for dealing with league finances, too. So...that'd be taken care of. I mean, you could even get it down to the point where we have an owner, a GM and human managers running the ballclub. It would be kinda crazy, but..I think it could be an interesting way to do things and more 'realistic' than the one-stop shopping model. Though I see the potential pitfalls of a model like this too. So that's why I suggested just GM/Owner. I'm intriuged by the idea..but would need to see if there is more interest before plunging forward. But it seems doable.

11-20-2007, 10:49 PM	#4
edddgar Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 254	Agreed on all accounts. This really gives everyone involved a chance to get deep into league, developing friendships and rivalries. If you find the right number of participants, it could be awesome. If you go too small, you run the risk of it getting to bland and if you go to large you can get deadbeat participants. I like the idea of leaving a possibility of agents as well, but I think there'll be enough to do before it gets to that. As for the idea of field manager, I'd wait and see with that and maybe a few seasons in let some teams test drive it and see if it works. I love the ideas and you count me in for whatever you need with the idea. If we can get a bunch of guys that can get deep into this, it'll be a lot of fun for everyone.

11-20-2007, 11:21 PM	#6
edddgar Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 254	Yeah, eight is a good round number to start, not over the top, but not too few either. Anytime you need anything from me for it, PM me or something, I'll be more than happy to help and am definitely interested in the idea.

11-22-2007, 12:02 PM	#11
JB1983 Bat Boy Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 12	When would it start and how would you choose who is owner and who is GM? I am interested in this idea!

11-23-2007, 03:48 AM	#13
lloydbentsen Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 146	This sounds like a nice endeavor! Is there a way to provide an incentive for an owner to make money?

11-23-2007, 01:26 PM	#15
adunner3 Bat Boy Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 16	i am somewhat new to ootp and i would love to join this league or help out if possible i am very in depth with the leauge im in now. i would like to hear more as well

11-30-2007, 08:38 PM	#16
darkcloud4579 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 8,688	I'm tempted to try to get this up and running before the holidays, so we can go through and start playing a bit when people might have a little downtime and work out the kinks. But something labour intensive might be hard to sustain. I'll spend this weekend trying to mapping some pre-constitutional ideas and see if we can't get going from there. __________________ ------ My Mods OOTP Advanced Stats & DFS Suite Managerial Strategy Pack Competitive Balance Tax Calculator Major League Women's Baseball (OOTP24) quickstart Indian Premier League \| 300+ years of baseball quickstart \| Expatriate League quickstart \| Off-Field Injuries Update \| Women's Name File for OOTP \| ---- Dynasty classics: Centurion comes to OOTP5 \| DC Moneyball Dynasty (2004)

11-30-2007, 09:21 PM	#17
edddgar Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 254	Alright, sounds good, I don't think anyone would blame you for some early minor kinks, this is certainly not an easy project to do, especially on your own. Again, let me know if you need any help with anything and I'm very excited to see what you've got planned.

12-26-2007, 05:54 PM	#18
darkcloud4579 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 8,688	I changed my mind about this. It's not so much a bad idea as much as, I think it would make playing online even harder or more annoying than it can already be. I do intend to start a league though and I'll post the information in the next day or so on another thread. It'll use my financial system and we'll try to make it more "real world" to some degree...I haven't settled upon a roster set yet...but that'll be next and I'm half tempted to start in 1994 and going from there. __________________ ------ My Mods OOTP Advanced Stats & DFS Suite Managerial Strategy Pack Competitive Balance Tax Calculator Major League Women's Baseball (OOTP24) quickstart Indian Premier League \| 300+ years of baseball quickstart \| Expatriate League quickstart \| Off-Field Injuries Update \| Women's Name File for OOTP \| ---- Dynasty classics: Centurion comes to OOTP5 \| DC Moneyball Dynasty (2004)