Historical BABIP

Reed · 07-19-2021, 07:29 AM

This may or may not be a bug.
Playing using 1980 stats and at start of season under the stats and AI tab the BABIP is .290 but in real life it is .287. Actionjackson a couple years ago also mentioned the OOTP BABIP where higher than real life for the year he was using.
I very well could be missing something but thought I should mention this just in case.
Thanks.

1991Twins · 07-19-2021, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reed

This may or may not be a bug.
Playing using 1980 stats and at start of season under the stats and AI tab the BABIP is .290 but in real life it is .287. Actionjackson a couple years ago also mentioned the OOTP BABIP where higher than real life for the year he was using.
I very well could be missing something but thought I should mention this just in case.
Thanks.

I have noticed this too.....After reading the Actionjackson post a few years back, I have always changed it to the real BABIP to try to keep historic numbers from running too "hot". Curious as to why the number is different as well. I saw a post today from Vegas Vic that indicated that potentially OOTP does not use sacrafice flies in their calculation of BABIP. Following this thread for sure!

Vegas Vic · 07-19-2021, 10:39 PM

I have verified that the OOTP league totals do not include sacrifice flies in the calculations for their historical BABIP's, nor in the OBP calculation shown on the slash line. I don't know if this is a bug, or if it is intentionally designed this way for some reason. I'm hoping that the developers can weigh in on this.

Lukas Berger · 07-20-2021, 03:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vegas Vic

I have verified that the OOTP league totals do not include sacrifice flies in the calculations for their historical BABIP's, nor in the OBP calculation shown on the slash line. I don't know if this is a bug, or if it is intentionally designed this way for some reason. I'm hoping that the developers can weigh in on this.

I do not know for a fact in this specific case, but I would guess it's intentional. There are quite a few things in game we intentionally calculate differently than other sources do (GB%, WAR etc, etc) for one reason or another.

Reed · 07-20-2021, 06:30 AM

Thanks for all the replies. I figured it was probably something I was missing and it sounds like that is the case.

Vegas Vic · 07-20-2021, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lukas Berger

I do not know for a fact in this specific case, but I would guess it's intentional. There are quite a few things in game we intentionally calculate differently than other sources do (GB%, WAR etc, etc) for one reason or another.

Just to be clear, I didn't mean to say that OOTP incorrectly calculates OBP and BABIP in the stats that are output as the games are played out. These are accurate.

However, on the Stats & AI screen that generates the modifiers for a particular season, OOTP does not include sacrifice flies in these calculations. If you look at the slash lines for a particular season, the batting average and slugging percentage will be correct, but the OBP will not match the historical value because it doesn't include sacrifice flies. Likewise with the BABIP.

Vegas Vic · 07-21-2021, 11:53 AM

I was thinking about what Lukas said, and I think I figured out why OOTP does it this way.

Notice that all of the stats that are input under "League Totals" are things that can occur with every plate appearance (hits, doubles, triples, home runs, BB, HBP and strikeouts). Sacrifice flies do not fall under this category, because they cannot occur with every plate appearance. They are dependent on (a) having a runner on base, and (b) having less than two outs. So it makes sense that OOTP handles this mix in the lower portion of the modifiers, along with some of the other situations that cannot occur with every plate appearance (stolen bases, ground into double play, outfield assist, etc).

Syd Thrift · 07-21-2021, 12:07 PM

Perhaps more importantly, sacrifice flies weren’t tracked until 1950 and so if you didn’t take that into account there would be a little bump in BABIP for that year which doesn’t actually track with real life.

Vegas Vic · 07-21-2021, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

Perhaps more importantly, sacrifice flies weren’t tracked until 1950 and so if you didn’t take that into account there would be a little bump in BABIP for that year which doesn’t actually track with real life.

Good point. The only remaining question I have is it better to enter the “correct” BABIP for the 1950 and beyond seasons, or is the game designed to output stats that already take this into account? If so, we might make the output more skewed by entering the correct BABIP.

07-19-2021, 07:29 AM	#1
Reed Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 2,659	Historical BABIP This may or may not be a bug. Playing using 1980 stats and at start of season under the stats and AI tab the BABIP is .290 but in real life it is .287. Actionjackson a couple years ago also mentioned the OOTP BABIP where higher than real life for the year he was using. I very well could be missing something but thought I should mention this just in case. Thanks.

07-19-2021, 10:39 PM	#3
Vegas Vic Minors (Double A) Join Date: Feb 2020 Location: Palm Coast, FL Posts: 166	I have verified that the OOTP league totals do not include sacrifice flies in the calculations for their historical BABIP's, nor in the OBP calculation shown on the slash line. I don't know if this is a bug, or if it is intentionally designed this way for some reason. I'm hoping that the developers can weigh in on this. __________________ "We’ll pop the top on a cold beverage and get back to work tomorrow.” - Satonori Tanioka, Rookie of the Year, 10 times League MVP, 15 Silver Slugger Awards, 17 times All Star selection.

07-21-2021, 11:53 AM	#7
Vegas Vic Minors (Double A) Join Date: Feb 2020 Location: Palm Coast, FL Posts: 166	I was thinking about what Lukas said, and I think I figured out why OOTP does it this way. Notice that all of the stats that are input under "League Totals" are things that can occur with every plate appearance (hits, doubles, triples, home runs, BB, HBP and strikeouts). Sacrifice flies do not fall under this category, because they cannot occur with every plate appearance. They are dependent on (a) having a runner on base, and (b) having less than two outs. So it makes sense that OOTP handles this mix in the lower portion of the modifiers, along with some of the other situations that cannot occur with every plate appearance (stolen bases, ground into double play, outfield assist, etc). __________________ "We’ll pop the top on a cold beverage and get back to work tomorrow.” - Satonori Tanioka, Rookie of the Year, 10 times League MVP, 15 Silver Slugger Awards, 17 times All Star selection. Last edited by Vegas Vic; 07-21-2021 at 11:59 AM.

07-20-2021, 06:30 AM	#5
Reed Hall Of Famer Join Date: Oct 2013 Posts: 2,659	Thanks for all the replies. I figured it was probably something I was missing and it sounds like that is the case.