Have We Reached "Peak Graphics?"

[texasmame]

Watching today's vid got me thinking - I remember back when the idea was floated about adding graphics to the game, above and beyond the static ballpark pics.

Some wanted no additional graphics. Others, myself included, wanted "MicroLeague-like" graphics while others wanted closer to "The Show."

Having now achieved graphics that are far superior to but still "MicroLeague-like" in their presentation - has OOTP gone as far as it should with the graphics?

Its meat and potatoes is still the accurate stats engine. I feel any drastic "improvements" over the current graphics would start to detract from the game.

How about you?

POLL BELOW!

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...d.php?t=286063

[Izz]

Personally, I don't see why we can't have both.

As far as I'm aware, engine and graphics are handled by 2 different teams so better graphics shouldn't mean resources are taken away from better engine

Edit: And see Matt's comment below

[Markus Heinsohn]

Well, we will continue to improve the animations & graphics, but we'll likely keep the default view in a way that you can see the entire ballpark / field. And I think there is still a lot of room for growth, eg. when you'd have MLB The Show set up from this perspective, things do look much better than in OOTP right now. But, we are improving this each year, and my dream would be that some day it looks like watching TV, with the camera at the birds-eye perspective. Or being at the ballpark yourself, behind home plate in the upper decks.

[Matt Arnold]

Nope. Still plenty more to do with them

As I just wrote in the other thread, one big point to keep in mind is that effort to improve the graphics presentation helps the game engine too. A lot of changes we've done the last couple years to the fielding/defensive engine, the positioning system, and various other in-game pieces like ball landing locations, runner advancement, and so on, have come mostly because of the work we've put into improving the graphics.

So while I don't think we'll be getting to MLB The Show level graphics soon, I think there's definitely a few more steps in between that will both make the in-game experience a pure joy to play out, while also having substantial effects on the sim engine as well.

[redranger]

Along with maybe a radio type style PbP (aka Ernie Harrell’s Baseball for Windows from some time ago)


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[texasmame]

Originally Posted by redranger

Along with maybe a radio type style PbP (aka Ernie Harrell’s Baseball for Windows from some time ago)


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This I would *love!*

[actionjackson]

As far as I'm concerned the sky is probably the limit for graphics given the development team that's steering the ship. My concern is that issues raised in this thread and this thread are addressed because even The Show level graphics won't mean spit if too many guys are having incredible seasons. I'd like to think the OOTP Developments team can get this game back to OOTP16 level stats output (both on an individual and league-wide basis), and take the graphics to levels only dreamed of. Then we would indeed have the perfect baseball simulation. As it stands, it's the best out there. Doesn't mean there's no room for improvement.

[Caporegime]

Peak? Are you kiddin'? You ain't seen nothing yet!




Seriously, the huge leap forward taken this year far exceeded any of my previous expectations. At this point, I'm just going to take it on faith that everything Markus envisions the game's graphics eventually being will come to pass, and then some.

[NoOne]

omg, is that the new playstation?

like old graphics? check out "legacy of the ancients" at abandon ware site. all the towns on map are named after michigan cities. even "bad axe" lol

[joestros]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Well, we will continue to improve the animations & graphics, but we'll likely keep the default view in a way that you can see the entire ballpark / field. And I think there is still a lot of room for growth, eg. when you'd have MLB The Show set up from this perspective, things do look much better than in OOTP right now. But, we are improving this each year, and my dream would be that some day it looks like watching TV, with the camera at the birds-eye perspective. Or being at the ballpark yourself, behind home plate in the upper decks.

I am in total agreement with the camera angle being behind home plate in the upper deck where you can see the entire field. Keep it static. Games get into trouble (i.e. bugs and gameplay issues) when dynamic camera angles are implemented in an attempt to emulate a TV broadcast. I would rather see the entire field and watch a play develop instead of an isolated view of a single point of action. I can watch a game on TV if I want fancy camera angles and isolated shots.

I really appreciate the vision and direction of the game, Markus.

[endgame]

Short answer, obviously no. With Markus, Matt, and Andreas, there are no peaks, in the sense that there's no comfortable mesa waiting at the top. It's a continual climb, one step in front of the other, always aiming and dreaming higher and higher. That's not a process that will end anytime soon, if ever.

[Syd Thrift]

I mean, think of the graphical advances Football Manager has made since its first forays into 3D representations of the players on the field. They haven't just added animations, they've made major changes as to how the game gets played on the field that you have to account for now.

I do think that there will come a time in the future when the game goes physics-based a la FPS Football and Baseball and there will probably be a hiccup or two in statistical fidelity in that version and maybe the one or two after it. I also think that's the way you're really going to see things like teams making adjustments to individual players or pitchers, along with a whole host of other paradigm-shift style changes. Anyway, I predict the game's going to get more about the "graphics", not less, so be prepared...

[drksd4848]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Well, we will continue to improve the animations & graphics, but we'll likely keep the default view in a way that you can see the entire ballpark / field. And I think there is still a lot of room for growth, eg. when you'd have MLB The Show set up from this perspective, things do look much better than in OOTP right now. But, we are improving this each year, and my dream would be that some day it looks like watching TV, with the camera at the birds-eye perspective. Or being at the ballpark yourself, behind home plate in the upper decks.

Matt, what would you consider the "benchmark" for OOTP graphics?

[Texan_10]

Originally Posted by texasmame

Watching today's vid got me thinking - I remember back when the idea was floated about adding graphics to the game, above and beyond the static ballpark pics.

Some wanted no additional graphics. Others, myself included, wanted "MicroLeague-like" graphics while others wanted closer to "The Show."

Having now achieved graphics that are far superior to but still "MicroLeague-like" in their presentation - has OOTP gone as far as it should with the graphics?

Its meat and potatoes is still the accurate stats engine. I feel any drastic "improvements" over the current graphics would start to detract from the game.

How about you?

POLL BELOW!

http://www.ootpdevelopments.com/boar...d.php?t=286063

IMO, I don't see why better and better graphics each year would ever be a negative. As long as the out of game (sim/team building) experience is as deep and fun as it is, better in game graphics just makes it that much more immersive. It'd be a even more fun of an experience to build a team and watch them play if graphics are near MLB The Show one day.

[Eugene Church]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Well, we will continue to improve the animations & graphics, but we'll likely keep the default view in a way that you can see the entire ballpark / field. And I think there is still a lot of room for growth, eg. when you'd have MLB The Show set up from this perspective, things do look much better than in OOTP right now. But, we are improving this each year, and my dream would be that some day it looks like watching TV, with the camera at the birds-eye perspective. Or being at the ballpark yourself, behind home plate in the upper decks.

Agree with what you say, Markus.

I really long for the day when I can just "watch" the game on OOTPB like a telecast and just let it play out without me doing anything, but the rosters, batting orders and pitching rotations... that would really be a dream come true... because I'm a control freak, I probably would make pitching changes, too... and pick the pinchhitters.

But I would mainly just watch the game play out.

I wish the sports networks would give up just one wide view of the game instead of to the right of the pitcher facing home plate... I get so tired of views of the dugout... it's the activities on the field I'm interested in.

I love to sit mid-level at games and view the entire field... usually all I can afford is upper level behind home plate, which is fine at most MLB parks.

I also wish PBP was handled by just one announcer... 2-3 guys in the booth just clutter it up and many times take away from the game... I usually watch games with the sound off.

And I can't stand manager interviews during a game... they put the game in a small square and focus on the manager one the big screen... and the manager really doesn't tell you much about the game.

Keep the camera on the game, please.

[Eugene Church]

Originally Posted by Texan_10

IMO, I don't see why better and better graphics each year would ever be a negative. As long as the out of game (sim/team building) experience is as deep and fun as it is, better in game graphics just makes it that much more immersive. It'd be a even more fun of an experience to build a team and watch them play if graphics are near MLB The Show one day.

Oh, I would dearly love graphics like they have on MLB The Show... at least they look great in their previews.

I have never gotten it or seen a game on it... I don't play a game where I have to pitch, hit, throw or field... arcade games are not for me.

Do their graphics work well or do they have a lot of glitches in it.?

[pgjocki]

Originally Posted by Eugene Church

Oh, I would dearly love graphics like they have on MLB The Show... at least they look great in their previews.

I have never gotten it or seen a game on it... I don't play a game where I have to pitch, hit, throw or field... arcade games are not for me.

Do their graphics work well or do they have a lot of glitches in it.?

I haven't played the Show since 16 I believe and while it was pretty smooth there were times when the guys would do funky things with sliding or diving but you just chalk those up as game glitches. My problem is that I am not a fast twitch guy; and as I have gotten older I much prefer a slower pace game where my ability to enjoy myself and win is not based on how fast I can hit a button or combination of buttons.

[itsmb8]

I think The Show's gameplay and modes with OOTP customization, depth, accuracy, etc. is the ultimate goal. I mean, 99.9999999% chance it never happens, but its not IMPOSSIBLE. I mean just think, doing everything you need to do in OOTP, then pressing play game, and BAM, youre playing MLB The Show set up to your OOTP save.

And of course, The Show is the ultimate goal, but id be MORE than okay with MLB2K or MVP Baseball style graphics.

[louisvillec271]

I still play in the 2D mode. It's better than watching the pawns and ball do odd things on a baseball diamond. Additionally, it should be somewhat of an embarrassment that game that are 20 years the senior of OOTP had better graphics.With all the power and storage of today's machines, the graphical presentation should be much better than what it currently is.

[OutS|der]

Originally Posted by itsmb8

I think The Show's gameplay and modes with OOTP customization, depth, accuracy, etc. is the ultimate goal. I mean, 99.9999999% chance it never happens, but its not IMPOSSIBLE. I mean just think, doing everything you need to do in OOTP, then pressing play game, and BAM, youre playing MLB The Show set up to your OOTP save.

And of course, The Show is the ultimate goal, but id be MORE than okay with MLB2K or MVP Baseball style graphics.

Give Markus the same budget The Show gets and I'm sure he could make something just as nice.