Rivalries

MrBojangles · 05-22-2016, 12:11 PM

The recent thread on brawls got me thinking...

We need rivalries in OOTP. Teams that hate each other and play with added intensity when they face each other. More likely to brawl with each other than with other teams. Maybe even more likelihood of injuries just from the added exertion. More heroic type plays/comebacks when they face each other. More intense music? Louder fans? Imagine Yankees-Red Sox or Giants-Dodgers or any other classic match-up.

We need to be able to have this in fictional leagues also.

Maybe they can even generate over the course of seasons, say when one team eliminates another from the playoffs and then the following season their matches are more intense.

Number4 · 05-22-2016, 06:31 PM

Rivalries would be good, more brawls makes sense. Yet unless there is any evidence to the contrary, modifying player performance for me is quite ridiculous. And what should that heroics be? Just because you remember the bottom of the 9th walk off home run during the Red Sox - Yankees game better than the same home run during some nondescript game in may does not make that home run more "heroic" or likely to happen.
And even if the players would be giving more, remember that the other guys are too, likely cancelling that effect out.

Honorable_Pawn · 05-22-2016, 06:46 PM

I love RPG stuff. Definitely makes the game more fun. Just not sure bout the performance thing.

MrBojangles · 05-22-2016, 06:47 PM

The drama could maybe accomplished by more dramatic PbP commentary, even if the actual player performance is the same.

That canceling out comment is actually interesting. I wonder if rivalry games, over time, tend to more more closely scoring due to the "offsetting intensity" each side is bringing.

kq76 · 05-22-2016, 07:21 PM

I used to be more for some form of rivalries put into in the game, but if you look into it there are probably less real rivalries in MLB than you might think. I mean, yeah, we can probably all point to a few, but past that you'll get plenty of people saying, "no, that's not a real rivalry, that's just the media trying to make something out of nothing" and I can't really argue with that. And then there are plenty of teams that you'd really be hard-pressed to say they have any rivalries at all.

I think there's also the majority opinion around here that if you're not going to include realistic studied effects from a feature then it shouldn't be added to the game. I'm not in that camp (I'm good with things just for story purposes), but besides your increased likelihood of brawls, which are pretty rare, I don't really see anything I or most people would probably want that would be the result a heated rivalry designation. More injuries? No way you're going to get much if any support for that? More clutch plays? Same thing. Louder music/fans? Really? No, beyond storyline purposes, there's not much meat on the bone here unfortunately. I'd still be good with it, but good luck getting support for it.

Le Grande Orange · 05-22-2016, 08:10 PM

The question is how does one quantify and measure a rivalry—and this question applies equally to real life as it does to OOTP. What factors are involved? Do rivalries change over time? Or are they static?

Fictional leagues would need a system by which rivalries can naturally occur as a result of the conditions within that league.

MrBojangles · 05-22-2016, 08:32 PM

Perhaps PbP commentary and news stories are the only ways to present the rivalries.
I agree that in fictional leagues there would need to be a mechanism to generate the rivalries.

The Game · 05-22-2016, 10:08 PM

I would like a page where we can edit rivalries. When the Brewers were in the AL, especially when Phil Garner was the MGR, they were the Sox biggest rival, then it was the Twins for a # of years now it is more Cleveland. I would also like to have Cubs as a rival.
I would like to see attendance be higher during these games, less likely to see trades happen between these teams and if a player goes to a rival see fan interest go up/down more then normal.

GTAltman · 05-24-2016, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

The question is how does one quantify and measure a rivalry—and this question applies equally to real life as it does to OOTP. What factors are involved? Do rivalries change over time? Or are they static?

Fictional leagues would need a system by which rivalries can naturally occur as a result of the conditions within that league.

Rivalries never really go away, but are heightened when both teams are playing well. When one goes into the toilet, it doesn't mean as much. Prior to this season the Cubs and Whitesox weren't that much of a rivalry, or as heated. But this year with both in first place....look out!

As mentioned previously, previous playoff match-ups, divisions, brawls, and proximity are all key factors for that added spice.

I like this idea

jpeters1734 · 05-25-2016, 11:38 AM

Rivalries would be a cool addition. I wouldn't support player enhancement but the new stories alone would make it worth it

05-22-2016, 12:11 PM	#1
MrBojangles All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: low and inside Posts: 568	Rivalries The recent thread on brawls got me thinking... We need rivalries in OOTP. Teams that hate each other and play with added intensity when they face each other. More likely to brawl with each other than with other teams. Maybe even more likelihood of injuries just from the added exertion. More heroic type plays/comebacks when they face each other. More intense music? Louder fans? Imagine Yankees-Red Sox or Giants-Dodgers or any other classic match-up. We need to be able to have this in fictional leagues also. Maybe they can even generate over the course of seasons, say when one team eliminates another from the playoffs and then the following season their matches are more intense.

05-22-2016, 06:46 PM	#3
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	I love RPG stuff. Definitely makes the game more fun. Just not sure bout the performance thing. __________________ PBA Quickstart for OOTP Background Images Collection All PBA games broadcast live on Steam.

05-22-2016, 07:21 PM	#5
kq76 Global Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 11,801	I used to be more for some form of rivalries put into in the game, but if you look into it there are probably less real rivalries in MLB than you might think. I mean, yeah, we can probably all point to a few, but past that you'll get plenty of people saying, "no, that's not a real rivalry, that's just the media trying to make something out of nothing" and I can't really argue with that. And then there are plenty of teams that you'd really be hard-pressed to say they have any rivalries at all. I think there's also the majority opinion around here that if you're not going to include realistic studied effects from a feature then it shouldn't be added to the game. I'm not in that camp (I'm good with things just for story purposes), but besides your increased likelihood of brawls, which are pretty rare, I don't really see anything I or most people would probably want that would be the result a heated rivalry designation. More injuries? No way you're going to get much if any support for that? More clutch plays? Same thing. Louder music/fans? Really? No, beyond storyline purposes, there's not much meat on the bone here unfortunately. I'd still be good with it, but good luck getting support for it. __________________ My OOTP Wishlist \| My FAQ List OOTP Wiki \| Your Recommended Team Nicknames, By City (A Crowdsourced Project)

05-22-2016, 10:08 PM	#8
The Game Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Inside The Game Posts: 30,937	I would like a page where we can edit rivalries. When the Brewers were in the AL, especially when Phil Garner was the MGR, they were the Sox biggest rival, then it was the Twins for a # of years now it is more Cleveland. I would also like to have Cubs as a rival. I would like to see attendance be higher during these games, less likely to see trades happen between these teams and if a player goes to a rival see fan interest go up/down more then normal. __________________ Go today don't wait for tomorrow It isn't promised, all the time you get borrowed Don't live your life for other people Don't bottle your emotions till they crack and fill a couple just sorrows Take your mind and refocus go get a paper write your goals out Throw your middle fingers to all your haters "Stay Strong"

05-25-2016, 11:38 AM	#10
jpeters1734 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2014 Location: Juust a bit outside... Posts: 6,237	Rivalries would be a cool addition. I wouldn't support player enhancement but the new stories alone would make it worth it __________________ "Cannonball Coming!" Go Bucs!! Founder and League Caretaker of the Professional Baseball Circuit, www.probaseballcircuit.com An Un-Official Guide to Minor League Management in OOTP 21 Ratings Scale Conversion Cross-Reference Cheat Sheet

05-22-2016, 06:31 PM	#2
Number4 Major Leagues Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 460	Rivalries would be good, more brawls makes sense. Yet unless there is any evidence to the contrary, modifying player performance for me is quite ridiculous. And what should that heroics be? Just because you remember the bottom of the 9th walk off home run during the Red Sox - Yankees game better than the same home run during some nondescript game in may does not make that home run more "heroic" or likely to happen. And even if the players would be giving more, remember that the other guys are too, likely cancelling that effect out.

05-22-2016, 06:47 PM	#4
MrBojangles All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: low and inside Posts: 568	The drama could maybe accomplished by more dramatic PbP commentary, even if the actual player performance is the same. That canceling out comment is actually interesting. I wonder if rivalry games, over time, tend to more more closely scoring due to the "offsetting intensity" each side is bringing.

05-22-2016, 08:10 PM	#6
Le Grande Orange Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Up There Posts: 15,644	The question is how does one quantify and measure a rivalry—and this question applies equally to real life as it does to OOTP. What factors are involved? Do rivalries change over time? Or are they static? Fictional leagues would need a system by which rivalries can naturally occur as a result of the conditions within that league.

05-22-2016, 08:32 PM	#7
MrBojangles All Star Reserve Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: low and inside Posts: 568	Perhaps PbP commentary and news stories are the only ways to present the rivalries. I agree that in fictional leagues there would need to be a mechanism to generate the rivalries.