Feedback Needed / Larger Logos in OOTP HTML Reports

[battists]

Guys, we're working on increasing the size of logos in the OOTP HTML reports, to take better advantage of the wonderful logos you guys make.

We were thinking of doing something like this:



In this sample, the green square is where the logo would be, at a full 100 x 100 pixels.

The in-game browser can manage background images in tables, but there's no way to have the team color (here: purple) in the background of the logo. It would probably be best to have a "border graphic" for the logo, which could be something like a white square with rounded corners and outside of the square it would have the same colors as the "BNN" top banner.

Thoughts from logo-makers? For what it's worth, it's not my intent to open this up to "general feedback on all things about OOTP's report layout"...

Thanks guys!

Steve

[davwms]

I don't have any problems with this and I like the larger logos.

I wonder if it would work ito create and background layer to match the team color background.

Also, since this came up, would there be any chance of an option for more than 1 logo per team? One large one like shown here, but also on the pages that show the logo smaller, allow for a different (more simple) logo to be displayed. For instance the main logo could have the city/team name, while the secondary logo could just be the graphic?

[Le Grande Orange]

Larger display size is always better, and 100x100 is a good step in that direction.

Also, as davwms mentioned and I proposed a couple of OOTP versions ago, allow for the creation of dedicated secondary team logos. Primary logos would be created at 150x150 size, and can be used in onscreen displays down to, say, 75x75 size. If the screen uses a logo display size that is 75x75 size or smaller, then the secondary logo is used instead. Secondary logos would be created at a 75x75 size. Using a dedicated secondary logo size means OOTP has to do less in-game scaling of team logos to fit onscreen. Secondary logos also give the game more visual variety, and logo makers more things to do. (Real world clubs have primary and secondary logos.)

[MB.Pelicans]

As someone that's rather new to logo making, I have to ask, will these changes do anything adverse to exsisting logos? or will they still look right in the game?

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by MB.Pelicans

As someone that's rather new to logo making, I have to ask, will these changes do anything adverse to exsisting logos? or will they still look right in the game?

Logos are actually created at a 150x150 size, but are displayed at sizes less than that (sometimes considerably less) in the game. And OOTP has a lot of screens where the team logos are displayed in rather small sizes. Thus OOTP has to scale down the logos to fit, and such in-game scaling tends to reduce the visual quality of the logo as fine, small details which might be visible at 150x150 get lost at smaller display sizes.

[davwms]

...Also, the way I understand it is that logos with transparencies will show the color of the BNN banner, so I guess the logo would look like it is a square shape instead of showing the transparency the way it does currently ?

[MB.Pelicans]

So transparent backgrounds will now be a bad thing?

I'm Worried about this because I have been working on a project that is going to include well over 3,000 logos by the time I get done, and I'm going to be so sad if it turns out that they look crappy in the next version because of the transparency.

Or, if I am reading this right, will it just be a case of needing to add some sort of colored background?

[Le Grande Orange]

I think battists was saying that OOTP reports cannot automatically add a team colour to the background of the logo, the way it sort of does for game-created logos. I would expect a logo with a proper transparent background would work the same way it does now on game screens and reports, but he'll have to confirm that.

The way I read his comment about a border was that a dedicated border graphic would be created for the reports, and then the logos would be displayed inside that. In other words, the logo makers wouldn't have to concern themselves with it since the border element would be shipped with the game. Again, battists will have to confirm if that reading is correct or not.

[MB.Pelicans]

Ok, thanks for your take on the situation, I wonder how the round glossy style logos would look on a a square background? I might have to experiment. I almost wonder tho, if it would be better to leave to background to the logo makers becasuse it might actually look better if it was coordinated for individual teams.

Does anyone know what would be the easiest way to make a simple Photoshop template that is a 100x100 squar background that I could use to experiment with, with the ability to change the colors, and maybe something like the rounded corners Battists mentioned?

I would love to experiement a little bit

[kq76]

I worry about this border effect and existing logos with transparent backgrounds, but I like the idea of displaying the logos at a size of 100x100. What is it at now? Whatever it is, I think it's a bit too small. I'm not positive I'm remembering correctly, but I think OOTP6's logos must have been larger because you just got that sense that you were on that team's screens. With OOTP9 the logos aren't as noticeable so you can switch from team to team and sometimes you don't even realize you switched because they look too alike. Basically, I think increasing the logo size should increase the immersion factor.

[endgame]

I hope this would not mean losing the affiliation logo that is presently associated with the minor team logo, but smaller. Is this proposal for the major league screen only?

In addition, I know Steve didn't want to expand the scope of this thread - sorry - but where and when can we expect the League Logo, i.e. National or American (effectively sub-leagues) to be utilized in these htmls? They currently have no real home page.

[MB.Pelicans]

I have a random idea that might solve the need for a background completely,

Would it be possible to merge the Baseball News Network bar in with the the bar that contains the small print league name and the "open in external browser" button?

Then just widen the team color coded bar to fit the larger logo?
Or even use it to include a secondary logo like Le Grande mentioned?
Have the primary logo on one side, the team name in the middle, and the secondary logo on the opposite end.

[cephasjames]

If there's a way to keep the transparent transparent then I'm all for it. I'm uncertain if that will happen though. I really like the idea of larger logos. I'd prefer the 150x150 again.

I say go for it. Do it how you want it then show a better example with it set up how its going to be set up, transparent or white background, etc. then I'll probably have a better answer.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by cephasjames

I'd prefer the 150x150 again.

Just to be perfectly clear, the logo size in terms of pixel dimension in the logo file are not changing, and will remain at 150x150. The display size of the logo on various screens, however, appears it will undergo some changes.

In terms of a 150x150 display size, there just isn't enough screen real estate on a 1024x768 screen to do it. The logo just takes up too much space at that screen resolution (I know, because I've tried a bit of redesigning of an OOTP screen to see if displaying logos at their full 150x150 size was feasible). My experiments led me to conclude the biggest size you could reasonably display a logo on a 1024x768 screen resolution was 120x120. That thirty pixel difference may not seem like a lot, but it really is.

And since OOTP's screens are designed to comfortably fit a minimum game resolution size of 1024x768, I don't think 150x150 size display of logos will happen. (At least, not without some rethinking of how the game displays its screens. I've got some ideas there, and a project I want to work on at some point...)

[truthserum]

Me.....the green box looks a little forced. What about just using a bigger logo in the white breaking news table as a background image?. It has worked in other parts of the game. Obviously, seeing the text is the most important thing, but it has worked where you can get a good look at a logo as a faded background image and still read the text.

[munstermash]

Bigger is better!

[PSUColonel]

I like it the way it is. I don't think there is really a need for this. I'm not sure why Markus has chosen to even look at something like this instead of putting his efforts elsewhere.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by truthserum

Me.....the green box looks a little forced.

Uh, I think the green box is just there to illustrate how big the logo area would be in the redesign. It's not an actual design element in itself. (I did the same sort of thing when trying some screen redesign ideas. I'd just make a box of a given size in a solid colour to quickly and easily show me the logo area taken up by that given size.)

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

I like it the way it is. I don't think there is really a need for this. I'm not sure why Markus has chosen to even look at something like this instead of putting his efforts elsewhere.

Two things:

1) As I recall, HTML outputs and the like are mostly coded by Andreas;

2) The aesthetics of the game screen designs do matter. It's also a bit disheartening for a logo creator to spend a lot of time making a logo that looks really good only to have that effort be mostly wasted since the game displays that work at such small sizes.

[truthserum]

I guess I was thinking that without thinking that the top and middle banner would be resized so it wouldn't look like the logo was just plastered over them.

[silvam14]

I love the idea! Sounds good!