Rosters from the off!, next time maybe?

wilkiburger · 07-14-2006, 10:17 AM

Dear Sirs,

This must have already been suggested, but incase it hasn't here goes.

Surely it would be prudent for SI or Marcus to have the current rosters already to go. It appears that anyone that has tried doing a roster has come up against serious difficulties.

I am aware that they have not bought the rights to the MLB, however if we are allowed to make rosters why are they not allowed. If they had done this we would not have had the neck break of the last ..... well however long ago it started and is still not complete.

Having been a Champman kid from the off, one of the most enduring qualities of SI has been their databases, they are without doubt the best on the planet, alot of care and time goes into them. SO surely they have the capabilities of producing this for OOTP.

I just find the whole thing an incredible pain. Downloading Logos, stadium pics, face pics etc. and sadly its becoming the norm as well, take Total Pro Basketball, football etc.

I may be mad but I would pay an extra £15 for this without batting an eyelid. I like others im sure, thrive off of real simulation and can associate with it alot better.

I know alot of people say in 10 or so seasons the names are obselete, but I disagree. You bring the youth players through with the known players and because of that they appear to be more real. Then they become veterans and its as if they were there all the time. You just need that starting point and real rosters make that happen.

So for gods sake please next time, relase the game adding to the price and then add a package that is made by "Jo Nobody" that completes the deal leaving us totally fulfilled, letting these "GREAT" guys alone that do the add ons to get on with playing the game themselves.

YOU CAN DO IT SI!, I KNOW, so sort it for the next game and do yourselves a favour. Just think how much more slack you would have got.

zekester91 · 07-14-2006, 10:24 AM

It's been posted that adding real rosters is a leagal problem. the SI leagal team has warned that Mukus and company could get into major legel hot water by adding this.

And by going over to the mod section here, it's not that hard to get real players into the game. using lamans(sp) db and the autoface maker names and pics take all of 30 min to put into the game. Adding Staduims and logos does take a bit longer, but is well worth the time considering the amount of time you'll be playing in the game, and with the games new logo gerator you at least have temp logos untill you get around to changing them all.

The Joe Nobody problem was pretty much fixed in the first patch, I don't think I've seen one joe nobody since installing that patch.

scefalu · 07-14-2006, 10:27 AM

I don't know that the extra fee for having names & logos is the issue. The real problem with any agreement with MLB and MLBPA is the restrictions that the groups demand on what you can put in the game and how you can implement it. It would cut down on the customization options, and I don't know many people who are in favor of that idea.

No MLB licenses, please!

andymac · 07-14-2006, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

I may be mad but I would pay an extra £15 for this without batting an eyelid. I like others im sure, thrive off of real simulation and can associate with it alot better.

Well, here is the rub. It is likely estimated that not enough would accept the jump in price it would take to get the MLB license. Also, the MLB license typically brings along stipulations with it that could be a detriment to the creativity of Markus and the game.

silvam14 · 07-14-2006, 10:30 AM

This game never had MLB rosters out of the box, and somehow, everyone survived

wilkiburger · 07-14-2006, 10:40 AM

I don't see Cubby and Rolen in the high court do you. You must have misread my point. SI and Markus should have an all seeing all dancing add on that can be put through for free in the forums like Cubby and Rolen. They just have to pretend they are not SI and Markus i.e. "Jo Nobody" "Jo Blogg" "Micky Mouse".

Further to this, I am not a computer geek (I hope) and I struggle to import things etc, and I am absolutely positive Im not the only one.

6.5 for instance.

I got the game and it worked fine, I even saw that it was a real roster deep down but with different names. But then i got bored looking at crap logos and crap stadiums, so I started getting into the add ons. I spent more time with add ons than playing the game. and guess what, THE GAME ALWAYS FROZE OR CRASHED.

So listen good, its quite simple SI and Markus do the whole shabang then they give Cubby a tickle on the phone and say "Guess what, keep this under your hat, but to save you wasting 6 months of your time and not getting paid for it, say this is yours and you did it, then you can go out and get laid instead of data crunching, we don't mind coz we added 10% to the price of the game and hired some frigging professional data crunchers who had the programmers there with them so the game wouldn't sodding crash!, ta ta!

Do you get me now!!!

wilkiburger · 07-14-2006, 10:42 AM

Come on everyone, shoot frigging holes in my idea,.....ahhh. BULLETPROOF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

andymac · 07-14-2006, 10:44 AM

That normally is the case, but seeing as this was a complete re-write...the game wasn't ready in its' pre-release state to be used to develop roster sets. I'm sure next year this will happen.

wilkiburger · 07-14-2006, 10:46 AM

SO its a godd idea then. Great, but i tell you something, i dont want to window shop around on everyones attempt at rosters, logos, facepics, stadiums etc.. I want one simple download that corroborates with all of them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

zekester91 · 07-14-2006, 10:59 AM

I'm sure someone will get one soon, 6.5 had a MLB all in one Mod, I'm sure someone will put it all together sooner or later.

cabot41 · 07-14-2006, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

Come on everyone, shoot frigging holes in my idea,.....ahhh. BULLETPROOF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You are literally asking Marcus and the team to put themselves in a position where they would have to perjure themselves or face the possibility of getting run out of business. I've had the unfortunate opportunity to do some work with MLB Legal and let me tell you these guys LIVE for this kind of stuff. Remember MLB is the type of money grubbing, old boys club, ignore the fans organization that is currently trying to copyright STATS (like batting average and stuff) to keep any old person from running a fantasy baseball league without paying MLB a kickback. I haven't worked with the players association, but I can't believe they are much better. Lawyers, especially copyright lawyers who work for big companies are all a bunch of raving basssbowls (TM-Bill Simmons).

Markus could get in trouble for having rosters with fake names that "bear a significant resemblence to" the real things.

And because so many people openly complain about this, all a lawyer has to do is come to these boards to prove that there was an economic incentive to "infringe" on MLBs copyrights as much as possible. The more this game looks like it was licensed by MLB (without being so licensed) the more problematic the whole thing becomes.

Remember Napster? Old school free Napster? They're fundamental problem was not that they created a software that could be used to steal (massively overpriced and often terrible) music, it was that they also created the files and therefore very product that was stolen. If Markus created the real life database, there would be some record of it one of his hard drive, which could be subpeoned, and that would be the ballgame.

It wouldn't just be the end of OOTP, it would create a precedent and put all professional sports leagues on notice that small publishers with text based sims based on "their sports" (as they like to think of them) can be fined, broken, and eventually forced to pay the license that would make sure that the next little Markus out there never even get a chance to try to bring the people the "next generation."

YOUr idea might well work against conventional bullet based weaponary, but MLB has got all kinds of WMDs that makes it well worth whatever wait is necessary to do this the right (read: legal) way.

Exodor · 07-14-2006, 11:20 AM

Impossible, unless SI wants to buy out Take Two's Exclusive 7 year license with MLB

Quote:

in 2006, Take2 will have exclusive rights among third-party publishers to develop and market simulation, arcade and manager-style baseball video games on the current and next-generation PlayStation, X-BOX, Nintendo, personal computer and hand-held video game systems

darkcloud4579 · 07-14-2006, 11:23 AM

I don't see any reason, in a game as customizable as OOTP to bother with an MLB license. Just my

dougaiton · 07-14-2006, 11:35 AM

First off, OOTP can never have real names without getting into real financial trouble.

That said, they missed a trick. A simple Lahman 2006 import, with all the names changed to fictional (done with a simple import/export and some pasting) and cleaned up with fake minors would have kept everyone happy. Some smart dude would have worked out each player's real identity, and imported it. This is very similar to how OOTP2 etc. shipped - we do all remember Jason McAteer = Mo Vaughn, right?

That would have kept all the wolves at bay, and made it real-world playable from the off, took the slack of Cubby and Rolen etc.

Zitofan75 · 07-14-2006, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

Come on everyone, shoot frigging holes in my idea,.....ahhh. BULLETPROOF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

No, we've just seen this thread before and since the powers that be say it's not going to happen it just sort of seems like a waste of bandwidth.

wilkiburger · 07-14-2006, 11:54 AM

Like I said before do you see Cubby and Rolen up in court, No you don't, Im not suggesting that Markus and SI do it and release it, im suggesting that someone like Cubby and Rolen do it, but maybe SI hands them a bug free MOD that they can distribute through a forum. There is no way on earth anything could ever be proved either. Someone walks into Internet cafe with an inspector clouseau outfit on. Gets himself a free internet account uploads it and bang!

Absolutely fool proof, WMD my ****, lawsuits my ****, read between the lines. Cubby and Rolen have been doing it for years (I believe) maybe they have teflon suits on then!

<Pion> · 07-14-2006, 11:56 AM

Last I checked, Rolen and the other roster makers didn't have a company that was making money off of their rosters. MLB goes after the companies now, hopefully they won't or can't ever go after the little guys also (see Napster).

Thumbs down to rosters being included. Been there, discussed that.

wilkiburger · 07-14-2006, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zitofan75

No, we've just seen this thread before and since the powers that be say it's not going to happen it just sort of seems like a waste of bandwidth.

I totally disagree, the MODS need to be bug proof and need to fit with the program, the best way to do that is to get the programmers to do it. My 6.5 was ruined by MODS.

Or even let someone like Cubby and Rolen sit in on SI towers, so they can understand what to do so as not to spend how ever many hours typing for the MOD to simply screw up!

wilkiburger · 07-14-2006, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by <Pion>

Last I checked, Rolen and the other roster makers didn't have a company that was making money off of their rosters. MLB goes after the companies now, hopefully they won't or can't ever go after the little guys also (see Napster).

Thumbs down to rosters being included. Been there, discussed that.

Is everyone braindead on here?

We all want Cubby's roster, yes?

SI increase price (Nothing illegal in that last time I bought socks)

Produce an unamed secret MOD that has no name, but more importantly is COMPATABLE!

They go down the pub, or internet cafe

Send it to Cubby and say "There you go, say you did it for no money when the suits come round, NOT!"

Bang we have a game, how many times have I got to say it, its sound logic.

<Pion> · 07-14-2006, 12:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilkiburger

Is everyone braindead on here?

Nice. Love it when someone has to resort to insults.

07-14-2006, 10:17 AM	#1
wilkiburger Minors (Double A) Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 191	Rosters from the off!, next time maybe? Dear Sirs, This must have already been suggested, but incase it hasn't here goes. Surely it would be prudent for SI or Marcus to have the current rosters already to go. It appears that anyone that has tried doing a roster has come up against serious difficulties. I am aware that they have not bought the rights to the MLB, however if we are allowed to make rosters why are they not allowed. If they had done this we would not have had the neck break of the last ..... well however long ago it started and is still not complete. Having been a Champman kid from the off, one of the most enduring qualities of SI has been their databases, they are without doubt the best on the planet, alot of care and time goes into them. SO surely they have the capabilities of producing this for OOTP. I just find the whole thing an incredible pain. Downloading Logos, stadium pics, face pics etc. and sadly its becoming the norm as well, take Total Pro Basketball, football etc. I may be mad but I would pay an extra £15 for this without batting an eyelid. I like others im sure, thrive off of real simulation and can associate with it alot better. I know alot of people say in 10 or so seasons the names are obselete, but I disagree. You bring the youth players through with the known players and because of that they appear to be more real. Then they become veterans and its as if they were there all the time. You just need that starting point and real rosters make that happen. So for gods sake please next time, relase the game adding to the price and then add a package that is made by "Jo Nobody" that completes the deal leaving us totally fulfilled, letting these "GREAT" guys alone that do the add ons to get on with playing the game themselves. YOU CAN DO IT SI!, I KNOW, so sort it for the next game and do yourselves a favour. Just think how much more slack you would have got.

07-14-2006, 10:24 AM	#2
zekester91 All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 1,122	It's been posted that adding real rosters is a leagal problem. the SI leagal team has warned that Mukus and company could get into major legel hot water by adding this. And by going over to the mod section here, it's not that hard to get real players into the game. using lamans(sp) db and the autoface maker names and pics take all of 30 min to put into the game. Adding Staduims and logos does take a bit longer, but is well worth the time considering the amount of time you'll be playing in the game, and with the games new logo gerator you at least have temp logos untill you get around to changing them all. The Joe Nobody problem was pretty much fixed in the first patch, I don't think I've seen one joe nobody since installing that patch. __________________ Bobby Bowden must have a hell of a recruiting pitch, "Son if you come on down to Tallahasee, you just might be able to watch me die during practice!" The road was closed while the Hartford Police Department's bomb squad came and blew up the chicken.

07-14-2006, 10:27 AM	#3
scefalu Major Leagues Join Date: Dec 2001 Posts: 355	I don't know that the extra fee for having names & logos is the issue. The real problem with any agreement with MLB and MLBPA is the restrictions that the groups demand on what you can put in the game and how you can implement it. It would cut down on the customization options, and I don't know many people who are in favor of that idea. No MLB licenses, please! __________________ Shawn

07-14-2006, 10:30 AM	#5
silvam14 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Dedham, MA Posts: 10,158	This game never had MLB rosters out of the box, and somehow, everyone survived __________________ Senior "Nancy Boy" of the OOTP Boards _______________________________________________

07-14-2006, 10:44 AM	#8
andymac Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Effingham, IL Posts: 5,725	That normally is the case, but seeing as this was a complete re-write...the game wasn't ready in its' pre-release state to be used to develop roster sets. I'm sure next year this will happen. __________________ June Madness: Links FTB: andymac

07-14-2006, 10:40 AM	#6
wilkiburger Minors (Double A) Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 191	I don't see Cubby and Rolen in the high court do you. You must have misread my point. SI and Markus should have an all seeing all dancing add on that can be put through for free in the forums like Cubby and Rolen. They just have to pretend they are not SI and Markus i.e. "Jo Nobody" "Jo Blogg" "Micky Mouse". Further to this, I am not a computer geek (I hope) and I struggle to import things etc, and I am absolutely positive Im not the only one. 6.5 for instance. I got the game and it worked fine, I even saw that it was a real roster deep down but with different names. But then i got bored looking at crap logos and crap stadiums, so I started getting into the add ons. I spent more time with add ons than playing the game. and guess what, THE GAME ALWAYS FROZE OR CRASHED. So listen good, its quite simple SI and Markus do the whole shabang then they give Cubby a tickle on the phone and say "Guess what, keep this under your hat, but to save you wasting 6 months of your time and not getting paid for it, say this is yours and you did it, then you can go out and get laid instead of data crunching, we don't mind coz we added 10% to the price of the game and hired some frigging professional data crunchers who had the programmers there with them so the game wouldn't sodding crash!, ta ta! Do you get me now!!!

07-14-2006, 10:42 AM	#7
wilkiburger Minors (Double A) Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 191	Come on everyone, shoot frigging holes in my idea,.....ahhh. BULLETPROOF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

07-14-2006, 10:46 AM	#9
wilkiburger Minors (Double A) Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 191	SO its a godd idea then. Great, but i tell you something, i dont want to window shop around on everyones attempt at rosters, logos, facepics, stadiums etc.. I want one simple download that corroborates with all of them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

07-14-2006, 10:59 AM	#10
zekester91 All Star Starter Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 1,122	I'm sure someone will get one soon, 6.5 had a MLB all in one Mod, I'm sure someone will put it all together sooner or later. __________________ Bobby Bowden must have a hell of a recruiting pitch, "Son if you come on down to Tallahasee, you just might be able to watch me die during practice!" The road was closed while the Hartford Police Department's bomb squad came and blew up the chicken.

07-14-2006, 11:23 AM	#13
darkcloud4579 Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 8,712	I don't see any reason, in a game as customizable as OOTP to bother with an MLB license. Just my __________________ ------ My Mods OOTP Advanced Stats & DFS Suite Managerial Strategy Pack Competitive Balance Tax Calculator Major League Women's Baseball (OOTP24) quickstart Indian Premier League \| 300+ years of baseball quickstart \| Expatriate League quickstart \| Off-Field Injuries Update \| Women's Name File for OOTP \| ---- Dynasty classics: Centurion comes to OOTP5 \| DC Moneyball Dynasty (2004)

07-14-2006, 11:35 AM	#14
dougaiton Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Location: Posts: 3,414	First off, OOTP can never have real names without getting into real financial trouble. That said, they missed a trick. A simple Lahman 2006 import, with all the names changed to fictional (done with a simple import/export and some pasting) and cleaned up with fake minors would have kept everyone happy. Some smart dude would have worked out each player's real identity, and imported it. This is very similar to how OOTP2 etc. shipped - we do all remember Jason McAteer = Mo Vaughn, right? That would have kept all the wolves at bay, and made it real-world playable from the off, took the slack of Cubby and Rolen etc. __________________ tThis shower of clowns My park-adjusted, historically split Born in '69 league file! (also at Joe's wonderful site +BBSC)

07-14-2006, 11:54 AM	#16
wilkiburger Minors (Double A) Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 191	Like I said before do you see Cubby and Rolen up in court, No you don't, Im not suggesting that Markus and SI do it and release it, im suggesting that someone like Cubby and Rolen do it, but maybe SI hands them a bug free MOD that they can distribute through a forum. There is no way on earth anything could ever be proved either. Someone walks into Internet cafe with an inspector clouseau outfit on. Gets himself a free internet account uploads it and bang! Absolutely fool proof, WMD my **, lawsuits my **, read between the lines. Cubby and Rolen have been doing it for years (I believe) maybe they have teflon suits on then!

07-14-2006, 11:56 AM	#17
<Pion> All Star Starter Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 1,428	Last I checked, Rolen and the other roster makers didn't have a company that was making money off of their rosters. MLB goes after the companies now, hopefully they won't or can't ever go after the little guys also (see Napster). Thumbs down to rosters being included. Been there, discussed that.