Moneyball

Jon277 · 07-10-2004, 08:19 PM

Has anyone tried the moneyball philosophy in this game. I am reading the book right now and am wondering if people have tried this and what the results were.

Kett · 07-10-2004, 08:23 PM

I've made a weak attempt to try it, but it doesn't really work like it does in real life for two reasons. The first being, once you win 100 games a couple times, you start making a lot of money and there is no reason to stay frugal. More importantly though, there are no compensation picks. So its hard to build up a great minor league system, as you just don't get any good picks. IRL, the A's have several first round or supplementary picks each year.

Jon277 · 07-10-2004, 08:28 PM

I mean like grab players with high OBP and slugging percentage instead of worrying about avg hitters and stuff like that.

JDOldSchool · 07-10-2004, 08:32 PM

It works perfectly because it's the best way of putting together a team.

I've taken over horrible teams, lowered payroll, and gotten better with this style of play. Of course, I've learned the importance of L/R splits in OOTP. As an attachment to the Moneyball style, pay close attention to the splits. A LOT of guys are just horrible against one side or the other. Set depth charts wisely and your offense should be good even with lesser/cheaper players.

Long_Long_Name · 07-10-2004, 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon277

I mean like grab players with high OBP and slugging percentage instead of worrying about avg hitters and stuff like that.

Tons of people do it.

twins15 · 07-10-2004, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon277

I mean like grab players with high OBP and slugging percentage instead of worrying about avg hitters and stuff like that.

I do that all the time. In fact, in one of my solo leagues, I have Mark Bellhorn on my team. Bellhorn is only a 1-star, so he is very cheap, but he can get on base, whcih I like. OBP is actually the first stat I look at when looking at hitters.

Dargone · 07-10-2004, 10:10 PM

I'm with Twins15, OBP is the first thing I look at...

Dan Theman · 07-10-2004, 10:24 PM

Batting average is - in my mind and those of many others - an overrated statistic. Not useless, but certainly overrated.

ERMJ · 07-13-2004, 09:50 AM

I use the moneyball approach all the time. I draft only college rookies with plus eye and plus avoid K ratings. Usually draft pitchers with plus movement talent. Also look for flawed players with good career OBP or plus talent for eye/avoid K. I have built closers out of average Minor L starters; they turn into multi-inning closers. I have a deep farm system, and plenty of cash (Anaheim Angels has decent market). I lowered the ticket price to 8 dollars, and have had a sellout at every home game this season, 2012.

From every indication, Anaheim intends to keep me.

ERMJ

Long_Long_Name · 07-13-2004, 01:52 PM

I think I remember someone studying the issue and noticing there wasn't any difference between college and high school draftees in terms of potential compared to actual performance.

Stuff is by far the most important pitching rating. Control is slightly more important than movement, with velocity / pitch type being useless.

The Interloper · 07-13-2004, 02:03 PM

I think this is a very good way to go in OOTP. It works for me. I haven't even read the book, but I've heard the concepts enough aroudn here.

Cooker · 07-13-2004, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Interloper

I think this is a very good way to go in OOTP. It works for me. I haven't even read the book, but I've heard the concepts enough aroudn here.

Actually, I strongly recommend that every baseball fan pick up this book. I don't think you'll be disappointed. It's a good and very interesting read whether or not you agree with everything in it. If you don't want to shell out the $$ to buy a copy, by now you can probably get it at your local library. As baseball books go, it's one of the most entertaining in recent memory. (BTW, my vote for best baseball book of all time, which I realize is clearly off topic, is David Halberstam's "Summer of '49.")

Long_Long_Name · 07-13-2004, 04:07 PM

I read the book about a month ago, without needing an introduction to sabermetrics. I thought it was a very interesting read even though the statistical approach was nothing new to me. The book has a good storyline, which is why I liked it.

twins15 · 07-13-2004, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Long_Long_Name

I think I remember someone studying the issue and noticing there wasn't any difference between college and high school draftees in terms of potential compared to actual performance.

Stuff is by far the most important pitching rating. Control is slightly more important than movement, with velocity / pitch type being useless.

Actually, I thought I read somewhere on the boards that the higher a pitcher's velocity, the better the chance to get a talent bump.

EDIT: But yeah, pitch types are definitely useless.

SoxWin · 07-13-2004, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon277

I mean like grab players with high OBP and slugging percentage instead of worrying about avg hitters and stuff like that.

What other way would you build an offense?

dsvitak · 07-15-2004, 02:36 PM

Under my league settings, I make sure that the AI HEAVILY favors OBP for the leadoff spot.

It just KILLED me in OOTP5, to see a .212 hitting top of the order guy, with no walks.

If you are VERY careful about acquiring the best OBP guys, I don't see how you can lose in this game.

In my current historical league, my team OBP is .370, second best is .344, league average is .336.

I am comfortably in first place, even with a relatively poor pitching staff. I have two players with more RBI than games played, and am on track to score 1100 runs for the year....with the league average closer to 700.

Pretty scary...I have guys hitting seventh who would be cleanup hitters on most other teams.

Its all about the OBP, baby!

satchel · 07-15-2004, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon277

Has anyone tried the moneyball philosophy in this game.

Many OotP owners use these philosophies (I am not one). There is even an online OotP league called The Moneyball Union.

Long_Long_Name · 07-15-2004, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsvitak

If you are VERY careful about acquiring the best OBP guys, I don't see how you can lose in this game.

What if your league mates are also looking for the top OBP guys?

SoxWin · 07-15-2004, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Long_Long_Name

What if your league mates are also looking for the top OBP guys?

I believe he's talking about a solo league.

Hammer755 · 07-15-2004, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Long_Long_Name

What if your league mates are also looking for the top OBP guys?

It's funny that you mention that since so many OOTP'ers are likely Beanists.

If everybody is looking for the guys with high OBP, wouldn't the true Moneyball way be to look for guys that excel in other categories since OBP would become overvalued, and other talents would be undervalued?

07-10-2004, 08:19 PM	#1
Jon277 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Rhode Island Posts: 158	Moneyball Has anyone tried the moneyball philosophy in this game. I am reading the book right now and am wondering if people have tried this and what the results were. __________________ Jon Pass

07-10-2004, 08:28 PM	#3
Jon277 Minors (Double A) Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Rhode Island Posts: 158	I mean like grab players with high OBP and slugging percentage instead of worrying about avg hitters and stuff like that. __________________ Jon Pass

07-10-2004, 10:10 PM	#7
Dargone Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Interwebs Posts: 2,862	I'm with Twins15, OBP is the first thing I look at... __________________ I was never one to patiently pick up broken fragments and glue them together again and tell myself that the mended whole was as good as new. What is broken is broken -- and I'd rather remember it as it was at its best than mend it and see the broken places as long as I lived.-Margaret Mitchell

07-13-2004, 01:52 PM	#10
Long_Long_Name Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Montréal Posts: 7,065	I think I remember someone studying the issue and noticing there wasn't any difference between college and high school draftees in terms of potential compared to actual performance. Stuff is by far the most important pitching rating. Control is slightly more important than movement, with velocity / pitch type being useless. __________________ Beta Baseball. Join it!

07-13-2004, 04:07 PM	#13
Long_Long_Name Hall Of Famer Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Montréal Posts: 7,065	I read the book about a month ago, without needing an introduction to sabermetrics. I thought it was a very interesting read even though the statistical approach was nothing new to me. The book has a good storyline, which is why I liked it. __________________ Beta Baseball. Join it!

07-10-2004, 08:23 PM	#2
Kett Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 77	I've made a weak attempt to try it, but it doesn't really work like it does in real life for two reasons. The first being, once you win 100 games a couple times, you start making a lot of money and there is no reason to stay frugal. More importantly though, there are no compensation picks. So its hard to build up a great minor league system, as you just don't get any good picks. IRL, the A's have several first round or supplementary picks each year.

07-10-2004, 08:32 PM	#4
JDOldSchool Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2003 Posts: 4,023	It works perfectly because it's the best way of putting together a team. I've taken over horrible teams, lowered payroll, and gotten better with this style of play. Of course, I've learned the importance of L/R splits in OOTP. As an attachment to the Moneyball style, pay close attention to the splits. A LOT of guys are just horrible against one side or the other. Set depth charts wisely and your offense should be good even with lesser/cheaper players.

07-13-2004, 09:50 AM	#9
ERMJ Bat Boy Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 7	I use the moneyball approach all the time. I draft only college rookies with plus eye and plus avoid K ratings. Usually draft pitchers with plus movement talent. Also look for flawed players with good career OBP or plus talent for eye/avoid K. I have built closers out of average Minor L starters; they turn into multi-inning closers. I have a deep farm system, and plenty of cash (Anaheim Angels has decent market). I lowered the ticket price to 8 dollars, and have had a sellout at every home game this season, 2012. From every indication, Anaheim intends to keep me. ERMJ

07-13-2004, 02:03 PM	#11
The Interloper Minors (Double A) Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: The dark recesses of the human mind Posts: 147	I think this is a very good way to go in OOTP. It works for me. I haven't even read the book, but I've heard the concepts enough aroudn here.

07-15-2004, 02:36 PM	#16
dsvitak Hall Of Famer Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 5,345	Under my league settings, I make sure that the AI HEAVILY favors OBP for the leadoff spot. It just KILLED me in OOTP5, to see a .212 hitting top of the order guy, with no walks. If you are VERY careful about acquiring the best OBP guys, I don't see how you can lose in this game. In my current historical league, my team OBP is .370, second best is .344, league average is .336. I am comfortably in first place, even with a relatively poor pitching staff. I have two players with more RBI than games played, and am on track to score 1100 runs for the year....with the league average closer to 700. Pretty scary...I have guys hitting seventh who would be cleanup hitters on most other teams. Its all about the OBP, baby!