Home | Webstore
Latest News: OOTP Update 20.6 - OOTP 20 Available - FHM 6 Available

FHM 6 Available Now!

  

Go Back   OOTP Developments Forums > Out of the Park Baseball 19 > OOTP 19 - Historical Simulations

OOTP 19 - Historical Simulations Discuss historical simulations and their results in this forum.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 03-21-2018, 09:12 AM   #1
DawnBTVS
Major Leagues
 
DawnBTVS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 413
Thanks: 273
Thanked 129x in 72 posts
Two Way Players and Effects in Pre-Deadball - 1940s

I'm curious what some others have seen in this regard. I have to admit that this is one of the coolest features to hit OOTP for me as a historical player.

One of my examples having started an 1871 League with 162 Game Schedules & 4 Man Rotations (which can be effective now that players can be utilized in 2 way manners). Currently just finished through 1879.

Here's a single example of a guy who's carved out a "2 Way" career: Al Spalding

Hitter: 3,384 PA with a .331/.356/.418 line and 147 OPS+. 16.5 WAR with 352 games at 1B, 107 games at CF, 44 games at LF, and 9 games at 3B.

Pitcher: 183-121 with a 2.18 ERA in 2,747 IP and 137 ERA+. 45.9 WAR

Has anybody tested out 1910s - 1930s yet? I'm curious about the obvious ala Babe Ruth but also Negro League players ala "Bullet" Joe Rogan who went 102-44 as a SP but also hit .343 in 1,721 PA courtesy of Seamheads.
DawnBTVS is offline   Reply With Quote
Thank you for this post:
spartacus007 (03-21-2018)
Old 03-21-2018, 12:55 PM   #2
Spritze
OOTP Historical Czar
 
Spritze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bothell Wa
Posts: 7,208
Thanks: 327
Thanked 3,246x in 1,912 posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by DawnBTVS View Post
Has anybody tested out 1910s - 1930s yet? this was heavily tested in Beta I'm curious about the obvious ala Babe Ruth but also Negro League players ala "Bullet" Joe Rogan who went 102-44 as a SP but also hit .343 in 1,721 PA courtesy of Seamheads.
This feature was heavily argued over in Beta. Most testers loved 2-way, one hated it. Sounds like you will be a lover.
__________________
It's madness, madness, I tell you! For the love of God, don't do it!
Spritze is offline   Reply With Quote
Thank you for this post:
DawnBTVS (03-21-2018)
Old 03-21-2018, 02:51 PM   #3
Jerry Helper
Major Leagues
 
Jerry Helper's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Dallas
Posts: 316
Thanks: 305
Thanked 221x in 120 posts
I ran a 60 year HRD sim the other day, just to test some things out. When it was all over, I noticed that Ruth had been a part of the league and remained a pitcher all the way through. But he was also one of the best hitters in the league as well. I don't remember the exact numbers, but he won multiple Cy Youngs and silver slugger awards. Pretty hilarious
Jerry Helper is offline   Reply With Quote
4 thanks for this post:
AESP_pres (03-21-2018), DawnBTVS (03-21-2018), JaBurns (03-21-2018), spartacus007 (03-21-2018)
Old 03-21-2018, 04:36 PM   #4
Spritze
OOTP Historical Czar
 
Spritze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bothell Wa
Posts: 7,208
Thanks: 327
Thanked 3,246x in 1,912 posts
HRD causes this Ruth stuff. In general he pitches for only 2 or 3 years and then OF's. Of course that depends on your other settings as well.
__________________
It's madness, madness, I tell you! For the love of God, don't do it!
Spritze is offline   Reply With Quote
Thank you for this post:
JaBurns (03-21-2018)
Old 03-21-2018, 05:34 PM   #5
scott1964
Hall Of Famer
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Denver
Posts: 4,875
Blog Entries: 19
Thanks: 323
Thanked 595x in 436 posts
wrong timeline
__________________
This just feels more like waiting in line at the Department of Motor Vehicles.



Last edited by scott1964; 03-21-2018 at 05:42 PM.
scott1964 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2018, 06:29 PM   #6
Jerry Helper
Major Leagues
 
Jerry Helper's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Dallas
Posts: 316
Thanks: 305
Thanked 221x in 120 posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spritze View Post
HRD causes this Ruth stuff. In general he pitches for only 2 or 3 years and then OF's. Of course that depends on your other settings as well.
I'm assuming i could just set his position if I was actually playing a HRD? I'd rather he be one or the other if he shows up, just my way of playing.
Jerry Helper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2018, 06:43 PM   #7
Spritze
OOTP Historical Czar
 
Spritze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bothell Wa
Posts: 7,208
Thanks: 327
Thanked 3,246x in 1,912 posts
You can turn off all 2-way-ness or you can edit a player. Thou hast options galore.
__________________
It's madness, madness, I tell you! For the love of God, don't do it!
Spritze is offline   Reply With Quote
Thank you for this post:
Jerry Helper (03-21-2018)
Old 03-21-2018, 07:14 PM   #8
Jeff1787
Hall Of Famer
 
Jeff1787's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Doghouse
Posts: 2,972
Thanks: 419
Thanked 408x in 324 posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spritze View Post
You can turn off all 2-way-ness or you can edit a player. Thou hast options galore.

How would one turn off 2-way other than editing the player?
__________________




Jeff1787 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-21-2018, 07:18 PM   #9
Spritze
OOTP Historical Czar
 
Spritze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bothell Wa
Posts: 7,208
Thanks: 327
Thanked 3,246x in 1,912 posts
stats and ai screen
__________________
It's madness, madness, I tell you! For the love of God, don't do it!
Spritze is offline   Reply With Quote
2 thanks for this post:
JaBurns (03-21-2018), Jeff1787 (03-21-2018)
Old 03-23-2018, 10:31 AM   #10
Orcin
Hall Of Famer
 
Orcin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 9,100
Thanks: 4,211
Thanked 7,948x in 3,871 posts
There is a checkbox in the player strategy section for “use as two-way player”.
__________________


My Fictional Dynasty: Orcin's Story ; The Sequel: Orcin Returns ; The Conclusion: Orcin's Brave New World
Orcin is online now   Reply With Quote
3 thanks for this post:
italyprof (05-01-2018), Jerry Helper (03-23-2018), mitchkenn (03-23-2018)
Old 03-23-2018, 07:31 PM   #11
swampdragon
Hall Of Famer
 
swampdragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Lonely Mountain
Posts: 2,495
Thanks: 136
Thanked 358x in 242 posts
In real life, Spalding was the first of a number of 19th century players to play a position full time after pitching for several years. Watch for Monte Ward and Kid Gleason in the game.. Ward was the best of the 19th century two way players. Once the two man rotation started in the early 1880s, a number of pitchers would play the outfield on the days they didn't pitch. I remember Larry Corcoran, Charlie Buffinton, and Hoss Radbourne.
__________________
“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies." -- C.S. Lewis
swampdragon is offline   Reply With Quote
3 thanks for this post:
AESP_pres (03-26-2018), DawnBTVS (03-24-2018), JaBurns (03-28-2018)
Old 03-28-2018, 02:37 PM   #12
JaBurns
All Star Starter
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: Regina, Saskatchewan
Posts: 1,231
Thanks: 3,659
Thanked 571x in 441 posts
Would Ben Sanders also be on that list? He my HRD in wins one season but was listed as a LF on his player page.
JaBurns is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-29-2018, 12:00 PM   #13
swampdragon
Hall Of Famer
 
swampdragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Lonely Mountain
Posts: 2,495
Thanks: 136
Thanked 358x in 242 posts
I wasn't familiar with Sanders, but he is on the list of 1880s pitchers who were also part time outfielders. His primary position should be pitcher, though. He was the 2nd and 3rd starter for teams based in Philadelphia (all three leagues) from 1888-1891, and for Louisville in 1892, played a little outfield for all of them, but was more of a fourth outfielder than someone they put in the lineup every day.
__________________
“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies." -- C.S. Lewis
swampdragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Thank you for this post:
JaBurns (03-29-2018)
Old 03-30-2018, 08:09 AM   #14
thakfu
Minors (Rookie Ball)
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 39
Thanks: 7
Thanked 11x in 10 posts
I just finished 1914 in my game (no recalc). Ruth was drafted by the Senators and got assigned to their single A affiliate and they actually used him as a 2 way player... pitching in the rotation then playing outfield on his off days. What's interesting is I set his position to the outfield in the draft pool because I wasn't sure how things were going to work and I wanted him to be a position player and the AI still recognized his pitching talent and used him as such. Very cool indeed.
thakfu is offline   Reply With Quote
Thank you for this post:
DawnBTVS (03-31-2018)
Old 04-02-2018, 04:18 PM   #15
Dukie98
All Star Reserve
 
Join Date: Apr 2016
Posts: 710
Thanks: 78
Thanked 215x in 176 posts
In my historic league, Ruth was drafted by Pittsburgh, and initially used exclusively as a pitcher with middling ratings. After about 4-5 years of seeing whether (and when) the game engine would automatically switch him over, I manually converted him to right field, and he immediately began to hit like, well, Babe Ruth...

Fast forward to 1923. I upgraded to OOTP 19 around August of that season, and I realized late in the year that the computer had also moved him into the #1 slot in the rotation (I had given him a modest ratings bump years before to ensure that he would remain in the Pirates' rotation). He ended up the year hitting 47 homers, driving in 134 runs, and going 7-2 with a mid 3's ERA.

Two weird things occurred in the World Series: first, he batted ninth in the two games which he pitched. I assume it's something in the programming which defaults to put the pitcher ninth (or eighth for sabermetrically-inclined managers) -- even though there were times in his career when he pitched and batted cleanup (https://www.baseball-reference.com/p...&t=b&year=1918 ).

The other weird thing was that he was benched in Game Four -- the game before his second start. I'm not sure if that was an attempt to replicate the Angels' anticipated handling of Ohtani. But it sure seems weird to have a healthy Babe Ruth in his prime on the bench of a World Series game. (Appropriately, his replacement hit a three-run homer).

In that series, the Pirates played the Red Sox. Although Smoky Joe Wood had been automatically switched from SP to LF a couple years earlier, he did double duty as a relief pitcher as well.
Dukie98 is offline   Reply With Quote
2 thanks for this post:
JaBurns (04-05-2018), warneke (04-05-2018)
Old 04-04-2018, 10:30 AM   #16
joefromchicago
Hall Of Famer
 
joefromchicago's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 2,713
Thanks: 1,475
Thanked 1,976x in 1,009 posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by swampdragon View Post
Once the two man rotation started in the early 1880s, a number of pitchers would play the outfield on the days they didn't pitch. I remember Larry Corcoran, Charlie Buffinton, and Hoss Radbourne.
That was largely because of the substitution rules that were in effect during the 1880s. For the most part, teams couldn't substitute a bench player for a player on the field except in the case of illness or injury to that starting player. Switching players on the field, however, could be done at any time. So the rule encouraged teams to have their regular "switch pitcher" (i.e. their reliever) play a position on the field. The rules were relaxed somewhat in the late 1880s and the modern substitution rule was enacted in 1891.
joefromchicago is offline   Reply With Quote
2 thanks for this post:
JaBurns (04-05-2018), swampdragon (04-08-2018)
Old 04-08-2018, 08:10 PM   #17
swampdragon
Hall Of Famer
 
swampdragon's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Lonely Mountain
Posts: 2,495
Thanks: 136
Thanked 358x in 242 posts
Look up Bucky Walters as a rarity. He was a borderline position player for several years in the 1930s. The Reds acquired him in a trade and somehow figured out he should be a pitcher. That decision brought the Reds a pennant in 1940, when Walters won 27 games.
__________________
“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies." -- C.S. Lewis
swampdragon is offline   Reply With Quote
Thank you for this post:
JaBurns (04-10-2018)
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
deadball era, early baseball, historical database, two way players

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:29 PM.

 

Major League Baseball trademarks and copyrights are used with permission of MLB Advanced Media, L.P. Minor League Baseball trademarks and copyrights are used with the permission of Minor League Baseball. All rights reserved.

The Major League Baseball Players Association (www.MLBPLAYERS.com ) is the collective bargaining representative for all professional baseball players of the thirty Major League Baseball teams and serves as the exclusive group licensing agent for commercial and licensing activities involving active Major League baseball players. On behalf of its members, it operates the Players Choice licensing program and the Players Choice Awards, which benefit the needy through the Major League Baseball Players Trust, a charitable foundation established and run entirely by Major League baseball players. Follow: @MLB_Players; @MLBPAClubhouse; @MLBPlayersTrust

Out of the Park Baseball is a registered trademark of Out of the Park Developments GmbH & Co. KG

Google Play is a trademark of Google Inc.

Apple, iPhone, iPod touch and iPad are trademarks of Apple Inc., registered in the U.S. and other countries.

COPYRIGHT © 2017 OUT OF THE PARK DEVELOPMENTS. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.

 

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.10
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright © 2018 Out of the Park Developments