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Old 08-10-2008, 01:15 PM   #61
IceTea
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I've been re-rating heavyweights in a similar fashion as above. If anyone wants them, contact me via the below email. I'm mid-way through the 6 rated fighters.

icetea4me@adelphia.net

MJ

Last edited by IceTea; 08-10-2008 at 01:16 PM.
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Old 08-10-2008, 06:56 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceTea View Post
I've been re-rating heavyweights in a similar fashion as above. If anyone wants them, contact me via the below email. I'm mid-way through the 6 rated fighters.

icetea4me@adelphia.net

MJ
Sent you an e-mail.
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Old 08-21-2008, 01:09 AM   #63
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djday45,

Come back!

We miss you!

Ciao,
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Old 08-21-2008, 03:21 AM   #64
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I like this thread too. It is interesting.
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Old 08-23-2008, 11:14 PM   #65
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Ummmmmm.....where did he go?

Break, vacation, or what?

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Old 08-27-2008, 07:22 AM   #66
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hey guys dont panic

hey guys dont worry im here jsut on holiday in portugal at the moment. Will get bk to the thread after im bk at the weekend. Will prob continue to do heavies like i have unless anyone has any specific requests. Glad the Willard rating is working out for you Jersey.

Dean
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Old 08-27-2008, 07:38 AM   #67
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hey guys dont worry im here jsut on holiday in portugal at the moment. Will get bk to the thread after im bk at the weekend. Will prob continue to do heavies like i have unless anyone has any specific requests. Glad the Willard rating is working out for you Jersey.

Dean
Thanks for the update, Dean
I've missed your contributions.

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Old 08-27-2008, 07:43 AM   #68
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Since Dean is in Portugal, would it be fair to say that he has gone into Ibernation?

a bad bear joke
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Old 08-27-2008, 11:53 AM   #69
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lol oh dear oh dear moving swiftly on.

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Old 08-28-2008, 09:04 AM   #70
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Cant decide who to rate next

Hey guys, im bk on sat but been thinking on who to rate next and cant decide so thought I would give you a choice.

The first guy to vote on one of the following is the next fighter I will rate.

From these guys, Charley Mitchell, Joe Choynski, Joe Jeanette, Sam McVey, Sam Langford or Harry Wills.

rgds
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Old 08-28-2008, 09:19 AM   #71
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How was Portugal Dean? I worked with a guy in college from the Azors that had a Eusébio shirt which he wore until it was thread-bare.
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Old 08-28-2008, 09:22 AM   #72
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hey Chris

hey m8 yea its great its my 3rd time over the years very relaxed here in the Algarve.
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Old 08-28-2008, 09:27 AM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djday45 View Post
Hey guys, im bk on sat but been thinking on who to rate next and cant decide so thought I would give you a choice.

The first guy to vote on one of the following is the next fighter I will rate.

From these guys, Charley Mitchell, Joe Choynski, Joe Jeanette, Sam McVey, Sam Langford or Harry Wills.

rgds
Dean
Mitchell
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Old 08-28-2008, 09:41 AM   #74
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Sam Langford please!

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Old 08-28-2008, 10:07 AM   #75
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Mitchell it is

Haha Mitchell gets chosen by a nose lol. Ok will do him on Sunday when im at home.

Rgds
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Old 09-08-2008, 01:12 AM   #76
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I like this thread. When it comes to rating fighters, it's like a home away from home.
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Old 11-13-2008, 09:05 PM   #77
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Charley Mitchell

Ok guys I know ive taken an age to get round to this rating. Apologies real life blah blah lol.

Anyway the official rating for Mitchell is quite shocking in its inacurracy. Im actually quite shocked how bad the rating is.

Here is a guy who is in multiple boxing hall of fames and started his career at lightweight! and went all the way to heavy and was still in the championship picture at each division.

A blown up lightweight fought Sullivan for the heavyweight title!

Style - Slugger. He was not a boxer he was a tough feisty little scrapper very similar in style to Kilrain.

Fouls - Frequently. Again with Kilrain and Sullivan he was a dirty little sob. He was known primarily in the bare knuckle days as a wrestler par excellence. He brought some of this over to the marquis of queensbury rules. He had fouls for all occasions.

Fight Inside - 4 - With Kilrain the best inside fighter of his day. he used clinching and wrestling as a positive boon to his style. Was known to be almost impossible to deal with inside.

Fight Outside - 0. He didnt box. He brawled and wrestled.

Cover Up - 3. He was however very effective in spoiling and smothering attacks. A good defensive fighter in this respect, one of the reasons he was hard to stop.

Knock Out -1. He didnt often go for a stoppage by Ko. But it was possible. Much more often wore guys down inside.

Clinching - 74. He was all about smothering and wrestling inside ring movement would be unknown to him in that era.

Intellect -7. Increase of 2. He was actually quite a cunning clever fighter much more than given credit for.

Control VS Slugger - 11. Way, way out, he controlled the vast amjority of his bouts with the sluggers off his day coming unstuck only against John L, no shame in that.

Chin VS Knockdown -3. Again way out. He had a great chin. Ive only made it 3 because he was still basically a middleweight taking heavyweight firepower and was sometimes hurt.

Recovery - 1. While hurt he usually got back up and foughr back with tenacity.

Absorb Punishment -2. Again he was a brave man taking punches above his weight. he was only stopped in his prime versus Sullivan.

Killer Instinct - 3. He often floored opponents but hardly ever finished them off. Either by accident or design he found it hard to end the fight.

Agressivness -9. Way off, he was very agressive using his wrestling style to constantly be in his opponenents face.

Defense +2. He took punches but maybe less than most of his contemparies at the time.

Hitting Power 5 he often hurt and floored opponents but didnt have the will or power to finish them off in one serving.

Punches Landed 40. He threw an awful lot of leather and sheer volume of punches means im increasing it considerbly to 40. Allied to this he was deceptively skilled as an inside technician of the time.

Counter Punches 36. bumping this up slightly to stay in time with his punches landed.

Overall Rating - 7. bumps him way up from his idiotic 3. putting him in Kilrains league but Sullivan will still make short work of him.

Last edited by djday45; 11-14-2008 at 01:43 AM.
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Old 11-14-2008, 06:41 PM   #78
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I just came rolling in here for the first time. I had no idea what I was missing!

Thanks for not only the re-rating, but the significant background and rationale behind it. It brings the game alive.

The fact that my interests primarily lie in this era of boxing history makes this an even bigger gift.

Thanks!
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Old 11-14-2008, 06:49 PM   #79
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Dola, I'll be looking forward to your take on several other fighters of this era that I suspect may be off - guys like Jimmy Elliot, Joe Butler, Frank Childs, and Paddy Slavin. Perhaps Peter Maher as well.
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Old 11-14-2008, 11:14 PM   #80
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Peter Maher

Hey Big Matt, thks for the kind words. You ask and you shall receive! Here is Maher a fascinating fighter of total contradictions if he is rated right.

Style - Slugger. Really not a boxer/puncher he was an all out dangerous slugger.

Fight Outside - 1. He had little in the way of boxing skill. He was a puncher.

Cover Up - 0. Again little boxing skill or nous when it came to defending himself he was knocked out rather a lot.

Knockout - 3. Always his first and probably only tactic was to take the other guys head off.

Clinching - 73. All these early brawlers/sluggers from boxings early days could lose a little movement. Maher is no execption.

Conditioning - 9. The conditioning rating is where you can really make the boxers personality shine if you do a little digging and take some chances. Im going with headcase for him as he was the very model of inconsistency during his career with one sided blow outs being the norm for him on both sides of the fence.

Intellect - 3. Again reducing this way down. To make the great boxers special you must really guard against makjing everyone average in catergories I feel. Give them the real strengths and weaknessess they had in life. He was known for being a face first slugger of dangerous power but weak chin. ring intelligence didnt come into it lol.

Control Vs. Boxer - 8. He was a serious contender during his time so am increasing both control factors by a point. if we use control 10 as a benchmark for a contender then he would be a little off off that as his skill set as a ring general wasant great but not way off that benchmark.

Control VS. Slugger - 9. See above, slightly more at home against these guys.

Control VS. Knockdown - 3. Mahers chin was weak, but not in an obvious way. If you research him, time and time again you read once hurt he was knocked down multiple times so im going to improve this rating by a point but at the same time worsen his recovery by 2.
This should ensure once he gets hurt hes in a world of hurt but should stiffen him slightly until that occurs which models him nicely.

Recovery - 6. See above. Jesus he will be bounced around like a bowling pin once hes been down once, which happened to him again and again, he was stopped a lot!

Resistance to cuts - 1. Again during the era taking this down a notch quite often to reflect the time period unless it was clearly documented they had a problem with cuts.

Absorb Punishment - 2. Improving this a notch. He was a brave man, he had to be he kept getting back up!. to ensure he is in the contest long enough to go down multiple times in a round often we make a little adjustment here.

Agressivness - 9. Very agressive puncher, which was a real boon and a weakness as well.

Defense- +5. What defense? Ive worsened this a lot as he was known as powerful but had no skills as such. His style was a fast face first puncher.

Fight on Ropes - 3. I would make this the standard in the era and maybe always to make the great guys stand out.

Hitting Power - 11. Way up. He was known as one of the most powerful punchers of the era. He had over 40 stoppages to his name in an era of not ending fights quickly. This and his speed was his strength, what made him a contender despite his other shortcomings. an 11 is a great score for guys like this. Power enough to do lots and lots of damage but unless documented we dont want them into the all time great ranges of power.

Punches Landed - 40. He is documented as fast. with hurtful spiteful blows of speed and power. now if we take 38 as the average for a contender type of guy, then he should be above this, his documented lack of skill however forces me to limit his here. 41 and above should be limited to the masters of speed and skill.

Counterpunching - 34. Reducing this down a notch due to his lack of boxing skills seems appropriate. I have no problem against changing the perceived range of punches landed/counterpunching ratio especially if it points up a guys style.

Overall Rating - 6. He rises to a 6 which is still low for him to be a main contender but if we look at how he will do against the often pretty unskilled competition of his era its actually fine. His fights will be very exciting he will sometimes pull a result out of the bag which shocks you and more often he will be on the receiving end of a total shocker. As it should be.
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