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Old 02-06-2020, 03:07 AM   #101
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Originally Posted by qcbandits View Post
What's hard to understand? Betts has repeatedly told management he was going to become a Fa. It would have been [dumb] to allow a player of his caliber to walk for a draft pick
They could have signed him
As far as I know, Betts never said he wouldn't consider a competitive offer from the Red Sox
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Old 02-06-2020, 04:15 AM   #102
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They could have signed him
As far as I know, Betts never said he wouldn't consider a competitive offer from the Red Sox
They were a reported 120 million dollars apart. They weren't resigning him.
He turned down 10 Yrs 300 million

After a Google search, Betts and the Red Sox have made zero progress over the last three years, being over 100 million apart each offseason

Last edited by qcbandits; 02-06-2020 at 04:30 AM.
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Old 02-06-2020, 04:28 AM   #103
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People forget to look at this two ways.

Henry, the owner, who has, literally, billions of dollars, and owns two major sports franchises that basically print money for him, didn't give Betts (one of MLB's best players) what Betts wanted to stay (we don't know what Betts wanted, the reported 10 year, $30 million offer was not enough for a player of Betts' caliber). Given the info we have, and some reasonable assumptions, this looks bad for Henry.


Bloom has to operate under Henry's demands. Assuming Henry told Bloom to get under the CBT threshold, Bloom did what he could. The Red Sox lost their best player. That's never good. But they still have a reasonable shot at the playoffs. If they'd tried to cut the same amount of money and keep Betts, they'd probably be in worse shape.

tl;dr: Henry put Bloom in a tough spot
Just bc an owner has billions of dollars doesn't mean he can spend money without complications. The Red Sox are tTHE worst offenders ever of the CBT. They are the ONLY team to ever have their top draft pick dropped 10 spots and it was only going to continue to get worse. They have one of the worst farm systems in all of baseball and have an old over priced core. Bloom would never have allowed things to continue at this pace regardless. Look at his work in Tb. He's all about building a sustainable minor league system so that his team doesn't have CBT concerns. The fact that he was able to get rid of even 50% of the dead weight in that Price contract is amazing. That guy is paid to be an ace, and wouldn't be more than a fourth starter on a good team. Plus, the Red sox as a team are in a terrible place right now, they need at least 2 dependable mid rotation starters, they need bullpen help, they need a CF'er who can do more than play D. The platoon they look to use at 1b is horrible. Boegarts needds to be moved off SS bc he's not a good defensive SS. Who knows if Vasquez will continue to be anything more than a glove only C? Last year was the only time in his career that he's hit. They really only have Devers, Benintendi and Boegarts (bat at least) as pieces that are worth counting on. Pitching wise, Sale is past his prime, and that leaves Rodriguez as the closest thing to a sure thing. JD Martinez opting in screwed their financial situation to the point they had to make this play now rather than in July. Bc in July, with only a half season of control, there is no way Bloom could have attached Price to Betts and gotten anything at all. At least by doing it now, he got himself 2/3s of a young talented OF and a potential stud SP/Late inning reliever, depending on how he develops. Most importantly, this will reset their CBT penalties, and they can be active in the next couple Fa classes to build their major league team back up while Bloom rebuilds that atrocious minor league system.
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Old 02-06-2020, 10:36 AM   #104
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It seems to me that whole endgame of Minor League development is to potentially find a superstar like Mookie Betts, so not doing everything to keep that player is odd to me.
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Old 02-06-2020, 10:40 AM   #105
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They were a reported 120 million dollars apart. They weren't resigning him.
He turned down 10 Yrs 300 million

After a Google search, Betts and the Red Sox have made zero progress over the last three years, being over 100 million apart each offseason
They were $100 million apart because the Red Sox" offer was ridiculously low.

Reminder, Henry (or his agents) bargained for the CBT rules (you often hear this applied to players when something goes against them but not to owners, wonder why that is?). He could easily ask his billionaire buddies to change the rules so teams can give more money to the players without facing such odious penalties for doing so

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Old 02-06-2020, 11:35 AM   #106
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They were $100 million apart because the Red Sox" offer was ridiculously low.

Reminder, Henry (or his agents) bargained for the CBT rules (you often hear this applied to players when something goes against them but not to owners, wonder why that is?). He could easily ask his billionaire buddies to change the rules so teams can give more money to the players without facing such odious penalties for doing so
300 million for 10 years is ridiculously low? WTF! You must be crazy
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Old 02-06-2020, 11:49 AM   #107
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300 million for 10 years is ridiculously low? WTF! You must be crazy
It just might be a lunatic you're looking for

A-Rod got 10/$275 over a decade ago
Cole, a pitcher, who's older, got 9/$324
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Old 02-06-2020, 12:05 PM   #108
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So it seems that 300 million was rather close to market value.
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Old 02-06-2020, 12:11 PM   #109
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Trout got $430m over 12 years recently, too.
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Old 02-06-2020, 12:12 PM   #110
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So it seems that 300 million was rather close to market value.
If you think that market value hasn't increased in 12 years or that a 27 year old outfielder isn't as valuable as a 29 year old pitcher
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Old 02-06-2020, 12:15 PM   #111
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Trout got $430m over 12 years recently, too.
And Betts is a damn good player but no where near Trout's level
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Old 02-06-2020, 12:51 PM   #112
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And Betts is a damn good player but no where near Trout's level
He’s not, but that was the Angels putting down money to keep their superstar. Maybe Betts wanted more of a ‘statement’ offer, I dno

Interesting if they did start at 10/300 given Bryce Harper last season, I think that’s what the Nats offered?
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Old 02-06-2020, 12:57 PM   #113
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I'm not saying that Betts doesn't deserve a good contract but when he kept shutting down negotiations when Bostons offers were fair beginning starting places. I think it shows that Betts was never going to stay in Boston without hitting the open market and the bidding war that will ensue. Maybe Boston jumps in on the bidding war? But why not shed Price's ugly deal and get a couple good young players considering that Boston has way too many holes to compete in the AL East?
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Old 02-07-2020, 12:26 PM   #114
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The Betts deal is no longer certain. The medical reports on the "stud prospect" Brusdar Graterol are poor enough for Boston to want to re-open the deal before it becomes final.

One link that is optimistic the deal gets done is here:

https://nesn.com/2020/02/mlb-rumors-...e-betts-trade/
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Old 02-07-2020, 03:35 PM   #115
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The Betts deal is no longer certain. The medical reports on the "stud prospect" Brusdar Graterol are poor enough for Boston to want to re-open the deal before it becomes final.

One link that is optimistic the deal gets done is here:

https://nesn.com/2020/02/mlb-rumors-...e-betts-trade/
I have a question about this for you or anyone else that knows this situation better than I do. Did Graterol pass the physical or not? If he did then why is the deal being held up? Why does this feel like Boston is trying to find a loophole because they underestimated how unpopular this deal has been? I guess it brings up questions about what passing a physical means?
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Old 02-07-2020, 04:32 PM   #116
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I have a question about this for you or anyone else that knows this situation better than I do. Did Graterol pass the physical or not? If he did then why is the deal being held up? Why does this feel like Boston is trying to find a loophole because they underestimated how unpopular this deal has been? I guess it brings up questions about what passing a physical means?
Based on what some reporters have said, they see him more as a reliever after seeing his medicals and how his body has responded to his injuries, which obviously changes his value to them
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Old 02-07-2020, 04:36 PM   #117
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Based on what some reporters have said, they see him more as a reliever after seeing his medicals and how his body has responded to his injuries, which obviously changes his value to them
So this is a case of rushing to announce a deal before checking off all the boxes first.
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Old 02-07-2020, 04:52 PM   #118
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So this is a case of rushing to announce a deal before checking off all the boxes first.
By the media, yes.
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Old 02-07-2020, 06:16 PM   #119
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Well, speaking as a Dodger fan, I hope the deal gets done but might be happy to see it modified. Not wild about - essentially - a swap of Maeda for Price. Also not wild about losing Joc Pederson, but at least from a cost and "outfield room" perspectives, I get it... Since the deal is in question, I'd rather see a) the Twins 86'd out of the deal, b) the Dodgers to throw in a couple prospects, c) Maeda stays with LA, and d) the BoSox find some other team to take on Price.

Also, in the grand scheme of things, I don't think the Dodgers are getting adequate on-the-field value in return for Verdugo, Maeda, Stripling, and Pederson.

IOW, I think that Verdugo/Maeda/Pederson/Stripling are (slightly, as a sum total) better players than Betts/Price/infielder-from-Angels, with Maeda being the main under-valued player... Perhaps it's the financial aspect that evens it out.
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Old 02-09-2020, 07:58 PM   #120
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So this is a case of rushing to announce a deal before checking off all the boxes first.
Looks like Mookie is finally on his way to LAD .... pending medicals
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