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OOTP 14 - General Discussions Discuss the new 2013 version of Out of the Park Baseball here! |
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04-24-2013, 07:29 PM | #21 | |
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Team-building with Billy Beane and Theo Epstein
Team-building with Billy Beane and Theo Epstein | Red Sox Blog | providencejournal.com | The Providence Journal Quote:
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04-24-2013, 07:42 PM | #22 | |
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04-24-2013, 08:45 PM | #23 | |
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This post gave me an interesting idea. Maybe there could be three (hidden? hinted at?) general player characteristics. They are the following: A B C A gets a morale bonus when interacting with A A is unaffected by B A gets a morale penalty when intereacting with C C gets a morale bonus when interacting with C C is unaffected by B C gets a morale penalty when interacting with A B's are neutral. 66% are B's 17% are A's 17% are C's These bonuses/penalties are based upon the total composition of the roster. The personality types of the leaders on the team magnify the effect. i.e. players with high leader ability modify the team total composition more than players with lower leader abilities. Coaches more so up to the manager with the greatest impact. This is the basic idea...I'm sure that it could be expounded upon. It would need to be balanced, meaningful, and minor.
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04-25-2013, 02:11 AM | #24 | |
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The Giants had incredible team chemistry prior to coming back from two elimination games in the playoffs. Winning the World Series only improved the perception of great chemistry. Had they lost to Detroit, their team chemistry would have still been viewed as strong. I view Detroit's 2012 team chemistry as strong, despite their World Series loss. Having played team sports for the majority of my young adult life, I can directly attest to both positive and poor team chemistry. Winning certainly helps aid chemistry, but I've played on teams with poor chemistry and winning records. |
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04-25-2013, 03:01 AM | #25 |
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After a losing championship game or series one would never say that it sucks to lose but at least we had good chemistry. OTOH after winning it all one would never say that the championship is great but out team chemistry sucked.
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Cheers RichW #stopthestupid “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit |
04-25-2013, 03:39 AM | #26 | |
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Don't quote me and then not actually read what I typed. |
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04-25-2013, 03:39 AM | #27 | |
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On the other side of the argument, look at the Baltimore Ravens. The team wins the Superbowl, then subsequently gets gutted from within by financial opportunism. Players demand the big bucks because they're a champion who, as it turns out, just so happen to to have their contract up for extension. Also, some players leave the team because, although they won the championship, they were individually willing to put up with some crap in order to win. Now that the winning is done, they're gone, man! Anyhow, regardless of the inner workings of OOTP, it sure seems that a foundation exists that we might see as a "chemistry" factor. Even if it's a random effect on the game, some might see it as "chemistry" while others may never experience it. Sure is fun though, isn't it? |
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04-25-2013, 05:57 AM | #28 |
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Somewhat akin to this question - are there any OOTP performance advantages to having the same players year after year due to familiarity playing with the same teammates? Like the feature in FOF2k7 where players who've played together, on the same team for a long time, add to the "Team Cohesion"?
While I think the personality conflict/affinity modelling in that other game is far too overdone, and don't use that facet at all, I believe the cohesion thing to be a good idea. Does OOTP model something similar? Sorry for a bit of a sidetrack here, but I thought this somewhat related to the topic. |
04-25-2013, 09:07 AM | #29 | |
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I didn't quote you. Why be hostile? It's a good discussion and I bear no malice. Edit Chemistry is a value, to some. This discussion proves it.
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Cheers RichW #stopthestupid “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit Last edited by RchW; 04-25-2013 at 09:20 AM. Reason: info |
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04-25-2013, 09:10 AM | #30 | ||
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If "chemistry" doesn't have an effect on performance, then that's even more reason not to introduce any kind of "chemistry" element into OOTP. |
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04-25-2013, 10:27 AM | #31 | |
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Chemistry is something made up in the media along with "clutch" since they need to be able to sell storylines to casual fans since most don't understand statistics and variance. |
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04-25-2013, 11:21 AM | #32 | |
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Cheers RichW #stopthestupid “Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit |
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07-02-2014, 09:53 AM | #33 |
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I found this thread very interesting, and it relates directly to an experience I'm having now, months and months after this discussion took place.
My Brewers modern day team was in first place in a pretty mediocre division by the end of May in an online league (started in 2012, currently in 2014 season). We went 1-0 in March, 16-11 in April, and 15-13 in May. Towards the very end of May, I end up calling up the following AAA player: AAA .289/.396/.614 114 AB 23 R 33 H 7 2B 3 3B 8 HR 28 RBI 20 BB 24 K 2 SB His personality is listed as "often being a distraction to the team with his bad attitude." We end up going 9-19 in June, but he produces the following line: .336/.377/.644 149 AB 22 R 50 H 4 2B 0 3B 14 HR 32 RBI 8 BB 30 K 3 SB So is he part of the problem, or part of the solution? FWIW, days after him being called up, I get an email about how my "bench" RF who was starting before him got into a fight, or was upset with this AAA player, or something along those lines. Point being, the issue was brought to my attention. I sent the player back to AAA for a few games because the sudden losses had me worried, but he was producing too much for me to leave him in AAA. Thoughts?! Thanks! |
07-04-2014, 09:54 PM | #34 |
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This is a difficult question. Lets think of ball teams like our work places. After watching the olympics and looking at baseball stats I am going to assume most top athletes are close enough to eachother in how far they can hit the ball or what not.
I know for sure at my workplace when we have had terrible personalties on board we all suffered. Good leadership lessened it. Bad or a lack of leadership made it worse. Problems seem like a bigger deal. I am distracted from logistics (or studying film if this were baseball) by having to babysit and think about babysitting. So yes I believe in chemistry and leadership. I also believe and believe the game has it modeled, that winning fixes all but the most obnoxous problems and losing makes them worse. Like at work when we have too big of a jerk on the force. On big money days all is ok, but in the dog days of summer he whines and causes the whole place to suck. |
07-11-2014, 11:57 AM | #35 |
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It's a mystery. I've never seen Markus explain exactly how he's programmed it, much like how baseball gods never speak.
Anecdotally, I've had more success completely ignoring it than specifically building a team with it. |
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