Hey, is this tanking, shrewd managing, or just plain unethical?

[rburgh]

If you buy enough of them, you can fall into a perfect card or two. It's the only way out if the incremental upgrade hell other than tanking.

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by Ron2112

This leads to the question I'll ask next (because I'm new): can you get more points by tanking and farming "easy" achievements than you can get from rewards by winning your league?

If the answer is "yes", then perhaps there should be a few more incentives for doing well.....?

You can get a *ton* of PP from having a couple of really good games. Ironically, this guy's tanking strategy has given *me* somewhere around 15,000PP over the past 3 days. If you score 20 runs in a game, you get 400PP. If you get 9 hits in an inning, which often happens in a 20-run game, you get 400PP. If you have like 6 guys on your team getting individual achievements, that can be another 200PP in that game.

You also get a decent amount of points for finishing the season with a high game score, which is basically a measure of how you did in the regular season and playoffs, as well as winning Gold Glove and Silver Slugger awards (the latter of which, of course, you can earn by playing a lineup of Diamond-quality players in a Stone league), making the All-Star Game (ditto), and having guys go on long run, RBI, HR, and hitting streaks (double ditto). So... as a recipient of all of this great luck (I mean, now thanks to this guy *I* have a roster with 5 diamond players on it in Stone League, with one more team mission away from a 6th), I agree that it's a bit unfair to accrue all of this on the lower levels. I realize that this would probably puncture some of the desire to play to win, but I agree that the higher levels should get you more points for the same stuff (even if it means the lower levels get you less).

[One Great Matrix]

Originally Posted by Syd Thrift

I don’t know, man, there’s no “natural animosity” here; teams are just a bunch of 1s and 0s. In order for people to “dislike” you, you’ve got to do some pretty shady crap, whether it’s blatantly illegal by the rules or just horribly against the spirit of them. This particular issue I think you could resolve more equitably the way I noted, which is to stop giving out any award PPs if your team fails to meet certain relatively easy to meet thresholds. But that does require extra coding, plus less leeway to bend the rules for someone who is just not doing well or doesn’t get basic aspects of the game, perhaps...

That guy by the way us still up to his current shenanigans. His team ERA is up around 9 and his main roster has a whole bunch of diamond quality players on it...

Well, that's what the ha was for... I kind of meant it would clear up though exactly what happens, not animosity exactly, but people calling out another team's strategy as unfair...essentially they don't like it...I'm not sure I myself anyway can define cheating. I certainly don't know everything that goes on but when I see posts they are often in the tone of "I don't like the way they are going about their business."

Like the example you gave. If you don't dislike the manager you do think it's very shady how he's going about things...?

[RISHIdanPort]

I feel like this may be someone who is trying weird things just to see what happens. It reminds me of the 26 Mike Trouts experiment from The Show. They might not realize how much it's warping the rest of the league.

[Syd Thrift]

So... I took another look at this team and it's actually even worse than I thought. He's starting 97 SE Jeff Bagwell at *shortstop* and 91 SE Eddie Matthews at second base. Even though he has 92 Special Edition Ichiro available to play the outfield, he's choosing to play *him* out of position too at first base while his actual OF is Billy Williams in left, Duke Snider in center (which, hey, at least he played there IRL), and Carl Yastrzemski in right. 100 Christian Yelich, a left fielder, is his third baseman.

As a result of all of that, his *team*'s ERA is almost 12, and the impact of that team on our conference is that our league ERA is a full run higher than the other guy's (4.93 to 3.92).

I take back anything I said about this being "shrewd". This is cheating, pure and simple; the guy's blatantly making his defense so bad that they'll get relegated, at which point he'll either start playing people in the right places (which alone would probably get them promoted out of Rookie levels with 110+ wins) or else he'll keep tanking at that level to accrue points for oversized batting numbers. I've re-reported him with this information and hopefully action will be taken.

On a related note, I'm sure that OOTP doesn't publicly broadcast that they've warned or banned a player, but is there any way to tell that someone's account has been suspended for unfair play?

[bailey]

You were advised by a moderator to report teams like this and not point it out on the forum? Maybe your behavior should be reported, too?

I reported a team on the weekend and the issue was fixed by the next day, a Sunday.

[bailey]

I tried moving 92 Ichiro to 1B--it's an invalid position and the game won't let me move him there

LF Billy Williams -- that's the position on his card
CF Duke Snider -- That's my starting CF for Hamtramck! REPORT me!!
RF Yaz -- I've thought about playing him there, too, for training and later flexibility.

[bwiese3908]

Originally Posted by bailey

I tried moving 92 Ichiro to 1B--it's an invalid position and the game won't let me move him there

LF Billy Williams -- that's the position on his card
CF Duke Snider -- That's my starting CF for Hamtramck! REPORT me!!
RF Yaz -- I've thought about playing him there, too, for training and later flexibility.

I am REPORTING you ALL for AMUSING me!!

[Syd Thrift]

Originally Posted by bailey

I tried moving 92 Ichiro to 1B--it's an invalid position and the game won't let me move him there

LF Billy Williams -- that's the position on his card
CF Duke Snider -- That's my starting CF for Hamtramck! REPORT me!!
RF Yaz -- I've thought about playing him there, too, for training and later flexibility.

I don't know how he did it, but he did it.

As for Yaz and Williams, yeah, it's not a big deal but I think that pretty clearly you'd play Williams in right in that situation (well, you'd put Yaz at first but still). As noted, the really huge bits are how they somehow managed to put guys out of position at SS and 3B. I agree that at least over the past couple weeks even if I try to take those cards and move them, I can't; the user probably put them in those slots before they released a patch to not let you do so anymore, or else they're hacking.

[BatAround]

Originally Posted by bailey

You were advised by a moderator to report teams like this and not point it out on the forum? Maybe your behavior should be reported, too?

I reported a team on the weekend and the issue was fixed by the next day, a Sunday.

Can't disagree enough with your position, and the implication that it shouldn't be made public. I never would have thought to look for these things unless I read the thread. It's very informative.

[One Great Matrix]

As rare as it is for practical purposes you can put anyone you'd like at first base, can't you...Bailey? Or are there a few sanity check no-no's on putting certain players out of position?

If I was goofing around with a team I might want to try to train a guy anywhere, I think all the cards come with some learning potential...except maybe at pitcher.

I think Bailey says and does whatever he wants. hehe

[bailey]

OK, you can play Suzuki at 1B. When I moved Suzuki to 1B, I moved him on top of a player in the depth chart and I got an error message. However, if the 1B spot is empty, he goes there just fine.

[One Great Matrix]

Originally Posted by bailey

OK, you can play Suzuki at 1B. When I moved Suzuki to 1B, I moved him on top of a player in the depth chart and I got an error message. However, if the 1B spot is empty, he goes there just fine.

Ha...hmm.

Well, anyway...I must be thirsty.
Your username just makes me think of that Bailey's stuff at the liquor store in town. Good stuff.
And a dog. Bailey the dog. ?

[Coriolanus]

or Bailey, the "real" hot one, from WKRP?

[HelpDodgers]

LOL, this is PP tanking... but I am not saying who it is...

[One Great Matrix]

Originally Posted by Coriolanus

or Bailey, the "real" hot one, from WKRP?

Not familiar with WKRP

[BatAround]

Originally Posted by One Great Matrix

Not familiar with WKRP

Oh, geez, now I feel old.

[ignats75]

Originally Posted by One Great Matrix

Not familiar with WKRP

Yikes! I was in radio back when this show was on. Real life wasn't THAT different. Except, there was no Bailey where I was. Boy did I have a crush on her back then.

[ignats75]

Yesterday, I beat a team 31-0. I posted about it as I reaped about 11,000 PPs from that one game. A bunch of people came on the thread to point out it was tanking. I'm such a by the rules guy, the thought never crossed my mind. When I get trouble, its for pissing Kris Jardine off during a podcast (for which I did provately apologize. Kris was cool about it.)

I was reminded about this, because I am just now going to face that team again in Silver 278. So I looked at his(or her) team closely.

2 Gold and 3 Silver SPs. 2 G and 5 Diamond SPs in reserve. (Including a 99 Maddux)

4 Silver and 3 Gold RPs with 1 gold and a ton of silver in reserve.

Catcher 1 Gold 1 Silver and 100 Yogi on Reserve Roster

1B 2 Gold with 97 Bagwell on reserve roster

2B 1 Gold with 97 Cano on reserve roster

3B 91 Matthews on roster

SS 2 Gold with 91 Tulowitzski on reserve roster

LF 2 Golds with 99 Yaz on reserve roster

CF 1 Silver with 96 Duke Snider on reserve roster

RF 2 Golds with nothing of note in reserve.


So the question is, Is this really tanking? Its a pretty good silver team. I looked at the boxscore from last month and he played it straight with his lineup. Everyone playing legit positions; power in the middle; good OBP at top. The only thing strange was that his leadoff hitter was a catcher. But he had good steals ratings. But he had a 60 contact and 80 aviod Ks. His eye was poor.

So if he's tanking, its subtle. But I'm not sure I can make a case for sure.

HOWEVER. Look at this Pitching line. How does the game engine do this?

[Cowboys3356]

I dont understand losing on purpose to stay in the lower levels. I did my best even in Entry league so I could start in Iron League and not have the stain of Rookie or Stone league on my team resume. Now that I am in Diamond if i ever fall to Gold I would probably quit in shame.