Player Ratings

[killershrew]

Originally Posted by olivertheorem

I'm still kind of wondering how, in a world of no overall rating, how one is going to sort through free agents.

Don't worry! You'll get it!

Try going to the FM boards and suggest overall ratings and they'll roll you in tar and feathers!

I would make it an option anyway to please people although i much prefer playing without an overall.

[Sam C]

Originally Posted by killershrew

Scouting in HC09 might not have been completely realistic but it was complex and fun!

Scouting in HC09 went:

*In season scouting during season (to max 33% of knowledge)
You elected every weak to scout a position and a level of colleges (big, medium, small)

*Combine
There was a set number of players you could concentrate on in every position. You would get to see the physical tests report before deciding witch players to home in on so you could check out that 6'4" HB who ran the 40 in 4.30 (Anyone remember Jarvin Warren? ) I'm not sure how the number of players was decided but i think it had to do with the GM's skills.

*Pro Days
In pro days you had to select wich college to concentrate on from the colleges having pro days on the same day.

*Individual workouts
You got a number of ind. workouts where invited players would immediately go to 100% scouted. This was one of very few ways to unlock their final value, the potential! (There were some GM traits that randomly unlocked POT value for some players at the beginning of the scouting period also.

Another thing that made scouting very interesting was that other teams would know who you talked to and what players were invited for workouts (something that always bothered me was that i never knew who they invited!) so if you put alot of time into researching this typical 4th rounder to see if ou could use him he might move up to the bottom of the third because of the attention and you'd miss out. Then again if you didn devote resources to scouting later rounds you would be picking blindly. It had a nice balance.

It had alot of layers and felt complex, probably more complex than it actually was but I'll take that system over the current system any day.

That's a pretty good summary and I never realised that your individual workout players became common knowledge amongst other teams.

I've always had a rose tinted view of the the scouting/draft process in HC09 but the more I think about it, it is pretty flawed.

It is time consuming choosing all the colleges that you wanted to scout and in the end, I left that part to the GM, with a focus on team needs or whatever my blind spot was out of Big, Medium or Small Schools.

Having a good GM rating was crucial and the part that was most unrealistic was that you'd have perfect scouting information on 50-100 players but hardly know anything about everybody else. NFL franchises have exhaustive data and scout reports on all players but its the interpretation of that data and draft strategy that separates the wheat from the chaff.

I also loved the real player comparisons in HC '09. How many people have scrolled down the Quarterback list and read "Jared Lorenzen, Jared Lorenzen, Jared Lorenzen, Tom Brady, Jared Lorenzen". Luckily, none of the other teams ever saw this and you could always pick up Tristan Riley in the later rounds while everybody else was selecting busts.

[killershrew]

Originally Posted by Sam C

That's a pretty good summary and I never realised that your individual workout players became common knowledge amongst other teams.

I've always had a rose tinted view of the the scouting/draft process in HC09 but the more I think about it, it is pretty flawed.

It is time consuming choosing all the colleges that you wanted to scout and in the end, I left that part to the GM, with a focus on team needs or whatever my blind spot was out of Big, Medium or Small Schools.

Having a good GM rating was crucial and the part that was most unrealistic was that you'd have perfect scouting information on 50-100 players but hardly know anything about everybody else. NFL franchises have exhaustive data and scout reports on all players but its the interpretation of that data and draft strategy that separates the wheat from the chaff.

I also loved the real player comparisons in HC '09. How many people have scrolled down the Quarterback list and read "Jared Lorenzen, Jared Lorenzen, Jared Lorenzen, Tom Brady, Jared Lorenzen". Luckily, none of the other teams ever saw this and you could always pick up Tristan Riley in the later rounds while everybody else was selecting busts.

Yeah the comparison was a good feature but it wasn't perfectly implemented. As you said it often would say 80% of the players at a certain position compared to the same guy and if I remember correctly it only applied to attributes not measurables so a 5'9" QB might compare to Big Ben because of attributes.

[killershrew]

Also I forgot about the college allstar game scouting in HC09. It was like the combine scouting but without getting the measurables first and generally with lower tier players than the combine.

There's a video where you can see some of those features like allstar and combine scouting. Turn off the sound, the guy narrating is extremely annoying.

NFL Head Coach 09 Career Mode Changing History Episode 1 Introduction, Scouting, and FA - YouTube

[Francis Cole]

That system doesn't sound a million miles away from what I have planned anyway.

[Cryomaniac]

Originally Posted by dave1927p

and what is comparable to that in football? ...like hockey, football is tougher game to tackle for stat based sims.

I think there are some comparable stats (I seem to think there's an Adjusted Passer Rating or something for QBs), but you do have a point.

[SirMichaelJordan]

Originally Posted by killershrew

Don't worry! You'll get it!

Try going to the FM boards and suggest overall ratings and they'll roll you in tar and feathers!

I would make it an option anyway to please people although i much prefer playing without an overall.

FM has the star ratings which is not a traditional OVR we are used to but it's still an OVR. It's just in more detail than a specific universal number.

It tells how good a player is relative to the team/league and how good they are at a roles/position.

That would be great for a nfl game.

[killershrew]

True but its based on your scouts evaluation and could be way off if your scout is hopeless if i am not mistaken. Havent played much fm since 09.

[SirMichaelJordan]

Originally Posted by killershrew

True but its based on your scouts evaluation and could be way off if your scout is hopeless if i am not mistaken. Havent played much fm since 09.

Yea it's based on scouts if you have fog of war on (which I always play with)

The OVR in OOTP is based on scouts accuracy as well but I turn off OVR in that game after I get my AI evaluation settings right.

[Francis Cole]

Unless it's changed recently in FM, not only is it based on the player, but it's also based on your team and your existing players.

[goalieump413]

Originally Posted by Francis Cole

Unless it's changed recently in FM, not only is it based on the player, but it's also based on your team and your existing players.

The player ratings from HC09 did the same thing. A player might appear to the Giants as a 95, but to the Colts as a 88 due to specific systems each team runs, and how solid their scouting was.

This means there is a very subjective view of players in football, not so objective, since each player in football has to fit into his role more precisely than in baseball. In baseball, you can get away with a guy who can play both 2B and SS as a starter or utility guy, but in football, you wouldn't put your HB in as a FB or TE as a secondary position (except for goal line maybe).

This subjectivity also applies to coaches or other team personnel.

[SirMichaelJordan]

Originally Posted by Francis Cole

Unless it's changed recently in FM, not only is it based on the player, but it's also based on your team and your existing players.

Yes.

And now they have 5* ratings for positions/roles that you can reference when building your tactic. A certain Striker may be a 5* world class player but he may only register a 3* rating as a Target man rather than a 5* as a Proacher (his attributes are more suited for a Proacher role) It's really no different than what you said about sorting through tall speedy receivers if you want a receiver to stretch the field. Those specific WR's would be highly valuable for an offense for that style of play.

[ruckuz]

Will you be able to change ratings during anytime of the season?

[Francis Cole]

The player attributes?

You can go to the player editor any time you wish and change their attributes.

[ruckuz]

Originally Posted by Francis Cole

The player attributes?

You can go to the player editor any time you wish and change their attributes.

Thanks cole,

Will I able to alter Player salary, age, height, weight also?

[Francis Cole]

Can't remember about age, but yes to the other 3.

[dumbrabbit]

Originally Posted by Francis Cole

Can't remember about age, but yes to the other 3.

Any reason to think we wouldn't be able to change the age?

[Francis Cole]

I'm not sure yet on the knock on effect if you change a player to be older/younger than his history (stats,draft year,credited seasons etc) would indicate.

[ruckuz]

Originally Posted by Francis Cole

I'm not sure yet on the knock on effect if you change a player to be older/younger than his history (stats,draft year,credited seasons etc) would indicate.

Ya i can see how altering age can get messy. Thats okay. As long as we can edit attributes of a player to our personal preference anytime of the season will be good enough for me.

[Ceithearn]

Perhaps this post doesn't fit perfectly under player ratings, but as this is a popular thread here goes:

Really enjoy in the NCAA football game that by pushing the right stick down you see if the player is in the zone and playing well or in Fifa an arrow indicates current form. Would be enjoyable to see some indication of how well a player is playing. If his mean rating is 84 he can trend up or down a little, showing blue if he is cold or a brighter color if hot. This is more about the emotion generated by the simulation/game and not necessarily about having a large impact on the performance of a player. Love seeing a player that has been scouted, drafted and developed by the team doing well and trending up in performance. Again, this is more of an emotional/fun perk and not intended to largely impact the performance of a player. On the other hand you don't want to go over board on the graphic either, too many players in the console game show "cold" when they are actually performing pretty well. A nice subtle indication of how the player is playing/developing would be entertaining.