All Star/HOF Voting--Any Chance on Elaboration?

Trebro · 01-23-2015, 11:01 PM

Is there any chance someone could talk a bit more about how the voting is going to work?

I know most folks want the roster stuff--which is outstanding, by the way--but it's the extra record-keeping that interests me most, in terms of looking at budgeting for an upgrade.

Thanks!

Matt Arnold · 01-24-2015, 06:53 AM

Things are still liable to change, but as of now, it's done by the AI. Each year, I use a combination of metrics (Jaws, black ink, gray ink, hof monitor, hof standards), as well as previous vote history, to simulate the Hall of Fame voting. I release the whole ballot, so you'll be able to see vote totals for everyone. I don't think I want to release my full methods, but I've done some testing and so far it looks fairly solid. I can't adjust for voters leaving off guys like Bonds and Clemens, so I will say that if you start a new game, they will make the Hall within a couple seasons. You should also be able to manually induct or not players after the fact in the editor if you don't agree with me.

Right now, there's no human/manual voting. There's a chance we can add in manual balloting, like the All-Star changes, where your vote will either count for a portion of the vote (and for online leagues, have the Hall be entirely voted by the human managers), but we'll have to see what the overall desire for that is. The various thresholds (years to wait, years on ballot, acceptance threshold) are all configurable. We also import the historical vote totals from the past years, so if you're starting a new quickstart, you'll have the whole voting history.

We've also changed the screen to view Hall of Famers, so that it's not so... boring. You can search and sort similar to the current Hall of Fame site (The Hall of Fame members).

It still needs testing, and may change slightly going forward. If you have any other questions, I'd be happy to answer them. I have a feeling this is one email in January that I'm going to look forward to greatly in my games (although having written the feature, I'm going to forever be tweaking it to make sure the right players get elected).

Cryomaniac · 01-24-2015, 09:01 AM

Will popularity play a part? So a "disliked" player (eg Bonds) is less likely to get votes than a very popular one?

Matt Arnold · 01-24-2015, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac

Will popularity play a part? So a "disliked" player (eg Bonds) is less likely to get votes than a very popular one?

Yes, popularity is factored in. Currently, I don't have a "disliked" player lose nearly as many votes as Bonds and Clemens have in real life, but certainly a guy who is extremely popular will get a few more votes than someone who is only "popular" or less.

Recte44 · 01-24-2015, 10:05 AM

Definitely want the option for human managers to do the voting. It's a must for online leagues.

Can it be turned off alternatively?

Markus Heinsohn · 01-24-2015, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Recte44

Definitely want the option for human managers to do the voting. It's a must for online leagues.

Can it be turned off alternatively?

As a commish you can always go in and edit who is in the HoF and who not. That's what online leagues have been doing anyway, I suppose.

The criteria for the election is editable, by the way (i.e. % of votes needed etc).

native son · 01-24-2015, 10:18 AM

I've been hoping for this addition through many versions, so thanks for this! I LOVE the inclusion of metrics vs. the milestones. I hope we'll be able to customize the weights of each metric (Jaws, black ink, gray ink, hof monitor, hof standards), similar to the way that we're able to customize AI evaluation. Will this be the case?

Matt Arnold · 01-24-2015, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by native son

I've been hoping for this addition through many versions, so thanks for this! I LOVE the inclusion of metrics vs. the milestones. I hope we'll be able to customize the weights of each metric (Jaws, black ink, gray ink, hof monitor, hof standards), similar to the way that we're able to customize AI evaluation. Will this be the case?

Currently no, although we'll think about it.

The Wolf · 01-24-2015, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt Arnold

Yes, popularity is factored in. Currently, I don't have a "disliked" player lose nearly as many votes as Bonds and Clemens have in real life, but certainly a guy who is extremely popular will get a few more votes than someone who is only "popular" or less.

Markus, you could just have the HoF balloting use PED suspensions as a very major negative factor. Reduce it severely for one, make it impossible if they get two.

NYY #23 · 01-24-2015, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Markus, you could just have the HoF balloting use PED suspensions as a very major negative factor. Reduce it severely for one, make it impossible if they get two.

Except neither had PED suspensions, and drug suspensions will be off with the MLB going forward.

philliesphan26 · 01-24-2015, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Markus, you could just have the HoF balloting use PED suspensions as a very major negative factor. Reduce it severely for one, make it impossible if they get two.

Are PED suspensions even in 16 or did they have to get taken out due to the MLB license?

Edit: NYY beat me to it

Bluenoser · 01-24-2015, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by philliesphan26

Are PED suspensions even in 16 or did they have to get taken out due to the MLB license?

Edit: NYY beat me to it

They are still in OOTP, just not for MLB. You can have them in fictional leagues.

aslanking · 01-24-2015, 11:53 AM

A Hall of Fame voting sounds fantastic. What an innovative addition. Let me ask you this - for leagues that are already running on Ootp15, how will the game treat existing players who already retired. my league is 12 years old and no one has been inducted to the hall. When i import my game into 16, will the game treat all retired players as though they were in year one of eligibility and then do the vote accordingly. Or will the Hall of Fame voting only work prospectively with those players who began playing in the OOTP 16?

Cryomaniac · 01-24-2015, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYY #23

Except neither had PED suspensions, and drug suspensions will be off with the MLB going forward.

They still exist in fictional leagues though (and indeed I think are the only way a player can be "disliked"). I wouldn't say it should be impossible, just quite a bit less likely.

DustinthePOWERHOUSE · 01-24-2015, 12:10 PM

Wait so obviously the system sounds great and integrating the new data for HOF consideration sounds fantastic, but what I'm concerned about is manual entry based off the HOF considerations/statistics.

What I mean by that is, I always turn of automatic induct into HOF especially for my fictional leagues. What I want is to determine who makes it and when, however in doing so I want to do so using the JAWS and other metrics to compare the players.

So my question is basically can we still do that? Can we still manually add to the HOF and turn off the voting system automatically inducting.

philliesphan26 · 01-24-2015, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluenoser

They are still in OOTP, just not for MLB. You can have them in fictional leagues.

Oh nice

I only play fictional leagues anyway so I'm quite happy to hear that. Thanks for the clarification

Matt Arnold · 01-24-2015, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DustinthePOWERHOUSE

Wait so obviously the system sounds great and integrating the new data for HOF consideration sounds fantastic, but what I'm concerned about is manual entry based off the HOF considerations/statistics.

What I mean by that is, I always turn of automatic induct into HOF especially for my fictional leagues. What I want is to determine who makes it and when, however in doing so I want to do so using the JAWS and other metrics to compare the players.

So my question is basically can we still do that? Can we still manually add to the HOF and turn off the voting system automatically inducting.

Yes, you can. And to help you out, I even display a players' JAWS score on his player profile, so that should save you some calculating work as well

Honorable_Pawn · 01-24-2015, 12:43 PM

Absolutely loving the fresh meat.

Matt Arnold · 01-24-2015, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aslanking

A Hall of Fame voting sounds fantastic. What an innovative addition. Let me ask you this - for leagues that are already running on Ootp15, how will the game treat existing players who already retired. my league is 12 years old and no one has been inducted to the hall. When i import my game into 16, will the game treat all retired players as though they were in year one of eligibility and then do the vote accordingly. Or will the Hall of Fame voting only work prospectively with those players who began playing in the OOTP 16?

Every year, it looks for players which (by default) have retired between 5 and 15 years ago. So if a guy just retired in 15 and then you import to 16, he'll show up on the ballot in 5 years. If he retired over 5 years ago, then he'll show up year one on the ballot.

Now, I will warn people, if your league is like 50-60 years in the future, I don't back-fill votes or anything, so you might see some guys only show up on my ballot once, and then never get consideration again. But hopefully it should catch a few people who should make it. And again, if you want anyone else, you can always induct them manually.

Trebro · 01-24-2015, 12:58 PM

Thanks for the info, Matt:

So the short version is that for the HoF, the game is going to think in more than just terms of hitting the "counting stats" and take into account a series of metrics, including the counting stats, and generate a simulated vote accordingly?

And as I understand it, the All Star voting will be similar, but with some player popularity thrown in, so it's not as closely tied to the WAR score as it is now?

01-23-2015, 11:01 PM	#1
Trebro All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 753 Blog Entries: 1	All Star/HOF Voting--Any Chance on Elaboration? Is there any chance someone could talk a bit more about how the voting is going to work? I know most folks want the roster stuff--which is outstanding, by the way--but it's the extra record-keeping that interests me most, in terms of looking at budgeting for an upgrade. Thanks!

01-24-2015, 09:01 AM	#3
Cryomaniac Hall Of Famer Join Date: May 2007 Location: Hucknall, Notts, UK Posts: 4,902	Will popularity play a part? So a "disliked" player (eg Bonds) is less likely to get votes than a very popular one? __________________

01-24-2015, 10:05 AM	#5
Recte44 Global Moderator Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Oconomowoc, WI Posts: 2,754	Definitely want the option for human managers to do the voting. It's a must for online leagues. Can it be turned off alternatively? __________________ Matt Rectenwald Commissioner, GM: Las Vegas Hustlers, The Brewster Baseball Association- fictional league (JOIN NOW)

01-24-2015, 10:18 AM	#7
native son Minors (Double A) Join Date: May 2002 Location: New York, NY Posts: 100	I've been hoping for this addition through many versions, so thanks for this! I LOVE the inclusion of metrics vs. the milestones. I hope we'll be able to customize the weights of each metric (Jaws, black ink, gray ink, hof monitor, hof standards), similar to the way that we're able to customize AI evaluation. Will this be the case? __________________ life in lowercase

01-24-2015, 12:10 PM	#15
DustinthePOWERHOUSE All Star Reserve Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Boston Posts: 871	Wait so obviously the system sounds great and integrating the new data for HOF consideration sounds fantastic, but what I'm concerned about is manual entry based off the HOF considerations/statistics. What I mean by that is, I always turn of automatic induct into HOF especially for my fictional leagues. What I want is to determine who makes it and when, however in doing so I want to do so using the JAWS and other metrics to compare the players. So my question is basically can we still do that? Can we still manually add to the HOF and turn off the voting system automatically inducting. __________________ Shootin' at the walls of heartache, BANG BANG, I am THE WARRIOR! "It's hard to be humble when you're as great as I am"- Ali Wladimir Klitschko will DESTROY you.

01-24-2015, 06:53 AM	#2
Matt Arnold OOTP Developer Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Here and there Posts: 14,143	Things are still liable to change, but as of now, it's done by the AI. Each year, I use a combination of metrics (Jaws, black ink, gray ink, hof monitor, hof standards), as well as previous vote history, to simulate the Hall of Fame voting. I release the whole ballot, so you'll be able to see vote totals for everyone. I don't think I want to release my full methods, but I've done some testing and so far it looks fairly solid. I can't adjust for voters leaving off guys like Bonds and Clemens, so I will say that if you start a new game, they will make the Hall within a couple seasons. You should also be able to manually induct or not players after the fact in the editor if you don't agree with me. Right now, there's no human/manual voting. There's a chance we can add in manual balloting, like the All-Star changes, where your vote will either count for a portion of the vote (and for online leagues, have the Hall be entirely voted by the human managers), but we'll have to see what the overall desire for that is. The various thresholds (years to wait, years on ballot, acceptance threshold) are all configurable. We also import the historical vote totals from the past years, so if you're starting a new quickstart, you'll have the whole voting history. We've also changed the screen to view Hall of Famers, so that it's not so... boring. You can search and sort similar to the current Hall of Fame site (The Hall of Fame members). It still needs testing, and may change slightly going forward. If you have any other questions, I'd be happy to answer them. I have a feeling this is one email in January that I'm going to look forward to greatly in my games (although having written the feature, I'm going to forever be tweaking it to make sure the right players get elected).

01-24-2015, 11:53 AM	#13
aslanking Minors (Double A) Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 189	A Hall of Fame voting sounds fantastic. What an innovative addition. Let me ask you this - for leagues that are already running on Ootp15, how will the game treat existing players who already retired. my league is 12 years old and no one has been inducted to the hall. When i import my game into 16, will the game treat all retired players as though they were in year one of eligibility and then do the vote accordingly. Or will the Hall of Fame voting only work prospectively with those players who began playing in the OOTP 16?

01-24-2015, 12:43 PM	#18
Honorable_Pawn Hall Of Famer Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Tampa Bay Posts: 6,407	Absolutely loving the fresh meat. __________________ PBA Quickstart for OOTP Background Images Collection All PBA games broadcast live on Steam.

01-24-2015, 12:58 PM	#20
Trebro All Star Reserve Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 753 Blog Entries: 1	Thanks for the info, Matt: So the short version is that for the HoF, the game is going to think in more than just terms of hitting the "counting stats" and take into account a series of metrics, including the counting stats, and generate a simulated vote accordingly? And as I understand it, the All Star voting will be similar, but with some player popularity thrown in, so it's not as closely tied to the WAR score as it is now?