Prospect trading

skbvib · 04-07-2019, 11:40 PM

First post - I've been playing OOTP 20 for a few weeks now, and recently I've noticed that trading has become very frustrating.

I saw a comment that teams would be loathe to trade top prospects for prospects...this makes some sense but at least in my play its reached silly levels.

I find that all teams have now taken the position that their top prospects are "untouchable". I've tried examples where I offer (2-3) 5* star prospects (each of which would be the equal of the other player) for 1 prospect, and no player on my team (including star level MLB'rs) will be enough.

The logic seemed to have changed in one of the recent patches (it was about right before that). Is anyone else seeing this?

I enjoy building up my system with talent, then deploying it en masse to get future stars before they hit the big leagues. These recent changes make that impossible...which means all the effort to acquire talent (that will then get log jammed in a talent rich farm system) is really a waste of time.

NoOne · 04-08-2019, 04:39 AM

bah! it's an overt attack on my system of playing... lol, kidding.

i trade vets along with prospects, but this will probably reduce my rate of replacement, nonetheless... somtimes it is a package of good-to-great prospects for 1 amazing prospect in return. i'll have to adjust.. but likely still be able to abuse the sh@$ out of it... LoL. and, without resorting to sign and trade antics.

do as you do, but make sure to trade those vets before 10/5 rule sets in. as one comes up, you procure a new one for a future need with a package of a couple prospects and an great 28-31y.o. established MLB talent etc etc... as long as you got your ducks lined up, it'll still provide you with a cavalcade of amazing prospects.. there's no way they can break this system of dominance without breaking the game.

it might make the window of opportunity a year or 2 smaller with each player, but there was a ton of wiggle room already.

Aaron's Aron · 04-08-2019, 09:36 AM

I will say that I have noticed this as well (not that it is a bad thing). I really wanted Adley Rutschman, but I had to settle for drafting Andrew Vaughn. After the year of no trading recent draftees expired, I tried to trade Vaughn and my other four best prospects and they were not interested. It is kinda frustrating, but I suppose it is kinda realistic since prospect for prospect trades don't happen much. /me shrugs

panda234 · 04-08-2019, 03:29 PM

I am getting many more “you don’t have a player that works” messages than I did before. I assumed it was because my MiL wasn’t as strong as before. Maybe there has been a change.

skbvib · 04-08-2019, 05:11 PM

Ya, Ive played the same strategy for several years' versions and it worked consistently though all versions...including OOTP 20 until a week ago or so. I suspect it was modified in a patch.

I like the difficulty aspect, but if I'm offering several top tier prospects + any other player (including young cheap vets who are 5*) and can get a sniff on a 4* prospect in return, then the game may as well denote them as listed as un-tradeable. And as it sits now, pretty much every team's top 2-5 prospects are untradeable, even if they are in Win Now mode.

That simply does not mirror reality in MLB. How can this be tweaked back (or made into a setting)?

mtlcash · 04-08-2019, 06:23 PM

Something has changed, you can't trade for high end prospects anymore, impossible.

damientheomen3 · 04-08-2019, 06:28 PM

You should be able to alter trade difficulty as well trade preferences (highly value prospects or vetetans, value prospects or veterans, and neutral) in the settings. Since you're trying to trade prospect for prospect I don't think changing preferences would help. So you'd probably have to try bumping down the trade difficulty, which would likely require some house rules if you don't want to make the game too easy as you'll be able to fleece the AI easier. If that doesn't help, you might be SOL.

If it's any consolation, I haven't been able to play OOTP in my preferred style since OOTP 17.

NoOne · 04-08-2019, 09:28 PM

start timing it with the vets you get rid of, i bet it works still. just a slight modification to timing... more consilidation trades of yougner talents to get a tailored package for that target team's greatest needs.

checking team needs right? if it's blue for what you are offering, or worse offering RP, they don't value that stuff very highly... need to fullfill some red bubble needs in the package.

seriously, if oyu add an RP it generally reduces the chance of them saying yes, unless it's a crazy-talented RP, and even then heavily dependent on weakness and maybe only a modicum of improved respons (verbage the use is ordinal, learn what each means specificlaly... some are equivalents.)

jparker2112 · 04-09-2019, 10:30 AM

when ive run into that where BOTH my GM and their GM says the deal stinks and in reality the deal is a win/win...FORCE THE DEAL! haha! ill look deep into both sides and if i think AI and my GM are being silly i just commish mode it and force the trade. I dont do it often, but sometimes when it makes sense for both sides why not?

UltimateAverageGuy · 04-09-2019, 11:07 AM

So what youre saying is....teams not wanting to give up their good players is a PROBLEM?

Turn commissioner mode on

Sent from my SM-J727T using Tapatalk

mtlcash · 04-12-2019, 05:29 PM

Looks like prospect trading hasn't been fixed in the new patch still

PSUColonel · 04-12-2019, 08:41 PM

It’s good as is

Malova · 05-12-2019, 11:30 PM

I am bumping this, it's literally impossible to trade now as well as "make this work now" doesn't function anymore at all. As stated above it was working fine in the new version and previous (since i started in ootp 16) but now all the sudden it's messed up?

Developers a remark on this please?

Tazilon · 05-13-2019, 02:00 AM

I have the same experience in Challenge Mode. I can never get a trade to go through because "Make this work" never does diddly.

WIUPIKE · 05-13-2019, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tazilon

I have the same experience in Challenge Mode. I can never get a trade to go through because "Make this work" never does diddly.

You probably are not offering anything the AI is looking for or wants. I am able to get the Make this work function to work all the time. When i offer terrible packages i dont see a single player to make it work. It is all a matter of value, sometimes they dont view a veteran as I highly as I do and i cant get them to say who they would want in my org.

Malova · 05-13-2019, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WIUPIKE

You probably are not offering anything the AI is looking for or wants. I am able to get the Make this work function to work all the time. When i offer terrible packages i dont see a single player to make it work. It is all a matter of value, sometimes they dont view a veteran as I highly as I do and i cant get them to say who they would want in my org.

It was changed though in one of the recent patches, more or less we are asking for it to be changed back to the way it was. It makes it almost impossible to trade now.

MikeS21 · 05-14-2019, 08:51 AM

I'm not sure that it is even possible to write AI code that would completely mimic real trades.

It just seems a whole lot more complicated than comparing skillsets of two players and making a decision if a fair trade is possible. There are so many off-the-field variables that go into making trades nowadays that can not be included in the trading AI of the game. For example, so many trades involving prospects are based on the number of years of team control, 40 man roster space, and other such factors. While you can add such factors in as you go, it will never be perfect because there is always some new factor, some new statistic, or some new indicator that teams look for in making trades. Every team's philosophy is different. Every GM's standards are different. Every owner's whims are different. All of that factors in when trades are made.

Let's face it ... if the trading AI got too realistic, baseball teams would be calling the guys (and gals) of OOTP Developments and asking to use the AI code to simulate actual real life trades.

Ts-Rock · 05-14-2019, 03:20 PM

just reading this post and I have seen same, has this been adjusted in new patch (DL now in hotel slow ass internet speed).

Arobbins · 05-14-2019, 08:11 PM

I knew I didn't update for a reason!

After reading the posts here, it can't be a bad idea to include some kind of trade value indicator next to players in the Transactions menu(s)

I.E. Madden and 2K have a value rating system for players and picks in the trade screen

Malova · 05-14-2019, 08:28 PM

Any mod or developer care to comment on this and share some insight please?

04-07-2019, 11:40 PM	#1
skbvib Bat Boy Join Date: Apr 2019 Posts: 8	Prospect trading First post - I've been playing OOTP 20 for a few weeks now, and recently I've noticed that trading has become very frustrating. I saw a comment that teams would be loathe to trade top prospects for prospects...this makes some sense but at least in my play its reached silly levels. I find that all teams have now taken the position that their top prospects are "untouchable". I've tried examples where I offer (2-3) 5* star prospects (each of which would be the equal of the other player) for 1 prospect, and no player on my team (including star level MLB'rs) will be enough. The logic seemed to have changed in one of the recent patches (it was about right before that). Is anyone else seeing this? I enjoy building up my system with talent, then deploying it en masse to get future stars before they hit the big leagues. These recent changes make that impossible...which means all the effort to acquire talent (that will then get log jammed in a talent rich farm system) is really a waste of time.

04-08-2019, 04:39 AM	#2
NoOne Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,167	bah! it's an overt attack on my system of playing... lol, kidding. i trade vets along with prospects, but this will probably reduce my rate of replacement, nonetheless... somtimes it is a package of good-to-great prospects for 1 amazing prospect in return. i'll have to adjust.. but likely still be able to abuse the sh@$ out of it... LoL. and, without resorting to sign and trade antics. do as you do, but make sure to trade those vets before 10/5 rule sets in. as one comes up, you procure a new one for a future need with a package of a couple prospects and an great 28-31y.o. established MLB talent etc etc... as long as you got your ducks lined up, it'll still provide you with a cavalcade of amazing prospects.. there's no way they can break this system of dominance without breaking the game. it might make the window of opportunity a year or 2 smaller with each player, but there was a ton of wiggle room already. Last edited by NoOne; 04-08-2019 at 04:40 AM.

04-08-2019, 05:11 PM	#5
skbvib Bat Boy Join Date: Apr 2019 Posts: 8	How to tweak? Ya, Ive played the same strategy for several years' versions and it worked consistently though all versions...including OOTP 20 until a week ago or so. I suspect it was modified in a patch. I like the difficulty aspect, but if I'm offering several top tier prospects + any other player (including young cheap vets who are 5) and can get a sniff on a 4 prospect in return, then the game may as well denote them as listed as un-tradeable. And as it sits now, pretty much every team's top 2-5 prospects are untradeable, even if they are in Win Now mode. That simply does not mirror reality in MLB. How can this be tweaked back (or made into a setting)?

05-14-2019, 03:20 PM	#18
Ts-Rock Major Leagues Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: H'ville - Home of 6x BSA World Series Champion Posts: 319	just reading this post and I have seen same, has this been adjusted in new patch (DL now in hotel slow ass internet speed). __________________ Hendersonville Hitmen of the BSA 5x WS Champ (2010, 2013-15, 2017) 5x OOTY (2010-11, 2013-14, 2017) 2010 114-48, World Series Champions 2011 109-53, 1st Rd Loss to N.F. 2012. 96-66, 1st Rd Loss to L.A. 2013 112-50, World Series Champions 2014 119-43, World Series Champions 2015 124-38, World Series Champions 2016 111-51, LCS Loss to L.A. 2017 110-52, World Series Champions 2018 101-61, 1st Rd Loss to Baffin Island 2019. 98-64, LCS Loss to Baffin Island 2020 103-59,

05-14-2019, 08:11 PM	#19
Arobbins Minors (Double A) Join Date: Aug 2018 Posts: 132	I knew I didn't update for a reason! After reading the posts here, it can't be a bad idea to include some kind of trade value indicator next to players in the Transactions menu(s) I.E. Madden and 2K have a value rating system for players and picks in the trade screen __________________ 20 21

04-08-2019, 09:36 AM	#3
Aaron's Aron Minors (Single A) Join Date: Jun 2014 Posts: 70	I will say that I have noticed this as well (not that it is a bad thing). I really wanted Adley Rutschman, but I had to settle for drafting Andrew Vaughn. After the year of no trading recent draftees expired, I tried to trade Vaughn and my other four best prospects and they were not interested. It is kinda frustrating, but I suppose it is kinda realistic since prospect for prospect trades don't happen much. /me shrugs

04-08-2019, 03:29 PM	#4
panda234 Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Oct 2018 Posts: 264	I am getting many more “you don’t have a player that works” messages than I did before. I assumed it was because my MiL wasn’t as strong as before. Maybe there has been a change.

04-08-2019, 06:23 PM	#6
mtlcash Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 26	Something has changed, you can't trade for high end prospects anymore, impossible.

04-08-2019, 09:28 PM	#8
NoOne Hall Of Famer Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 7,167	start timing it with the vets you get rid of, i bet it works still. just a slight modification to timing... more consilidation trades of yougner talents to get a tailored package for that target team's greatest needs. checking team needs right? if it's blue for what you are offering, or worse offering RP, they don't value that stuff very highly... need to fullfill some red bubble needs in the package. seriously, if oyu add an RP it generally reduces the chance of them saying yes, unless it's a crazy-talented RP, and even then heavily dependent on weakness and maybe only a modicum of improved respons (verbage the use is ordinal, learn what each means specificlaly... some are equivalents.)

04-09-2019, 10:30 AM	#9
jparker2112 All Star Reserve Join Date: Nov 2012 Location: Denver CO Posts: 800 Blog Entries: 1	when ive run into that where BOTH my GM and their GM says the deal stinks and in reality the deal is a win/win...FORCE THE DEAL! haha! ill look deep into both sides and if i think AI and my GM are being silly i just commish mode it and force the trade. I dont do it often, but sometimes when it makes sense for both sides why not?

04-09-2019, 11:07 AM	#10
UltimateAverageGuy All Star Reserve Join Date: Jan 2017 Posts: 579	So what youre saying is....teams not wanting to give up their good players is a PROBLEM? Turn commissioner mode on Sent from my SM-J727T using Tapatalk

04-12-2019, 05:29 PM	#11
mtlcash Minors (Rookie Ball) Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 26	Looks like prospect trading hasn't been fixed in the new patch still

04-12-2019, 08:41 PM	#12
PSUColonel Hall Of Famer Join Date: Feb 2002 Posts: 12,988 Blog Entries: 37	It’s good as is

05-12-2019, 11:30 PM	#13
Malova Minors (Double A) Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 140	I am bumping this, it's literally impossible to trade now as well as "make this work now" doesn't function anymore at all. As stated above it was working fine in the new version and previous (since i started in ootp 16) but now all the sudden it's messed up? Developers a remark on this please?

05-13-2019, 02:00 AM	#14
Tazilon Minors (Double A) Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Mesquite, TX Posts: 116	I have the same experience in Challenge Mode. I can never get a trade to go through because "Make this work" never does diddly.

05-14-2019, 08:51 AM	#17
MikeS21 Minors (Triple A) Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 267	I'm not sure that it is even possible to write AI code that would completely mimic real trades. It just seems a whole lot more complicated than comparing skillsets of two players and making a decision if a fair trade is possible. There are so many off-the-field variables that go into making trades nowadays that can not be included in the trading AI of the game. For example, so many trades involving prospects are based on the number of years of team control, 40 man roster space, and other such factors. While you can add such factors in as you go, it will never be perfect because there is always some new factor, some new statistic, or some new indicator that teams look for in making trades. Every team's philosophy is different. Every GM's standards are different. Every owner's whims are different. All of that factors in when trades are made. Let's face it ... if the trading AI got too realistic, baseball teams would be calling the guys (and gals) of OOTP Developments and asking to use the AI code to simulate actual real life trades.

05-14-2019, 08:28 PM	#20
Malova Minors (Double A) Join Date: Nov 2015 Posts: 140	Any mod or developer care to comment on this and share some insight please?