Competitive balance discussion

[HiDesertAce]

I have three teams. All started this week in the bronze league.



The two teams I spent money on ($120 each) both lost in the league championship series to inferior teams (by ratings) 4 games to 1.


The team I spent 0 dollars on is currently tied 3 games to 3 in the leage championship series. And has beaten better teams each round.


So my zero dollar team technically performed the best. But I doubt that will continue when we get promoted next week.



During the playoffs I spent the same amount of time on each squad. But the zero dollar team did buy players between each new playoff round.

[Maddox]

Originally Posted by imhoff2

Wait.

Are you complaining that you won more games than you lost and made the playoffs?

Or are complaining that your team made the playoffs and advanced to the World Series?

Or are you complaining that you don’t think you can compete in the next season, even though you beat out 28 teams in your current season?

Or are you complaining that once you reach the ultimate level of this game you won’t be able to complete?

I’m confused...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

He's just complaining.

It is such a burden to know what is best for the game, the players and the devs and have nobody else realize it.

Unfortunately it is the curse of a large portion of today's gaming population.

[old timer]

One problem that I see is potentially get stuck in a perfect league without being able to upgrade to compete with the super-teams and yet not being bad enough to get relegated. So you could weaken your team just enough to get relegated (but not enough to mess up things for other teams), but then you might do well enough to end up back at the perfect level again.

In other words, getting promoted to perfect will be more like a punishment for some teams. So one concern of mine is being good enough to compete at the diamond level, but then being perpetually stuck in a perfect league without being able to be competitive. But... Maybe this won't happen.

Another potential problem are the super-teams that may be continually moving up from bronze. Even though they're passing through, it would make things less fun for some/many when they end up in a league with them. But I wonder how often this will happen? My gold league this season, was full of teams that were all relatively comparable in strength. Winning percentages ranged from about .440 to 1 team with a slightly over .600 WPct.

[Dunzie]

I know it's only adding fuel to the fire, but to provide an instance for comparison...

My last remaining team this season is my Gold team and we're in the midst of the World Series tied 1-1 with another fairly comparable team. Both of us won our divisions and had roughly the same record... about 93 wins. Neither team has any 100's, and very few diamonds between us (I think 3-4, and all low-dollar ones). Mostly decent performing low-dollar golds, some smart silvers, and even a few bronze.

Both of us put out giants that were FAR more loaded up than we were. I'd reckon the team I beat out in the semi-finals could field a higher ranked team than mine from their reserve roster, in fact I'm sure of it.

Yes, both teams will get promoted now and face a much tougher challenge without spending any money at Diamond, but point is we both beat teams that had obviously spent money. So it CAN be done. One thing to throw money at the game, but if it's not done smartly it won't help, and even if done smartly doesn't necessarily GUARANTEE winning.

[Thalion]

Originally Posted by old timer

One problem that I see is potentially get stuck in a perfect league without being able to upgrade to compete with the super-teams and yet not being bad enough to get relegated. So you could weaken your team just enough to get relegated (but not enough to mess up things for other teams), but then you might do well enough to end up back at the perfect level again.

In other words, getting promoted to perfect will be more like a punishment for some teams. So one concern of mine is being good enough to compete at the diamond level, but then being perpetually stuck in a perfect league without being able to be competitive. But... Maybe this won't happen.

Another potential problem are the super-teams that may be continually moving up from bronze. Even though they're passing through, it would make things less fun for some/many when they end up in a league with them. But I wonder how often this will happen? My gold league this season, was full of teams that were all relatively comparable in strength. Winning percentages ranged from about .440 to 1 team with a slightly over .600 WPct.

Going forward, your first case may not be too much of an issue. Assuming things stay the same, only the WS teams get promoted to Perfect from Diamond. Sure, it's possible for a fluke run to make it into the WS and get promoted, but if you really don't belong there, you'll get relegated (bottom 4 go down). Now, I don't see any team bouncing back and forth all the time BUT if you're good enough to make the WS all the time in Diamond, you should be in Perfect because it's no cakewalk to be CONSISTENTLY dominant in Diamond. At that point, you're good enough to be in Perfect. As to the second, yes, I'm sure it sucks to be in a league with a whale passing through on his way to the higher leagues. But, because of the speed of the seasons, that's one week. One week and they're gone. And I don't even know if it's going to be the case where there will be a whale passing through every week. There are currently almost 300 leagues in the PT universe, heavily weighted towards the lower tiers due to the pyramid structure. I don't know how many whales there are passing through the lower levels, but I'm skeptical that there are more than one in each lower league so I'm not sure if the chances are high you're going to see one all the time.

[whobob]

That's definitely going to happen to me. My Diamond team, first year was under .500. This year, it's a 87 win team that snuck into the 2nd WC spot on the last day, ended up going to the world series. It's been a crazy run, but I am not looking forward to next week.

[<Pion>]

Originally Posted by Thalion

Assuming things stay the same, only the WS teams get promoted to Perfect from Diamond.

Last season my team had a mediocre record (.519), lost early in the playoffs, and yet was promoted from Diamond to Perfect. I've never been able to figure out why, the team has not one the league crown yet. Something else must have caused it because it certainly wasn't record or reaching the championship series. It also wasn't because of rating since it did not have any perfect players and only one diamond and eight golds.

[whobob]

That was the first time teams were promoted to perfect, so more teams than just the two WS teams were promoted. Probably making the playoffs was good enough that year.

[Thalion]

Originally Posted by whobob

That was the first time teams were promoted to perfect, so more teams than just the two WS teams were promoted. Probably making the playoffs was good enough that year.

This is correct. Everyone in Diamond who made the playoffs last season was promoted to Perfect

[Westheim]

Originally Posted by matingly23

My other team is going to the WS, yeah!

They get to be served up to the Whale God for $$!!! What FUN!!

Poor you, having not one, but two teams in the playoffs. Your life must be so hard!

[Maddox]

This thread will get merged. Yes, the other thread has gotten contentious but that is what happens when every player knows how to best "fix" the game so that it is the most fun for them.

[Mat]

I feel like I am in the minority... with my one and only team.

[Westheim]

Originally Posted by Mat

I feel like I am in the minority... with my one and only team.

Nah, I also only have one team. Which might be rooted in laziness to switch from one account to the other, but... yeah, probably laziness is to blame here.

[shockenawe]

Originally Posted by Westheim

All these splendid ideas have already been brought up at least seven times each in the 50+ pages thread LITERALLY labeled "Competitive Balance Discussion", along with plenty of replies by OOTPD why this and that will or will not happen.

His ideas are just THAT good that they require their own thread.

[Kushiel]

Originally Posted by zrog2000

No one ever said anyone is entitled to anything. This is a competitive balance discussion to possibly improve the game. Why don't you want the game improved?

As it stands now, for OOTP 20, I will spend $0 on PP since there is no point in getting to a perfect league faster to face unbeatable teams.

If OOTP wants to give players the option to join $0 PP leagues and charge $20 for that, I know a lot of people would sign up because that's more interesting than competitions to see who can spend the most money. Hey, there's another money making opportunity for OOTP! I would likely even spend that $20 3-4 times if it were any good.

Why do you want to take money away from OOTP?

This is a competitive balance discussion to possibly improve the game. Improve the game in your own opinion

Why don't you want the game improved? Improve the game is what I want. I do not want the game gutted and changed to fit a few peoples idea of a utopia where everybody wins and we all "eat rainbow stew from a silver spoon."

I would likely even spend that $20 3-4 times if it were any good. Then you would likely complain because the game changed from FTP to PTP. Spend that $80 now to help improve the game and compete now That is plenty of money to be competitive at Diamond and/or Perfect level.

[Kushiel]

Originally Posted by matingly23

My other team is going to the WS, yeah!

They get to be served up to the Whale God for $$!!! What FUN!!

So it is good and fun for other teams to be served up to you at the present level, but it really sucks for you to be promoted and served up to others in turn?

[Zorro]

Originally Posted by Mat

I feel like I am in the minority... with my one and only team.

No Mat I only have one team also. It is so unfair for people to have more then one team. It gives them twice the amount of fun compared to me. It just is not right to have these fun loving people having twice the fun. I think there should be a separate server for players with one team only so everyone has the same ability to have fun. Not everyone has the time to manage two teams. Why should they have all the fun? OOTP might lose me and others (How bout it Mat?) If they continue on like this with only 1 server for the greedy players who want more then one team. I will take my marbles and go home. (Wait a minute, I am home.) 🤹*♀️

[matingly23]

Oh sweet, got promoted to Gold!

And I'm in a league with the same Whale as before - so I know already who will win its Championship. Week ruined.

Think I will just let my teams in that league go unmanned for this week and any others I find myself in Whale-Town. Not worth it.

[Orcin]

Originally Posted by matingly23

Oh sweet, got promoted to Gold!

And I'm in a league with the same Whale as before - so I know already who will win its Championship. Week ruined.

Think I will just let my teams in that league go unmanned for this week and any others I find myself in Whale-Town. Not worth it.

You spelled Don Mattingly's name wrong.

[atabakin]

Originally Posted by matingly23

Oh sweet, got promoted to Gold!

And I'm in a league with the same Whale as before - so I know already who will win its Championship. Week ruined.

Think I will just let my teams in that league go unmanned for this week and any others I find myself in Whale-Town. Not worth it.

Please keep posting... It's great comic relief!