Minor League Age-Limits

[Cryomaniac]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Why? In real life there are no age limits for minor leagues, it's all based on pro service time.

Minor League Service Time & Roster Limits

OOTP 15 will have service time-based limits for minor leagues. Not age limits.

From what LGO posted earlier though:

""No more than four players who are 23 or older; no more than three players on the active list can have four or more years of prior service.""

That is an age limit (no more than 4 players over 23). I appreciate that it might be difficult to code rules like that though (well, more accurately it would be difficult to get eh AI to use them correctly without creating Borkholder type bugs).

[Markus Heinsohn]

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac

From what LGO posted earlier though:

""No more than four players who are 23 or older; no more than three players on the active list can have four or more years of prior service.""

That is an age limit (no more than 4 players over 23). I appreciate that it might be difficult to code rules like that though (well, more accurately it would be difficult to get eh AI to use them correctly without creating Borkholder type bugs).

It looks like age limits are no longer part of the rules in current minor leagues, LGO was stating past rules.

But yes, stuff like this is incredibly complex to code AI for, unfortunately.

[Cryomaniac]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

It looks like age limits are no longer part of the rules in current minor leagues, LGO was stating past rules.

But yes, stuff like this is incredibly complex to code AI for, unfortunately.

Fair enough. It would be cool to eventually be able to have age limits as well (if anything so people can do historical minor leagues with realistic rules).

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

It looks like age limits are no longer part of the rules in current minor leagues, LGO was stating past rules.

I don't have the 2014 edition of the Baseball America Directory, but given the rules changed very little in all the editions I do have, I'd be surprised if they are any different now.

That said, I've maintained for awhile now that a purely service time-based system is a perfectly reasonable approach and sufficiently based in reality. (In past years the minors used to have rosters which divided players into three categories: rookies, regulars, and veterans, with each category determined by service time. Clubs were required to carry a minimum number of rookies and could carry a maximum number of veterans; after that, it was up to the club.)

[le receveur]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

I don't have the 2014 edition of the Baseball America Directory, but given the rules changed very little in all the editions I do have, I'd be surprised if they are any different now.

That said, I've maintained for awhile now that a purely service time-based system is a perfectly reasonable approach and sufficiently based in reality. (In past years the minors used to have rosters which divided players into three categories: rookies, regulars, and veterans, with each category determined by service time. Clubs were required to carry a minimum number of rookies and could carry a maximum number of veterans; after that, it was up to the club.)

does service time in DSL and VSL count in the service time, in RL and in OOTP15?

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by le receveur

does service time in DSL and VSL count in the service time, in RL and in OOTP15?

According to the 2008 Major League Rules, players in the DSL and VSL are limited to a maximum of four years of service [MLR 51(b)(1)(E)]. However, those years of service, if any, are disregarded when they move to a U.S.-based minor league [MLR 51(b)(1)].

[The Wolf]

Source: Minor League Transactions Glossary - Chicago Cubs Online

"Short-Season Class-A Clubs – 30 players (no more than 25 players may be used in a single game) Effective on July 1, the active list must include at least ten (10) pitchers, no more than four (4) players may be 23 years old or older and no more than three (3) players may have four (4) or more years of minor league service time.

Advanced Rookie Clubs – 35 players (no more than 30 players may be used in a single game) Effective on July 1, the active list must include at least 10 pitchers, no more than 12 players may be 21 years or older, no more than two (2) players may be 23 years or older, no player may have more than two (2) years as a professional, and no player may have three (3) of more years of minor league service time.

Rookie Clubs – 35 players (no more than 30 players may be used in a single game) Effective on July 1, the active list must include at least 10 pitchers, no more than eight (8) players may be 20 years old or older, including two (2) drafted players and four (4) undrafted players how are at least 21 years old and no player may have more than two (2) years of minor league service time."

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Cryomaniac

Fair enough. It would be cool to eventually be able to have age limits as well (if anything so people can do historical minor leagues with realistic rules).

Exactly.

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

Advanced Rookie Clubs – ... no player may have more than two (2) years as a professional, and no player may have three (3) of more years of minor league service time.

Rookie Clubs – ... no player may have more than two (2) years of minor league service time."

From the reference sources I have, that used to be the service time distinction between Rookie Advanced and Rookie (three years and two years, respectively). I say "used to be" because of this MLB article from January of 2008, which mentions a rule change in regards to the service limits at the lowest minors:

In Thursday's other rule change, Rule 51 concerning limits on Minor League service time eliminated the distinction between the levels Rookie, where the limit had been two years, and Rookie Advanced, where players could be kept for three years.

Henceforth, the three-year limit will apply to both.

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

From the reference sources I have, that used to be the service time distinction between Rookie Advanced and Rookie (three years and two years, respectively). I say "used to be" because of this MLB article from January of 2008, which mentions a rule change in regards to the service limits at the lowest minors:

I posted what the Cubs currently have up on their online site.

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by HawkyTom

Hey man, thanks! I'm actually the one who about 2 weeks(?) ago I posted about whether I should buy the OOTP 14 for $20 or wait for OOTP 15 and pre-order...you were pretty convincing that I should go with OOTP 14, so I bought it!

(this is my first OOTP game, but I joined forums in 2012, but ended up going back to mogul, never again!)

I certainly remember you, heh.

Ahhhh.....

I see said the dummy.


Yes. I remember now.

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by Markus Heinsohn

Why? In real life there are no age limits for minor leagues, it's all based on pro service time.

Minor League Service Time & Roster Limits

OOTP 15 will have service time-based limits for minor leagues. Not age limits.

I can answer the why. I am tired of having to go through my SA and R level leagues retiring 30 year old never will be's. I want this control because the AI can't get it right. The AI at the rookie level and the SA level is more worried about winning games than developing players. That is the primary flaw. Development of players should trump winning.

I sure hope the new service limits won't cause too many problems and that it does, indeed, work as an age-limit.

In any event, this is my second public gripe and I hope that the wrong impression is not taken from me. This is a great game and I highly recommend it. It is the best game I have ever enjoyed. My hat is off to you and to your skill as a business owner. Well done on all accounts. So...I apologize if I have been coming across as critical lately. No harm intended. Trust me, I do more good for OOTP and its success than I do bad.

[Honorable_Pawn]

nm

[Le Grande Orange]

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

I can answer the why. I am tired of having to go through my SA and R level leagues retiring 30 year old never will be's.

A 30-year-old will have had too many seasons of service to be eligible for either Short A or Rookie ball unless he played his first season at age 27 (for the former) and age 28 (for the latter). A debut in professional ball at age 27 or 28 doesn't seem very likely.

[Honorable_Pawn]

Originally Posted by Le Grande Orange

A 30-year-old will have had too many seasons of service to be eligible for either Short A or Rookie ball unless he played his first season at age 27 (for the former) and age 28 (for the latter). A debut in professional ball at age 27 or 28 doesn't seem very likely.

Yeah...I can see how this will act as an age limit. I am very excited to try it out. Again, I was answering the why. I still don't want to see a ton of 27-year olds in rookie ball. I like to keep Rookie under 26 and SA under 27. I would really like to keep it under 25/26 for R/SA but that's too much work for me. It's time-consuming enough doing the 26/27. I like to play it my way. The new feature will work out well getting rid of the 30-year olds but I want more control than that.

I just thought of a solution....

What if I had a "Retire Aged Minor Leaguers" button? This button will bring up a menu asking an age limit and a drop down for level. Once I select that OOTP will retire all of those players for me. Basically, instead of coding the AI around an artificial age-limit just let me mass-retire anyone at SA or Rookie below an age I set. That's what I do every 2 weeks or so of game time anyway. I simply retire them one at a time if they are over my limt.

The button could be on the setting menu under functions.

[endgame]

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

Yeah...I can see how this will act as an age limit. I am very excited to try it out. Again, I was answering the why. I still don't want to see a ton of 27-year olds in rookie ball. I like to keep Rookie under 26 and SA under 27. I would really like to keep it under 25/26 for R/SA but that's too much work for me. It's time-consuming enough doing the 26/27. I like to play it my way. The new feature will work out well getting rid of the 30-year olds but I want more control than that.

I just thought of a solution....

What if I had a "Retire Aged Minor Leaguers" button? This button will bring up a menu asking an age limit and a drop down for level. Once I select that OOTP will retire all of those players for me. Basically, instead of coding the AI around an artificial age-limit just let me mass-retire anyone at SA or Rookie below an age I set. That's what I do every 2 weeks or so of game time anyway. I simply retire them one at a time if they are over my limt.

The button could be on the setting menu under functions.

Your method isn't dissimilar to one I use. Keep in mind you can use a Filter and set the age less than .... and then use a mass release, as well, for any level.

[HawkyTom]

Originally Posted by Honorable_Pawn

I still don't want to see a ton of 27-year olds in rookie ball. I like to keep Rookie under 26 and SA under 27. I would really like to keep it under 25/26 for R/SA but that's too much work for me. It's time-consuming enough doing the 26/27.

I just thought of a solution....

What if I had a "Retire Aged Minor Leaguers" button? This button will bring up a menu asking an age limit and a drop down for level. Once I select that OOTP will retire all of those players for me. Basically, instead of coding the AI around an artificial age-limit just let me mass-retire anyone at SA or Rookie below an age I set. That's what I do every 2 weeks or so of game time anyway. I simply retire them one at a time if they are over my limt.

The button could be on the setting menu under functions.

That button could indeed be handy, I'm curious of how you approach retiring the players who are too old currently.


Wouldn't a very fast way would be to do a custom 'filter' and just go to the 'show all players' and then put:


-league level is rookie league
and
-age is at least 27


Turn on commissioner mode then select all and retire those players, then do:


-league level is short season A
and
-age is at least 28

You could even save the screens as bookmarks and then switch to your saved filter and then retire all and it's done quick.


Maybe your already doing something like this, or something even faster, but it doesn't seem that bad. I don't know

[Honorable_Pawn]

Thanks you two. Yup, I was going through each team's transaction page and retiring one at a time.

I can't believe I overlooked that. I'm a total schmuck. I withdraw my complaint.

[bwburke94]

While we're talking about minors, one big issue that I see in every game is that if (minor league players / 25) is greater than (minor league teams), the extras get dumped into a single rookie league team instead of having every minor league team get extra players.

In extreme circumstances this can lead to players getting assigned to the major league team and put on the 40-man roster when you drag them to rookie ball, since rosters can't support more than ~200 players per team.

[olivertheorem]

I'm pretty sure that in RL only the rookie leagues have no roster size limit. They probably do have limits of some kind with regard to size though.