OOTP 14 announcement discussion!

[The Wolf]

Originally Posted by IStillDream

It's probably too late for this, and it may have been raised before (I'm pretty new), but how difficult would it be to add a setting for gender in the player characteristics, such that you could designate a player as female and the game would say "she" and "her" instead of "he" and "him"? I created Eri Yoshida in my league and she's exceeded expectations and made ML spring training this year--and I wince a bit every time the game says "he gets the strikeout" etc. It would also let people sim the historical women's leagues a la A League of Their Own.

Please never bring this up again.

[olivertheorem]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

What will the relationship between scouting and the new international system be? As it stands currently, you scout various nations through expenditure. How will this be handled with the new international free agent/prospect model?

I'm just guessing, but I'm pretty sure that the new options will work like this:

international/indy free agents - same as now
international prospects - same as now, except they go in your complex instead of your minors

And I think there's another source that I'm forgetting at the moment.

[BeancheBlanco]

What do I want in OOTP 14? Stop handing me guys like this in the free agents (sorry for the small pic):



an 18 year old, 92 mph (will increase), high stamina, 4 plus-pitch, left-handed, ground-baller, 5-star prospect who was drafted in the 4th round last year. He threw 60 innings with a 1.4 ERA as a 17 year old in rookie ball. Then he has one quality start as an 18 year old and is promptly released by the computer. Why????

[PSUColonel]

What does BNN think of him? Is he really a good player, or is your scout overvaluing him? (if you are using scouting)


EDIT: I can't read his stats

[olivertheorem]

My best guess on that guy is that the lousy K/BB ratio helped "turn off" the AI on his future. Though you are correct that if a team's scouts had him as a fourth-rounder then they would not likely give up on him that quickly, barring off-the-field problems that don't exist in the game at present.

[rudel.dietrich]

Originally Posted by BeancheBlanco

What do I want in OOTP 14? Stop handing me guys like this in the free agents (sorry for the small pic):



an 18 year old, 92 mph (will increase), high stamina, 4 plus-pitch, left-handed, ground-baller, 5-star prospect who was drafted in the 4th round last year. He threw 60 innings with a 1.4 ERA as a 17 year old in rookie ball. Then he has one quality start as an 18 year old and is promptly released by the computer. Why????

Check your rookie leagues and see if they have a player roster size limit. If you set the lowest level of your minors to have an unlimited player limit then the CPU for the most part will not release good young prospects.

If you have a limit set then the AI is not very good at choosing who to release come draft time and it has to add new draft picks to it's minors.

It really needs to be fixed since the work around is just patching the problem. But at least there is a work around.

If you already know this and have it set to unlimited then it is a big issue that has plauged OOTP for many many versions.

[BeancheBlanco]

Originally Posted by PSUColonel

What does BNN think of him? Is he really a good player, or is your scout overvaluing him? (if you are using scouting)


EDIT: I can't read his stats

BNN has him rated poorly. However, BNN is supposed to be extremely inaccurate (less accurate than my scout) and I have a legendary scout with the maximum scouting budget allowed. He was also a 4th rounder just a year ago, is only 18 years old, and has performed well (despite the high walks). The release makes no sense, no matter how you slice it.

Originally Posted by olivertheorem

My best guess on that guy is that the lousy K/BB ratio helped "turn off" the AI on his future. Though you are correct that if a team's scouts had him as a fourth-rounder then they would not likely give up on him that quickly, barring off-the-field problems that don't exist in the game at present.

Yeah he walked a lot of guys but he was 17 years old and still had a miniscule 1.4 ERA. It's ridiculous that he was released less than a year after being drafted. This is just one example. Each year, I find at least 10 new prospects who were drafted in round 2-5 of the previous year's draft in the free agents.

Originally Posted by rudel.dietrich

Check your rookie leagues and see if they have a player roster size limit. If you set the lowest level of your minors to have an unlimited player limit then the CPU for the most part will not release good young prospects.

If you have a limit set then the AI is not very good at choosing who to release come draft time and it has to add new draft picks to it's minors.

It really needs to be fixed since the work around is just patching the problem. But at least there is a work around.

If you already know this and have it set to unlimited then it is a big issue that has plauged OOTP for many many versions.

It is unlimited.

[injury log]

Originally Posted by The Wolf

It meant it's clear that you don't. And I think that we disagree about almost everything.

When you express opinions about things you know nothing about - like how much stats-only OOTP I play - I find it reassuring that we disagree about almost everything. I was in the first ever stats-only online league, and it's what I play most of the time. And it's because I play stats-only most of the time that I know how exploitable the game would be if it used minor league stats exclusively to evaluate prospects. The game offers you many opportunities to discover which prospects are real prospects and which are not, and minor league stats are not a good indicator of long-term potential, both in OOTP and in real life.

Originally Posted by BeancheBlanco

BNN has him rated poorly.

If you turn scouting off, I guarantee you'll find that guy is a 1-star or 1.5-star prospect. He throws 90 mph, so his Stuff isn't great, and his GB% isn't special either, so his Movement is likely average. But most telling, he was a 4th round pick, and 5-star pitchers don't get picked in the 4th round.

olivertheorem's hypothesis about this pitcher's BB rate being the reason he was released is not correct, as best I know. The game is currently using quite a stupid decision mechanism to determine which players to keep and which to cut in the minors. The game tries to field the most competitive minor league teams possible. So that means the game will sometimes cut a 21 year old 4th rounder and instead keep a 31 year old journeyman A-ball pitcher, because the veteran may have better current ability than the prospect. Since we don't see the top prospects in the game released very often, I think they're exempt from being released, but any middling prospect could be cut. This is the biggest issue with the game's AI at the moment, in my opinion, and I bring it up repeatedly on the beta forum. I'm optimistic it will be addressed this year.

[olivertheorem]

Originally Posted by injury log

olivertheorem's hypothesis about this pitcher's BB rate being the reason he was released is not correct, as best I know. The game is currently using quite a stupid decision mechanism to determine which players to keep and which to cut in the minors. The game tries to field the most competitive minor league teams possible. So that means the game will sometimes cut a 21 year old 4th rounder and instead keep a 31 year old journeyman A-ball pitcher, because the veteran may have better current ability than the prospect. Since we don't see the top prospects in the game released very often, I think they're exempt from being released, but any middling prospect could be cut. This is the biggest issue with the game's AI at the moment, in my opinion, and I bring it up repeatedly on the beta forum. I'm optimistic it will be addressed this year.

I meant to address that as well, but kept getting distracted. Seems that the simplest solution would be that minor-league (for this purpose AA on down, since veteran insurance will frequently be stashed in AAA) cut decisions ought to be made on the basis of potential rather than current ability. I wouldn't think that would be all that hard to code, but I'm not a programmer.

[BeancheBlanco]

Originally Posted by injury log

If you turn scouting off, I guarantee you'll find that guy is a 1-star or 1.5-star prospect. He throws 90 mph, so his Stuff isn't great, and his GB% isn't special either, so his Movement is likely average. But most telling, he was a 4th round pick, and 5-star pitchers don't get picked in the 4th round.

olivertheorem's hypothesis about this pitcher's BB rate being the reason he was released is not correct, as best I know. The game is currently using quite a stupid decision mechanism to determine which players to keep and which to cut in the minors. The game tries to field the most competitive minor league teams possible. So that means the game will sometimes cut a 21 year old 4th rounder and instead keep a 31 year old journeyman A-ball pitcher, because the veteran may have better current ability than the prospect. Since we don't see the top prospects in the game released very often, I think they're exempt from being released, but any middling prospect could be cut. This is the biggest issue with the game's AI at the moment, in my opinion, and I bring it up repeatedly on the beta forum. I'm optimistic it will be addressed this year.

He throws 90-92 mph at 18 years old as a lefty. That's pretty considerable since velocity increases quite considerably in OOTP from 18-21. Sounds like he has high potential Stuff to me. I'm not claiming he is some uber, sure-fire prospect and it is clear that he has some control problems. Do I expect him to actually become a 5 star major league player? No. However, if you take into account his age, velocity, solid GB %, high school performance, Rookie ball performance at 17 years old (1.4 ERA), and draft position (4th round), you can't possibly even think about cutting the player. It's not like a guy has to be a 1st round, top prospect or be cut. This is all ignoring the fact that my legendary scout has him rated at 5 stars, which just makes the decision that much easier.

I'll say this again. This is just one example. Even if you somehow can prove to me that this specific guy isn't worth having on your unlimited roster, that doesn't change the fact that I constantly find 2nd-5th round draft picks who are cut after one year. This never happens in real life. And I know that this is a bug and a problem because a lot of these guys will have immediate trade value as soon as I sign them. They also are sometimes ranked high on the BA top 20 prospects for my team as soon as I sign them. And they often develop into major league stars.

[injury log]

Originally Posted by olivertheorem

I wouldn't think that would be all that hard to code, but I'm not a programmer.

That's exactly what I would have thought, but apparently it requires a pretty major recode to the AI, so it's harder than you might think. But the effort would be worth it.

Originally Posted by BeancheBlanco

He throws 90-92 mph at 18 years old as a lefty. That's pretty considerable since velocity increases quite considerably in OOTP from 18-21. Sounds like he has high potential Stuff to me.

Yeah, just turn scouting off and I bet you'll see he's a 2-star guy at best.

Originally Posted by BeancheBlanco

Even if you somehow can prove to me that this specific guy isn't worth having on your unlimited roster, that doesn't change the fact that I constantly find 2nd-5th round draft picks who are cut after one year.

Understand that I agree with you; I said I find this particular problem the "biggest issue with the game's AI at the moment". The only point where we disagree is not really an important one - I'm just quite certain your scout is dramatically overrating this particular pitcher's ability, which is something that happens quite often in OOTP. That still doesn't change the fact that this guy should never ever be released by an AI team except in very unusual circumstances.

[BeancheBlanco]

Originally Posted by injury log

Yeah, just turn scouting off and I bet you'll see he's a 2-star guy at best.

Understand that I agree with you; I said I find this particular problem the "biggest issue with the game's AI at the moment". The only point where we disagree is not really an important one - I'm just quite certain your scout is dramatically overrating this particular pitcher's ability, which is something that happens quite often in OOTP. That still doesn't change the fact that this guy should never ever be released by an AI team except in very unusual circumstances.

I said it before and I'll say it again. I don't think he's a 5 star pitcher nor do I consider him even a great prospect. He's a 4th rounder who has very poor OSA ratings. 4th rounders rarely even make the major leagues. I just think he has solid potential and should definitely not be released a year after being drafted relatively high, while performing well. It sounds like that's what you are saying as well so I don't get why you keep misrepresenting me.

The only reason I even brought this guy up is that I remember targeting him in the actual draft. I was planning on taking him in the 4th round but a different team took him. I saw that he did very well as a 17 year old and I had him on my shortlist as a player to trade for since I knew he wasn't valued extremely high by the AI and so his price tag would probably be relatively low (I give the AI trade mechanics too much credit).

There are much worse cases (e.g. I found Miguel Sano in the free agents at the end of 2012. He didn't even have that bad of a 2012 season) that I could have brought up, but this one guy just happened to me when I posted it and it was weird to find a guy in the free agents who I was about to send out a trade proposal for.

[injury log]

Originally Posted by BeancheBlanco

I don't get why you keep misrepresenting me.

I didn't make any representations about what you said; no one is attacking you. I just read these comments from the perspective of a beta tester. To have data to report to Markus, we need to know how these players are truly rated, which means we need data when scouting is off.